Gibraltar is like Marmite.

[VO5]

Are you beginning to get the drift Kilter ?

 

[bendyone]

Yes, exactly.

Let me give you the flavour of it.

The other day I went to Morrison's to help my wife with the Xmas shopping...

After having processed all of it through the till, we thought we would sit in the cafeteria and have a cup of tea...

Presently a family of four of these fat and garishly dressed and very noisy ex pats came in to have breakfast. They sat at the next table. The mother wearing clothes of clashing colours, spiky hair. The father wearing a "Lonsdale" T-shirt with the sleeves cut off, arms like hams covered with tattoos, head shaved, the works, you know...

You have never seen such mountainous platefuls :~ Sausages, eggs, chips, fried bread, bacon, baked beans, toast, all piled up...plus milk shakes and Kit Cats to follow... Two very obese grown ups and two very obese children...they proceeded to demolish these mountains of food with relish, although, the table manners were atrocious...probably half the food ended up on the floor..the children with tomato sauce on their faces, hands, on the table, on their clothes, and on the floor...

And presently...the mother asked one of the children if she would like a mouse.

A mouse ? A MOUSE ?

This intrigued me no end........... I could not contain my curiosity.

She got up and went to search for the mouse....

Presently she returned triumphantly with the trophy...a strawberry mousse.

Happens over here as well.

 

[Lifeboatman]

I've spent many happy months in Gib - pre domestic restraints

happy days

 

[VO5]

Happens over here as well.

Yes, quite.

 

[Vindleka]

On the first point, the chandlery was inaccessible in that it was difficult to access. It was hard to find and we walked a fair way, through a lot of mud and building works to get there. 'Inaccessible' I think accurately describes the impression we had of it. When we did get there, the staff in it were unhelpful. The reason I mentioned both is that had the chandlery been easy to get to and the staff unhelpful, or the chandlery difficult to get to and the staff very helpful, our impression would probably have been more favourable. As it was, we had to deal with both.

On the second point. I would be very surprised if everyone did have an identical opinion. As I said, since our visit we have spoken to several yachtsmen and women who have had similar experiences and others who liked it better. That split is fairly well reflected in most posts I have read on the subject. The author of the thread also apparantly expected that reaction hence his comment: 'It seems that people either love it or hate it. No in between.' and his reference to Marmite which is often used to express the idea of polarised views.

I hope this helps you to understand the points you were confused about.

On another subject, I am intrigued as to why you have hijacked the thread, especially in such an aggressive and unpleasant way. Are you always this pompous? Do you do the same thing on other threads or just on ones about Gibraltar. It seems to have become a biased and overbearing rant about your extremely self righteous views regardless of what anybody else writes. It's a shame as other opinions from a cruising point of view would have been a lot more interesting to read (in my opinion).

 

[VO5]

On the first point, the chandlery was inaccessible in that it was difficult to access. It was hard to find and we walked a fair way, through a lot of mud and building works to get there. 'Inaccessible' I think accurately describes the impression we had of it. When we did get there, the staff in it were unhelpful. The reason I mentioned both is that had the chandlery been easy to get to and the staff unhelpful, or the chandlery difficult to get to and the staff very helpful, our impression would probably have been more favourable. As it was, we had to deal with both.

On the second point. I would be very surprised if everyone did have an identical opinion. As I said, since our visit we have spoken to several yachtsmen and women who have had similar experiences and others who liked it better. That split is fairly well reflected in most posts I have read on the subject. The author of the thread also apparantly expected that reaction hence his comment: 'It seems that people either love it or hate it. No in between.' and his reference to Marmite which is often used to express the idea of polarised views.

I hope this helps you to understand the points you were confused about.

On another subject, I am intrigued as to why you have hijacked the thread, especially in such an aggressive and unpleasant way. Are you always this pompous? Do you do the same thing on other threads or just on ones about Gibraltar. It seems to have become a biased and overbearing rant about your extremely self righteous views regardless of what anybody else writes. It's a shame as other opinions from a cruising point of view would have been a lot more interesting to read (in my opinion).

Thank you. I now understand what you mean.

Aggressive and unpleasant ? Really ? Have you read ALL of the thread or just a few posts ? When you read ALL of the posts you will evaluate how it is that the people who spend the least time in a place put their forward their opinions knowing little of what it is they are opinionating about.

If it were a thread about cruising, we would have had discussions about outlying dangers, navigational tips, meteorological pointers about the region, matters of cartographical interest, historical notes as well as lists of places to visit, sights to enjoy, dishes to try, recommended anchorages, among other topics.

Have we got any of this in this thread ?

No.

But we do have several rude and ignorant upstarts persisting with provocative one liners.

You may take veiled insults lying down, I do not.

I respond, and when I respond as merited individuals like you butt in to grumble.

It is that simple.

As you are probably conditioned not to complain, not to resist, not to challenge and not to strive, then anything of this genre to you is "pompous".

You should be so lucky to be pompous like me.

 

[Vindleka]

I don't agree

"If it were a thread about cruising, we would have had discussions about outlying dangers, navigational tips, meteorological pointers about the region, matters of cartographical interest, historical notes as well as lists of places to visit, sights to enjoy, dishes to try, recommended anchorages, among other topics."

That is an extremely pompous thing to say...

The title of the forum is 'Yachting Monthly's Scuttlebutt Chat about cruising, debate this month's hot topic, hosted by Yachting Monthly magazine.'

Just because it is a forum that concerns cruising people doesn't mean you necessarily have to talk about anything from your list above. People who go cruising in boats can also talk about many other things, even Marmite. But normally on a cruising forum the topics are explored from a cruising perspective, that was my point. If you want to rant about your perception of living a priveleged life in Gibraltar, that is obviously your prerogative. I was merely expressing an opinion about that. Neither aggressively nor unpleasantly I might add.

Yes, I have read the whole thread. Regarding your reference to 'rude and ignorant upstarts'. The post concerning drug smuggling and money laundering seemed to me to be perfectly rational subjects to bring up, especially as there has been quite a bit of news coverage on the subject over the last few years. I thought your reply was extremely aggressive and unpleasant and implied that your opinion was the only one that counted. The Spanish authorities and interior minister might not agree with you.

Later, Ariadne's post was quite reasonable and obviously reflected an opinion about Gibraltar, in the context of the original post. Your response was unreasonable and quite unpleasant. There are other examples but those illustrate why I made my comments regarding your tone. It is interesting that when people defend something with that kind of aggression, it usually indicated insecurity. I am sure that is not the case with you... just rudeness and belligerence.

And finally, I am not grumbling. I am complaining and resisting the tone of your responses. I can also tell the difference between complaining, resisting, striving and challenging - and just being downright pompous.

I will find another topic that more accurately reflects its title. Happy New Year and good luck with your neverending crusade.

 

[David_Jersey]

"
I will find another topic that more accurately reflects its title

Good luck with that

 

[jonic]

Happy New Year everybody.

Gib has to be discovered, and it takes time. What is immediately visible is at odds to what can be found.

 

[VO5]

Sometimes it takes many posts on a thread for the penny to drop.

Happy New Year everybody.

Gib has to be discovered, and it takes time. What is immediately visible is at odds to what can be found.

Excellent post. My compliments to you.

It is a hint of a start in the right direction. Thank you.

 

[jonic]

Thank you VO5.

Gib is a unique place. I can understand why some on here did not like it. Unfortunately the first time I went, I didn't like it either!

The problem is, it is small, 30,000 people in just a couple of square miles. So the good is check by jowl with the bad. The attractive right next door to the pretty ugly. It can be difficult at first glance,to appreciate the very good things that are there. But dig around and it's amazing what is behind the initial façade.

We wintered there for five months a few years ago, with our two small children and it was a really good time. Without doubt the safest place for children we have encountered so far (and that's after some 22 Islands and countries).

Marina Bay is not the best in the world (but isn't it being re-developed now?). Karl and his staff couldn't have been more helpful.

Tea at the Rock in Colonial style was fun, the House of Sacarello cake and coffe shop was excellent, we paid for a day pass a couple of times to swim at the Rock Hotel pool, the siege tunnels were very good, the Alameda Botanical Gardens were delightful, the lower cave tour (not often open to the public often) was incredible. We enjoyed Biancas at Marina Bay and the restaurant area around Queensway quay. The Royal Gibraltar Yacht Club were most accommodating, the glass blowing foundry off Casemates square was really interesting. We were even invited for an impromptu tour of the Hindu temple, and a fun night at the Casino and a Lobster dinner overlooking the straits was straight out of a Flemming novel.

We made some very good friends, including the Harbour master and his family, and the kids were spoilt rotten by the locals (free strawberries every day at the fruit market). There is no doubt that the sense of family and community is very strong.

But we had to go digging to find it. It's a richly diverse place, but it's a travellers place, don't go expecting a Disney Land experience or a glossy holiday brochure type place. ( I agree with poster about Europa point). Gib is a living, working country, and it has only recently lost some of the restraints placed on it's development by the MOD. Time spent looking under the surface will be well rewarded.

 

[VO5]

Thank you VO5.

Gib is a unique place. I can understand why some on here did not like it. Unfortunately the first time I went, I didn't like it either!

The problem is, it is small, 30,000 people in just a couple of square miles. So the good is check by jowl with the bad. The attractive right next door to the pretty ugly. It can be difficult at first glance,to appreciate the very good things that are there. But dig around and it's amazing what is behind the initial façade.

We wintered there for five months a few years ago, with our two small children and it was a really good time. Without doubt the safest place for children we have encountered so far (and that's after some 22 Islands and countries).

Marina Bay is not the best in the world (but isn't it being re-developed now?). Karl and his staff couldn't have been more helpful.

Tea at the Rock in Colonial style was fun, the House of Sacarello cake and coffe shop was excellent, we paid for a day pass a couple of times to swim at the Rock Hotel pool, the siege tunnels were very good, the Alameda Botanical Gardens were delightful, the lower cave tour (not often open to the public often) was incredible. We enjoyed Biancas at Marina Bay and the restaurant area around Queensway quay. The Royal Gibraltar Yacht Club were most accommodating, the glass blowing foundry off Casemates square was really interesting. We were even invited for an impromptu tour of the Hindu temple, and a fun night at the Casino and a Lobster dinner overlooking the straits was straight out of a Flemming novel.

We made some very good friends, including the Harbour master and his family, and the kids were spoilt rotten by the locals (free strawberries every day at the fruit market). There is no doubt that the sense of family and community is very strong.

But we had to go digging to find it. It's a richly diverse place, but it's a travellers place, don't go expecting a Disney Land experience or a glossy holiday brochure type place. ( I agree with poster about Europa point). Gib is a living, working country, and it has only recently lost some of the restraints placed on it's development by the MOD. Time spent looking under the surface will be well rewarded.

I am sorry to learn of your hangover. Try the Royal Navy remedy...Eno's Fruit salt and lots of water to drink...it works !

...And you have only skimmed the surface !

There is much more to see and do and interesting people to meet and things to enjoy.

If you plan to visit again, PM me and I will have you swept into a whirl and you will be reluctant to leave.

For example, I have known service families break into tears when their tour of duty having been completed to be told that an application for an extension had been turned down.

They still come here often, now as civilians, and they bring all their little ones as well. The lovely part is that these friendships get handed down the generations, like inheritances.

 

[Caladh]

Good grief....

A Happy New Year to you all ! I can't believe it....this thread is STILL going, promoted by you know who.

Vindleka - I believe your sentiments reflect my own so please don't let VO5 upset you. I was quite satisfied with my last remarks back sometime in December. I believe that although this post has been "interesting" in a strange sort of way, it is patently obvious that VO has some form of self security neurosis satiated by being able to freely spout off on this forum. I'll agree that discussion about sailing matters at this time of year is more taxing but there are much more pressing items of the world agenda than whether VO wants to take the Corniche out for a spin or that Miss World came from Gib.

Everyone in their place VO. Yours is Gib. Please don't let him out !

 

[David_Jersey]

Everyone in their place VO. Yours is Gib. Please don't let him out !

A certain irony in someone from a place like Hayling Island criticising anywhere else. From my brief experiences the area had a certain natural desolate charm - but overall it was kinda like going back to 1970's Margate visually, infrastructure, services and people - but without the same glamour or excitement .

If the South Coast of England is meant to be the prosperous part, then Christ knows what Norfolk is like . or how grim it is ooop North

 

[Kilter]

A certain irony in someone from a place like Hayling Island criticising anywhere else. From my brief experiences the area had a certain natural desolate charm - but overall it was kinda like going back to 1970's Margate visually, infrastructure, services and people - but without the same glamour or excitement .

If the South Coast of England is meant to be the prosperous part, then Christ knows what Norfolk is like . or how grim it is ooop North

It's bloomin' cold oop North otherwise not too bad thanks!

 

[David_Jersey]

It's bloomin' cold oop North otherwise not too bad thanks!

My apologies for misspelling "oop".

 

[Kilter]

My apologies for misspelling "oop".

It was your only mistake!

 

[VO5]

...Wonder who it is ....

Marmite thief's got station licked

The Northampton Chronicle & Echo reports.....

They say you either love it or hate it and one thief showed his affection for opinion-splitting vegetable extract Marmite by stealing every single jar from a petrol station's shelves – forcing it to stop selling the product.
The snack is no longer available from the W Grose garage in Queens Park Parade, Kingsthorpe, after a spate of thefts.

The suspect even returned after his biggest haul to snatch the two remaining jars.

Station manager, Jim Keary, said: "We have had quite a few problems with shoplifters, one man had everything off the shelves and he came back for more.

'He then came back for two jars of Marmite that he had left behind.

"We have stopped selling Marmite now because of this. What's the point in selling something, if every time you stock it – it gets stolen?"

A spokesman for Northamptonshire Police said: "We would appeal to anyone who knows this man to come forward and contact the police.

"We work closely with local garages to reduce crime and catch offenders."

 

[sk8rboy]

We spent three days in Gibralter after a road trip through Spain and Portugal. We had such a difficult time trying to get in! We drove up and down three times, felt forced into an illegal u turn and promptly got stopped and fined by the Spanish police who gladly took our last 63 euros from us.

The relief we felt at arriving in a place akin to Portsmouth circa 1980 was enormous. We traipsed around trying to find an affordable hotel for us and I was shocked at some of the dated, grimy rooms we were shown. We ended up at the Bristol Hotel where we were given a reduced rate for a family room after I told the manager about our fine at the border.

We went out for a meal later and it was a bit seedy along Main Street but the young man who served us was beautifully polite and chatty. The hotel receptionist (looks like Miss World's older sister) was totally charming. Being of the poor unwashed masses, we took our laundry down to a launderette at the marina and again, helpful, polite, informative.

We then discovered a photo/postcard shop which had copies of old ships photos and the owner helped us locate a copy of HMS Calpe coming into Gib during WWII on which my partner's (now deceased) father had been stationed at the time. Again another lovely interaction. We couldn't really afford to do much in the way of tours but we walked around as much as we could and loved it.

When people ask me what I think about Gibralter I do say I loved it but I am a little apologetic because I can see why someone would be put off by those first impressions of Main Street.

VO5 - I think you are absolutely not a gentleman, I have an image of you and your wife guffawing away, totally unbecoming. So glad I didn't come across you. It would have spoiled our impression of Gibralter.

 

[VO5]

We spent three days in Gibralter after a road trip through Spain and Portugal. We had such a difficult time trying to get in! We drove up and down three times, felt forced into an illegal u turn and promptly got stopped and fined by the Spanish police who gladly took our last 63 euros from us.

The relief we felt at arriving in a place akin to Portsmouth circa 1980 was enormous. We traipsed around trying to find an affordable hotel for us and I was shocked at some of the dated, grimy rooms we were shown. We ended up at the Bristol Hotel where we were given a reduced rate for a family room after I told the manager about our fine at the border.

We went out for a meal later and it was a bit seedy along Main Street but the young man who served us was beautifully polite and chatty. The hotel receptionist (looks like Miss World's older sister) was totally charming. Being of the poor unwashed masses, we took our laundry down to a launderette at the marina and again, helpful, polite, informative.

We then discovered a photo/postcard shop which had copies of old ships photos and the owner helped us locate a copy of HMS Calpe coming into Gib during WWII on which my partner's (now deceased) father had been stationed at the time. Again another lovely interaction. We couldn't really afford to do much in the way of tours but we walked around as much as we could and loved it.

When people ask me what I think about Gibralter I do say I loved it but I am a little apologetic because I can see why someone would be put off by those first impressions of Main Street.

VO5 - I think you are absolutely not a gentleman, I have an image of you and your wife guffawing away, totally unbecoming. So glad I didn't come across you. It would have spoiled our impression of Gibralter.