Genoa cars positioning

The Lazy Kipper said:
No sh!t sherlock :D

I was asking if they had any additional effect on weather helm Roger
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Small extra effect relating to the balance between main and genoa ie if the main is well sheeted in and the genoa badly sheeted and not drawing well then there would be an effect but between one track hole and another you would not notice.
 
Jib sheet cars

If I used a roller reefing jib I would certainly fit lines to tow the cars forward and back. Or use bungee for one direction. Because I sue individual jibs I don't find it a difficulty to move the jib car to a new marked position.
However regarding reaching. I have used an additional light jib sheet using a pulley on the gunwhale and well forward of the normal sheeting position. This enables the jib to be sheeted further off centre and forward. This is ideal for reaching and also makes the jib more inclined to set in a stable manner when running. The lighter sheet is easy to manage because you are not sheeting tight and when beating using the normal sheet and cars the light sheet is left loose and does not impede tacking.

A similar additional sheet set on another car on the track could be used to pull the clew down and forward like moving the car but you would need some way of getting tension on it while maintaining tension on the main sheet. Worth an experiment.
I do a lot of race in very close quarters while beating. In this situation every bit of performance to windward is vital and you must have sheeting position just right. On a little boat it is awkward and dangerous trying to move the leeward sheet car let alone single handed. good luck olewill
 
LittleSister said:
I don't think anyone has actually answered the OP's query which, as I read it, was what is the best general position for the car if you are NOT going to move each time. I'd certainly like to know the answer.
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Mine are normally set for best efficiency when beating, which I think was mentioned by several earlier posters. Set this by reference to the telltales, which I describe above. I mark mine so I can always return to them if I happen to move the cars.
 
LittleSister said:
I don't think anyone has actually answered the OP's query which, as I read it, was what is the best general position for the car if you are NOT going to move each time. I'd certainly like to know the answer.
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On most masthead rig boats with a fairly large genoa never moving the cars is usually a bonus for sailmakers - you will ruin the sail quicker.

If you really can't be bothered moving the car set it up right for a beat, and oversheet when offwind to stop the upper leech flapping. You will sail substantially slower but won't be doing the sail that much harm.
 
jwilson said:
On most masthead rig boats with a fairly large genoa never moving the cars is usually a bonus for sailmakers - you will ruin the sail quicker.
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Don't I know it! Our genoa had so suffered when we got the boat - not so bad that it's yet made it to the top of the 'must get' list, but bad enough to defy all attempts to make the sail set properly by moving the car - hence my interest in the question!

jwilson said:
If you really can't be bothered moving the car set it up right for a beat, and oversheet when offwind to stop the upper leech flapping. You will sail substantially slower but won't be doing the sail that much harm.
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Just what I wanted to know! Thanks to you, Vyv and all.
 
jimi said:
So does my old Moody ;-)
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Moody? I thought you had some kind of Bav. Moving up in the world!

My Moody also has them, and I would never want to be without them again. I am not exactly an ace sail trimmer, but sheet lead angle is, even for me, an essential, a fundamental sail control. The wrong sheet lead angle shows itself with either foot or leech being too tight or too loose and an obviously - even to me - wrong sail shape. On my previous boat, I wore callouses on my knees from crawling forward to adjust the jib cars. Every time you change the sheet tension or reef or unreel the headsail requires an adjustment of the sheeting angle, in my opinion, even if you are a less than racing calibre sail trimmer, like me. I cannot even imagine what one's sails must look like, if the jib cars are 'set and forgotten'.
 
There have been numerous posts here about "setting it for a beat."

And others that mention the differences between beating, reaching and running. Of course one needs to move the fairlead forward if reefing a large headsail or else the head fo the jib opens up way too much.

The reality is that on a beat, the "required" position of the jib fairlead will change based on the wind strength, too. That's why the movable jib sheet cars are so popular with racers. I have seen these in use on friends' boats, and the better sailors tend to use all the "tricks & tips" they can to get the most out of their headsails.

Those friends have 130% jibs, the max size allowed in our one design racing fleet. I get a handicap for our 110% jib. Because of the geometry of my headsail and the track, my fairlead for our 110 jib uses the most forward position on the track to get the best position - I can't move it anymore forward, nor does it make sense to move it aft since I'd lose drive at the head of the jib (and I never use the furler to reef that small a headsail - in windy conditions, like here during the summer, I use my 85% jib). The clews of both of my jibs are quite high (good visibility forward) but if I had a decksweeper 110 jib I would have to add more track forward to get the right sheeting angle or would have to buy a larger jib to move the clew aft to be able to use the existing track.

And if I did that, then I'd surely get the movable cars. Garhauer, a California company that makes great blocks, has a very affordable system. They make blocks for Catalina OEM.

So, I'm not a candidate for the movable cars, but I fully understand their use. Most of my racing friends also have both inner and gunwhale tracks and they use them both (two jib sheets on each side).
 
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My opinion is that there is a world of difference between the requirements of racing and cruising boats. By the latter I mean ones on which the boat is lived on at anchor or in port for a greater length of time than it is sailed. I have been a very competitive racer, using all the devices available. These made the boat sail faster in the usual wide range of conditions but were mostly very inconvenient for anybody not racing.

Towable genoa cars, towable cars on mainsheet tracks and the like become uncomfortable obstacles to walking about the boat, and especially sitting down on it. So I put up with the minor inconvenience of plunger track stops in each case for the far greater convenience of living without tripping over lines and sitting on cam cleats.
 
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