From Dart to Plymouth - Optimum tide time?

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scopas

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Hi - Just checking to see if anyone has some advice on the passage from Dartmouth to Plymouth - we are going this weekend at some point and I want to check my understanding reference best time to leave etc.. I was looking at the tidal stream atlas and it seems to suggest best time to leave Dartmouth would be Dover HW -1:40 which means leaving dartmouth at pretty much low tide. All this seems a little counter intuitive so just wanted to check what you guys thought? Don't really want to battle against the tide round start point if I can help it.

Thanks in advance guys

Matthew
 
That's not right

HW Dart is Dover -0510
So HW Dart say 0800 then HW Dover is 1310
If Westerly stream starts say Dover -0140 = 1130

As it is pretty slack before then I'd leave a hour or so after HW
 
OK So I was right to be confused! 2008 Reeds Almanac states (p36) The SW-going ebb 2.2kn max @ springs, begins at HW Dover -0140 - Strange..

All my tidal flow charts are down on the boat and all I have is this almanac to try and plan the passage and it has confused the hell out of me now!!

Perhaps you guys can help me??
 
Thanks Guys - I take it you are referring to High Tide at Dartmouth not Dover - sorry to be so thick but my yachtmasters from 10 years ago is but a distant dream and I am a little rusty.
 
OK Guys, I have the tidal stream atlas now - found it at the front of the alamac - DURRR. The West bound flow starts around Dartmouth at HW DOVER or 20 mins before. Which on Saturday is 11.43 This is actually 5 hours after HT Dartmouth which is at 06:33. /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif So by going with what I can see I am planning to leave Dartmouth at about 1100. I am concerned about the overfalls off Start Point as I will have my youngsters with me and don't want to make them puke too much!
 
Looking at this weekends forcast it looks quite dismal, just delayed our launch from Dartside Quay on Friday AM & from what I here I'm not alone.

With the Spring tides & predicted 27mph northerley winds I would carefully pick your departure time to avoid wind against tide.
Gales predicted on Metcheck.
Guess we shouldn't expect anything less for a Bank holiday /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif
 
With all due respect to the Eastcoasters (who know more than a thing or two about tides), I will attempt to explain the apparent anomaly. The ebb does indeed start around HW Dover -0140, which is about HW Dartmouth +0330. The reason local wisdom suggests leaving Dartmouth around LW is so that there is still some ebb to get you round once you have made the nine or ten miles to a point somewhere South of the headland, BUT by the time you are off Salcombe, there will be enough flood tide over the bar since it turns a bit earlier inshore, thus giving you both the option of a refuge port, or returning to Dartmouth on the flood if things go tits up. The tides don't really impact on an offshore passage as they most certainly do on the East coast.

I will be the first to admit this is not conventional RYA stuff.

That said, you might just get away with it on Saturday as the meteo stands at present, but I would be in the pub.

[As in fact I will, on the East coast, if any of you are in the vicinity of the Orwell/Stour/Backwaters]

Best regards. Mor Margh.
 
Dart entance to Start point 9 NM.
Assuming your average speed approx 6knots.

Departure 9.30, 3hrs after HW Dart (Sat 22nd March) or 2hrs before HW Dover, against approx 1knot of tide to Start Point,so reaching SP at approx 11.30 (HW Dover).

"Extract from Reed's 2008"
The SW-going ebb 2.2kn max @ springs begins at HWD -140, but an hour earlier it is possible to round Strart point close inshore on a back eddy.
It also sudgests "there is no clear-cut inshore passage as such", in bad weather keep at least 2M off!

Tidal atlas shows faverouble tides once past SP which could see you home in Plymouth in around 3.5hrs.

So yes I would probably be out between 8.30 & 9.30.

Should be a lively sail though this Saturday, 2 miles off Start point in predicted 20mph, force 5 Northerlies, not something I would be contemplating.
 
[ QUOTE ]
Should be a lively sail though this Saturday, 2 miles off Start point in predicted 20mph, force 5 Northerlies, not something I would be contemplating.



[/ QUOTE ] Interesting to read your take on it. I have never found the overfalls off Start to be anywhere near as bad as those off some other points (St Albans' or the Lizeard for example.) Also if the wind is Northerly, I would be tucking myself close inshore to cut the corner, and get some shelter. The bumpy bit is quite small inshore, and the dangers are few from memory. Its not wind against tide if the wind really is from the North.
 
We are relaunching tomorrow too, so I am interested in these musings. John, I agree with you that although the winds look lively, Northerlies should make the Passage Dart to Ply quite fast. the shelter from the coast should make the sea relatively flat and the winds good for a swift passage. Any Westing might be an issue of Start. Mind you, it looks as though we will all have to wrap up and hope that the Holy Ebby keeps working down below, especially for all the young crew on board. If things are too hairy, we will seek shelter inshore and go to the swimming pool!
 
I started sailing in the Bristol Channel where tides dictate what direction i.e. down channel/upchannel you can go.Off the south coast of Devon in optimum weather conditions I never worry about the tidal flows unduly.If they are with me they are if not they aren't.Given the forecast on Saturday it is all a bit Outwardboundish by the look of it.I think I would stay in the pub if the forecast stays the same.To save doing Yachtmaster style sums I can recommend the Reeve Foulkes tidal atlas.It enables you to do tidal stream and height calculations more or less at a glance and is IMHO far easier to use than Reeds or Tidal Diamonds.Whatever happens have a good Easter! /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
 
Agreed, sheltered closer in with northerlies but Metcheck are predicting Gales throughout Friday & Saturday, seastate maybe slightly confused, the reeds recomendation is to be at least 2M off in bad weather.

Sure some wouldn't think too much of the conditions & wouldn't call the forcast bad, but with a young crew aboard?
I wouldn't want to them to endure a less than enjoyable passage.

Never experienced force 5's off Start point so perhaps I shouldn't pass comment but Iv'e always been cautious.

Have an enjoyable sail, I may regret postponing our launch after the weekend but at the moment we are happy with our decision.

At the moment Monday looks to be a better day.
We will be at the boat over the weekend to do some cleaning & small maintenance tasks so all not lost, have a great Easter weekend /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
 
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