Fully Battened Mains and mast tracks.

Courageous

Courageous

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www.courageous.it
Hi there - am looking to swap my in mast main setup for a fully battened main and have been exploring the replacement spar costs only to find them expensive considering my existing setup is only 7 years old. I'm sure I've read somewhere that fully battened mains when coupled to a stack pack arrangement utilise a system of cars on a track to facilitate easier sliding? Have any of you guys come across this system and if so can you place me on the appropriate track (hehe!)
 
Yes

2 years ago Fitted a fully battened main to my old proctor mast (boats a 40 ft sloop) using cars that ran up the bolt rope groove. normal slugs for intermediates and cars with rollers for batons (name began with R) worked brilliantly and not hideosly expensive. I think total cost for main and cars @ 1700 from McWilliams

Due to stupid accident then bent mast and now have antal track on reckman mast with cars.
Track fitted @500.
cars batten @48
cars intermediate @28
headboard @70
marginally better but main goes up easily for both and comes down easily (like a guilotine with the new one) as long as boat head to wind.
With lazy jacks main comes down on its own and requires no immediate attention. A far cry from 50ft of bolt rope on the deck and 2 trying to flake it. Best thing we ever did.
red
 
Hi Red - thanks for the prompt reply. I shall try a search for mcwilliams but in the meantime if you have any contact details that would be great. I guess I'll have to get the track option since I dont have a bolt rope track as it's in mast.

Cheers
 
A dozen manufacturers make 'systems' for this function.
Try the websites of hardware manufacturers. e.g. Harken, Rutgerson, Facnor, Lewmar and/or speak to any mainstream sailmaker.

Similarly, have a look at the ads in the racing-oriented sailing mags - Seahorse, Yots and Yotting - and/or do a Google search.

....Finally, and perhaps the best option, go along to the LBS, speak to the manufacturers/distributors, and see their products.

As your avatar shows 'you' ( ? ) posing as 'ze pilote weeth ze big red noze', you will appreciate that a fully-battened main should give you upwards of 10% more Specific Thrust for no increase in Specific Fuel Consumption. So you can afford to invest some of your huge fuel-efficiency bonus in this late 20th century innovation.

Downside? A fair bit heavier, so consider effects on your Stability Profile - especially if you also have fitted headsail(s)roller furling gear, upmast radar, and other top-heavy goodies..... You won't want to get outside your C of G Control Authority, will you?

Also, there is the (occasional) embarassment of being unable to stop all the thrust from the sail, unless it is dropped fully. Like being at Flight Idle all the time...

Multihullers have used such systems for decades. Friction, on many systems ( especially 'aftermarket' ), is a hazard. They will tell you it is VIP that you arrange your system so as to be able to pull down the mainsail when you *need* to. Otherwise, an 'uncommanded departure' may result......
 
Hehe - thanx Bilbo!!

"As your avatar shows 'you' ( ? ) posing as 'ze pilote weeth ze big red noze', you will appreciate that a fully-battened main should give you upwards of 10% more Specific Thrust "

No sails on me company vehicle but I t'ink I nose where ya comin' from!!!

All good advise Thanks - yes the top heavy aspect of this is a small worry since I shall have to retain the gubbins in the mast I guess (Or is it possible to remove this without sacrificing the strength?) although the sail won't be living there anymore so there will be times when the cofg is lower than normal.....
 
Des McWilliams in Ireland (UKHarken) VERY prompt in responding to my email and coincidentally fed me through to tidesmarine BUT they cannot provide a track suitable for a mast with in mast furling...... Still looking!!!
 
Had Facnor track fitted to my old Selden mast three years ago. Did this to avoid the kind of cars that use the existing internal track and thus obtained a system with cars using recirculating balls. Has been a great success. The fully battened main and all fittings including the track were supplied and fitted by Crusader Sails. Work was done quickly and competantly and at a reasonable cost. It might be an idea to discuss your case with Paul at Crusader sails if you are located in the South. Difficult to tell from your personal details.
 
Strongly second the poster who gave a link to TidesMarine. Fitted their system last spring. Less than $900 for my 40 footer including all hardware. 2000 miles under the keel since and VERY VERY happy.
 
Fredericksen make a slider that runs up the aft face of the existing mast.
uses recirculating balls + a slug that fits into the existing track retaining the car in place.
i have these & there very good, not cheap but good. fitted 6 seasons ago still as good as new, the sailmaker recons a set of cars will outlast 3 or 4 sails
 
Don't know what sort of raggie-machine you've got, or where it sits, but you may care to speak to Charlie Hutton at Atlantic Spars, in DratMouth.

If he doesn't know how to sort out what you need, you're stuffed! And BTW, he has a good 'satisfied client list'.
 
Our new boat has f/b main, cars & stackpack, and so far they seem to be the mutt's nuts. One minor note - you need a gate in the slot to allow the cars to be removed. I was warned by the previous owner that this can be a bit of an ache in the rectum to fit/remove, and that I would need plenty of spare screws, 'cos several would go AWOL down the mast during the operation. Sure enough, when I took it off a couple o weeks ago, one disappeared down the mast...
 
If you\'re referring to Frederiksen

you'll find they only make gear for smaller boats (usually dinghies and the Hobie cats).

Rutgerson are the best-known name in batten cars, but are quite expensive and really only for smaller boats.

At the heavier end and used by most of the big racing boats are Bainbrige Aquabatten or Harken.

If you're going for a fully battened main I'd urge you to think well outside the square.

The fully-battened main costs about 80% more than its part-battened alternative. Unless you increase your roach to take advantage of the additional support, you'll short-change yourself. You can easily overlap your backstay by 12" (my Med main does so by about 24" and only sometimes has to be "helped" across).

Because a fully battened main produces more drive and less heel than a comparable main, it's very difficult to de-power. This brings in the need for an additional reef - I've now got 4 with the 1st reef as a single line reef.

The pro's also include about twice the useful life of a conventional sail, more drive and less heeling force, and the ability to get to windward in light airs (with main alone you'll tack through about 70 degrees).

There are cons, apart from the greater cost, wear on spreader ends, especially with swept spreaders, an inability to depower it in gusts, greater weight to lift when setting sai and a chance of overstressing mainsheet, gooseneck boom or mast.

If, as I assume, you're modifying an in-mast system, you'll have to replace your boom (to get the reefing pennants in) as well as the mast track. I'd recommend having it loose footed with at least 3 reefing points. Look at the Rutgerson pennant eyes - they have a built-in pulley and reduce friction dramatically.

If you sail much having a fully-battened main is well worth the cost, the problem of getting it up can always be mitigated by having a power halyard winch.
 
Re: If you\'re referring to Frederiksen

[you'll find they only make gear for smaller boats (usually dinghies and the Hobie cats).] /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

Fredericksen

Batten Car systems to 23 metres L o/a
Velsheda fitted with series 200 & 300 cars

Whitbread 60s use thier deck gear

What do you call "small" /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif
 
Re: If you\'re referring to Frederiksen

Thanx guys - Charles some good points but "reefing pennants?" Going to show my ignorance here and ask what this is about and why boom replacement? My existing setup is already loose footed of course, the boom having a useful track on it already and co-incidentally has a pair of conventional reefing horns as I guess the boom may have been modified for some reason at some stage in it's life. Will this boom not do me then or can it not be modded to suit?

Cheers
 
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