Fuel tank cleaning-engine stopping due dirt in filter

[Seacracker]

Hi everyone,
Can anyone help with this problem please?
On my boat I have a 19 gallon fuel tank which, apart from the filler tube, the fuel off take to the engine (gravity fed which is about 1 inch above the tank bottom), and... a drain point at the bottom of the tank, has no other access available what so ever.
On several occasions entering the lock at my home port Liverpool after a 'bouncy' sail, on throttling back, the engine cuts out.... not pleasant entering a crowded lock I can tell you! The engine starts again readily enough fortunately! On checking the primary fuel filter (it's an 'old' type with a removable and cleanable gauze filter), I have found loads of blackish bits in it.
Problem, how to remove these bits from the tank to avoid these problems in the future. At the moment the tank has about 15 gallons in it. The only way I can think of is to drain the tank completely and then bung some more diesel in to wash it out through the drain point.
Any thoughts, help, or advice would be most welcome.
Chris

 

[PetiteFleur]

Firstly, is it possible to drain/pump out the diesel and then remove the tank to clean it? This sounds the easiest solution, but I accept it may not be possible - on my previous boat you would have had to remove the engine first!
If you can't remove the tank then you'll have to pump it out insitu, perhaps after agitation with an air pump, perhaps a hose pushed down the filler hose and lots of blowing?
Then refill, perhaps repeat a couple of times, and then I suggest you fit a better primary filter.
Good luck anyway.

 

[OAF]

this sound so very familiar!

I to berth in liverpool at the moment and my last trip out saw one of my engines stop due to dirt in my fuel, my tanks cant be removed easily and there is no access in to them, they are both full to the brim, 700ltrs

To over come my problem in the short term i have changed all of my filters and when my tanks are nearly empty i will undo my drain bungs and agitate the fuel by running fresh fuel through the tanks until it runs clear.

good luck

 

[gardenshed]

Your choices are either

empty and clean your tank
or
remove empty and clean your tank

and then fit a pre filter with a drain and clear bowl under it so that you can monitor the quality of fuel leaving your tank and to to protect your main filter.

2 in parallel with valves to allow you to switch over would be best.

I changed my pre filter this winter to a "RACOR FILTER 120 SPINON SEE THRO BOWL". Thought about 2 in parallel but probaly overkill.
Luckily my tank can come out quite easily, but it is a pain and very messy to empty it and dispose of the dirty old fuel that was in it (looked like engine oil).

 

[PetiteFleur]

Your choices are either

Luckily my tank can come out quite easily, but it is a pain and very messy to empty it and dispose of the dirty old fuel that was in it (looked like engine oil).

I had to get rid of about 40 litres of dirty fuel a few years ago and the council took it away for free! Not sure who collected it - they didn't look like regular council employees! Not sure it would happen nowadays.....

 

[Tintin]

I had a big diesel bug problem last year - didn't know I had it until about a quarter of the way into a solo passage from Plymouth to Falmouth with the wind on the nose so engine running and a choppy sea to shake it all up.

Anyway after 8 cleans of all the supply pipework and filters I eventually made Falmouth.

I tried a well known enzyme product but still had the problem due to the large amount of build up in the tank.

Eventually a marine engineer in Falmouth came up with a solution other than an expensive engine removal to get the tank out.

He had a rig made up that sucked the fuel out with a high speed fuel pump, filtered it through two stages and returned it to the tank. It took him two hours and I think 4 changes of filters (ouch £££). We then treated the cleaned fuel with the enzyme treatment again and so far have had no further problems.

I was unable to get good access to the tank to drain and steam clean and taking it out was a mammoth job - the filter / pump rig did the job at a cost that was probably far less than any other option - very impressed.

regards
chris

 

[JohnTH]

The pump is the way to go, the process is called fuel polishing I understand. Any way, it is easy to build a rig to do the job and, once built, it is useful for other things too.

A friend recently put petrol into his diesel car. It was easy to take a fuel line off and suck (contaminated ?) fuel from the tank. Remember to take the filler cap off or make sure the vent is clear.

Decanting fuel from a drum is very easy and clean, just suck it from the drum and squirt it into your boat.

Put on a proper hand trigger , like the ones at the pumps, and you will wonder how you managed without this handy device.

Mine works on 240 volts but, of course, 12 volt pump are available.

73s de
Johnth

 

[hlb]

You've got the bug. Easy way to get rid of it. is to dose the tank with Soltron and change filters. Use as much fuel as possible and repeat.

 

[Refueler]

I've talked about this many times on here and my advise is to circulate the fuel as hard as possible.

If you get a drill pump or similar - you can suck out and pump back - basically stirring it all up and lifting the crud of the bottom. This crud is common and many boats go about with it and never realise it's there. But later diesels have solvents and all sorts of components in the blends that are tending to lift these hard solids of tank bottoms. Bouncing around at sea of course helps this.

Stirring it all up allows you to pump out the mix and then let it settle ... syphoning of the clean settled fuel.

When tank is near empty .. stop pumping out ... now you want to use a vacuum jobbie such as a Pela Oil extractor to really suck the bottom crud out.

Ok - another idea - which I use ... is to rig up a domestic water filter of maximum 5 micron ... this is in the circulation line. Basically what you are now doing is to stir up the tank ... lifting the crud, sucking it out, passing it through the filter and back to tank ... Continual circulation will lift more crud .. filter taking it out etc. When you get to reasonable visual state of diesel ( use clear plastic lines ) ... you then pump out to containers and let stand to settle. Leaving a small amount in bottom of tank to use that Pela to suck out stubborn crud.

On the to the Pela machine ... these have a narrow gauge flexi tube for inserting via oil dipstick tube. This is no good for this job. I use a larger alloy tube of about 5mm ID connected to plastic pipe ... this then connected to DIY fitting in the blank plug of Pela container. The alloy tube allows larger particulate to travel up tube, it's alloy so I can poke it into all corners / areas ... using the blank plug to fit it - leaves me still with oil drain tube fittings.

One word of caution - Over counter Injector Cleaners etc. are solvents and increase the possibility of lifting crud out of tank bottoms ...

 

[Refueler]

You've got the bug. Easy way to get rid of it. is to dose the tank with Soltron and change filters. Use as much fuel as possible and repeat.

Sweeping statement that ... it is just as likely NOT the bug ...

Read my later post and also the lots I've made before about it ..

 

[Refueler]

To all those that dispose of 'dirty fuel' - Why ? There is no need to.

Diesel fuel will settle out quite readily and even if a touch coloured is no problem. You can use dinky little filters available in car acc. shops, domestic water filters ... lots of ways to filter ....

I have 200 litre drums in my barn that I mix some real cr*p fuels into ... I then pump through filters to clean it of worst ... let it settle and then gravity run of via filter to containers to fuel up my boat ... colour of fuel ? Chocolate brown. Where do I get this rubbish from ? Blending ops for EU market Diesel fuels !

Fuel filter on my engine ... Perkins 4-107 standard fit .... I change maybe annually if I remember !

 

[anth0ne1]

Hi everyone,
Can anyone help with this problem please?
On my boat I have a 19 gallon fuel tank which, apart from the filler tube, the fuel off take to the engine (gravity fed which is about 1 inch above the tank bottom), and... a drain point at the bottom of the tank, has no other access available what so ever.
On several occasions entering the lock at my home port Liverpool after a 'bouncy' sail, on throttling back, the engine cuts out.... not pleasant entering a crowded lock I can tell you! The engine starts again readily enough fortunately! On checking the primary fuel filter (it's an 'old' type with a removable and cleanable gauze filter), I have found loads of blackish bits in it.
Problem, how to remove these bits from the tank to avoid these problems in the future. At the moment the tank has about 15 gallons in it. The only way I can think of is to drain the tank completely and then bung some more diesel in to wash it out through the drain point.
Any thoughts, help, or advice would be most welcome.
Chris

I've just cleaned my tank, had no access except though the level sender.
Found the tank bottom and wall was covered in black crud.
left some diesel in a glass to settle overnight, found black bits in suspension.
What I did was:

Isolate tank from engine
Removed diesel with stirup pump.
Poured bleach in the tank.
Then blasted it with a high pressure washer.
Its dirty, long winded. Took me 2 days in all.
but it worked!!!

Added biocide along with new fuel.

 

[Manuel]

First you need to find out what those 'blackish bits' are or it might keep happening. Maybe some rubber from a hose somewhere? You can clean the fuel on board by pumping through a filter and returning to the tank. A pain but do-able. If it isn't gungy it almost certainly isn't a bug so don't drain your bank account into the chemical makers' pockets. If it is a local supply problem then others will have the same problem.

 

[1955patric]

I had a big diesel bug problem last year - didn't know I had it until about a quarter of the way into a solo passage from Plymouth to Falmouth with the wind on the nose so engine running and a choppy sea to shake it all up.

Anyway after 8 cleans of all the supply pipework and filters I eventually made Falmouth.

I tried a well known enzyme product but still had the problem due to the large amount of build up in the tank.

Eventually a marine engineer in Falmouth came up with a solution other than an expensive engine removal to get the tank out.

He had a rig made up that sucked the fuel out with a high speed fuel pump, filtered it through two stages and returned it to the tank. It took him two hours and I think 4 changes of filters (ouch £££). We then treated the cleaned fuel with the enzyme treatment again and so far have had no further problems.

I was unable to get good access to the tank to drain and steam clean and taking it out was a mammoth job - the filter / pump rig did the job at a cost that was probably far less than any other option - very impressed.

regards
chris

I had the same problem this year. I made a fuel polishing system from items bought on ebay i.e a high capacity pump and 2 x 10" filters in series one of 50 microns and one of 5 microns connected via suitable hoses. In order to circulate the tank I removed the fuel sender unit to provide access to the front of the tank and the fuel filler hose to return it to the aft end of the tank. After a couple of hours and several filter changes I substituted the 5 micron filter element with a 1 micron element and circulated for a further 10 minutes. After finishing I added a dose of bug killer and refilled the tank. I've had no problems since4. Total cost of the pump, filter elemnts and hoses was around £100 - and I have the kit for the next time it happens. The system will only work effectively if you can get a reasonably high flow rate and can agitate the return hose to wash any adhering muck from the tank walls and on to the pump suction

 

[hlb]

Sweeping statement that ... it is just as likely NOT the bug ...

Read my later post and also the lots I've made before about it ..

The most common problem of filters repeatedly blocking in small boats in my experience, is fuel bug, tanks are generally baffled, so no amount of stering up is going to get every where. Though I'm not saying it should not be tried.

The boats prone to fuel bug, are those with little use. Though I've had it a few times, with well above average use. Still very low by road or comercial standards.

The boat in front of me has it, I'm sure, big tanks and only goes about 12 miles, maybe once a month, through the summer. Came back on one engine yesterday, blocked filter, knew nothing about fuel bug, but had tanks cleaned a while ago. But it's a newish boat.

The way to deal with fuel bug, is first understand it, at the first hint of trouble, deal with it, treat with Soltron or similar, change filters and keep spares. Sort it before the problem becomes serious.

 

[Poignard]

I cleaned my 12 gallon s/s tank [also with no inspection plate] using a hired wallpaper steam stripper. I connected the stripper hose to the tank and steamed it for 2 days, frequently moving the tank into different positions. Initially the water came out with a lot of black gunge in it and after 2 days it was clean.

To get rid off the remaining water I swilled the tank out with isopropyl alcohol.

That was many years ago and I've had no fuel trouble since. I change the engine fuel filters every winter but they don't look dirty.

 

[Refueler]

I cleaned my 12 gallon s/s tank [also with no inspection plate] using a hired wallpaper steam stripper. I connected the stripper hose to the tank and steamed it for 2 days, frequently moving the tank into different positions. Initially the water came out with a lot of black gunge in it and after 2 days it was clean.

To get rid off the remaining water I swilled the tank out with isopropyl alcohol.

That was many years ago and I've had no fuel trouble since. I change the engine fuel filters every winter but they don't look dirty.

Excellent idea ... ...

Only bit that I think was overkill - but then I don't know your tank ... is the Iso-Alco .... If you get the tank hot with the steam - yes it condenses as it cools - but a good air-pump straight after steam should clear it well while the metal is still hot.

Bit like carburettors ... wash in hot water - then heat of metal dries them for you ...

 

[Refueler]

The most common problem of filters repeatedly blocking in small boats in my experience, is fuel bug, tanks are generally baffled, so no amount of stering up is going to get every where. Though I'm not saying it should not be tried.

The boats prone to fuel bug, are those with little use. Though I've had it a few times, with well above average use. Still very low by road or comercial standards.

The boat in front of me has it, I'm sure, big tanks and only goes about 12 miles, maybe once a month, through the summer. Came back on one engine yesterday, blocked filter, knew nothing about fuel bug, but had tanks cleaned a while ago. But it's a newish boat.

The way to deal with fuel bug, is first understand it, at the first hint of trouble, deal with it, treat with Soltron or similar, change filters and keep spares. Sort it before the problem becomes serious.

I of course know nothing about Micro-Bio or treatments for it ...

 

[Poignard]

Excellent idea ... ...

Only bit that I think was overkill - but then I don't know your tank ... is the Iso-Alco .... If you get the tank hot with the steam - yes it condenses as it cools - but a good air-pump straight after steam should clear it well while the metal is still hot.

Bit like carburettors ... wash in hot water - then heat of metal dries them for you ...

_____________________________________________________

Well you are right [as usual] but I use isopropyl alcohol in my work: for removing residual water from metal components to prevent corrosion after cleaning them in water based solution. As I had it in stock anyway, it seemed worthwhile chucking a cupful in the tank and swilling it around to remove the last traces of water. Meths would have done just as well if I had had some but hang the expense - this is my boat we are talking about and nothing is too good for her!

It must have worked because I installed a Racor filter/seperater when i refitted the tank and I have never had any water in the seperater bowl.