Found a boat, but could do with some help !!!

[Divemaster1]

Well... SWMBO has set her heart to the images of her, so are arranging for a trip to Spain soon .... I think.

Trouble is that I set my mind to (after our week on a chartered Nimbus 4000 in Norway) look for fibreglass flybridge @ 45 - 50ft range.

My dearest decided to open her mind somewhat and have found that if one accepts something a bit more mature, one could find a fully refurbished, re-conditioned engines, fully equipped 18 - 22 M boat, which is seriously big in my mind.

So here's the question to the forum:

Have anyone got views on or experience with Italian Built, Mahogny Marine Ply, mid 70's boats in this size range?

In particular, the one she has set her mind to is a Baglietto 20M, with fully re-conditioned engines, stripped and re-varnished interior, new interior cushions etc., in 2000. Very favourable Hull, Superstructure and Engine Reports. Looking very nice indeed, with full coding for charter (in private ownership & not chartered, so have questioned that). I have little experience with Marine Ply on strenght, maintenance etc. My experience has been with more modern, fibreglass boats up to 50 ft, so would appreciate any input from the forum...



<hr width=100% size=1>Alf

 

[tcm]

Re: Big is best

Not any experience of wood hulls as you describe.

But have got exp of largish italian boats - a different world. Huge amounts of space mean that things mostly work for starters, and if they don't there is room for fixing, or for a completely different unit to be fitted.

Huge hull length means that things are rarely bashed around slamming or falling off waves.

Eyetie builders seem to build with arrogant pride - competing to see how good a job they can do. We've (I've) found loads of things unheard of with smaller boats, not visible until you dig about in the bilges and engineroom.

Handlingwise, i spect you will know how much easier they are. Inertia is proportional (a factor of) to the cube of the length, wherea windage on proportional to the square - so a big boat goes where it is told, far less being blwon off. Tho at this age may not have bowthruster which umm can be useful?

You get loads of dockside help, and can move around far faster and more safely - you can break into a run up the side decks of a bigger boat, so its often faster to get to the bows and back on a 20m than on a 12m, themselves faster than on an 8m boat.

Baglietto is respected yard - me and ljs went past it and stopped (fuel prob, but sorted) in Varrazza (?) just west of Genoa.

On the downside, of course, it is an oddball boat for many, not a "known product". So resale might not be easy, tho probaly already factored into the price. I guess asking at about something like £120k. Or praps get a newer one! Hah! er, that's how we ended up in the poo...

Why suspicious of the full coding for charter? On that size it will have been skipper charter so the systems will have been used, not left to go manky. And engine hours blah irrelevant - provided the reports are good.

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[Divemaster1]

Re: Big is best

thanks TCM,

Appreciate the size benefits, hence wanting to go to view .. (Never thought SWMBO would be the one going for something bigger than i thougt of though..).

Would agree about space on Layout's ... 3 x huge cabins + crew of three.. Own work bench behind engines + 2x 12KW gens.. + AC and all Gens & AC less than 3 years old.
Handling without thruster will be interesting to experience, but expect the weight etc, make her less likely to drift away ... but expect that if she goes, she'll go big way...

Appreciate the re-sale part, but not too worried, as the yard is respected. Whilst maybe not well known in the UK, it will be know in the Med .
Also with respect to charter, I do see full coding as beneficial as this will mean recent inspections and OK safety equipment etc. (and can be OK for reducing TCO) Reason for questioning is why, if not chartered ... not that I am complaining... Expect to see well used and well maintained based upon reports ... perhaps have been chartered under previous ownership. Time will tell..


<hr width=100% size=1>Alf

 

[tcm]

Chartering and The Floating Shed

the charter market for most sizes has had a totally rubbish time since 9/11 when it fell thru the floor, now recovering but only slowly. If able to charter they may as well keep the inspections going. Have they had crew on - is there crew now?

you shd be ok with no thruster - all a bit freaky to start with but no, i wd not say they go "big time" in wind - you can gettem back far easier than smaller boats.

Sounds quite decent with all that space, workbenches an all! the gennies must have cost a fair chunk of the asking price.

Wd you keepit in the med or takeit back oop to scotland?




<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[Divemaster1]

Re: Chartering and The Floating Shed

Know that about the charter market ... 30% drop at least ... Want to have the cert as Charter is interesting. Have contacts who are quite interested in taking on MY's for corporate charter and entertainment round Athens next year (Olympics there), so may already have some pre booked for next year, even before having looked at the vessel. (Interested ???).

So guess that explains that I intend to keep her (or intended purchase) in the med for a couple of years, then see where I end up ....



<hr width=100% size=1>Alf

 

[chris66]

Excellent Boat

I live in Italy and run a 11m mid seventies marine ply Italian built boat (Piantoni). I know a lot smaller than said Baglietto but similar in that purchase price makes all well maintained good condition olderwooden boats superb value for money IF the condition is A1 . Do make sure that the surveyor has experience with wood and maybe worth getting a second surveyor to do just the hull. Maintenance costs will be higher than a smaller recent craft but with so much new kit you are off to a good start.
Main thing is that the Baglietto 20 (and 18) is a beautiful beautiful boat with so much character compared with modern plastic things.



<hr width=100% size=1>Chris

 

[lanason]

Re: Chartering and The Floating Shed

have you got a picture to post of her ??

<hr width=100% size=1>Adrian
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.arweb.co.uk/argallery/kelisha>More Pics of Kelisha</A> /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

 

[oldgit]

re W = W.

Wood equals work.

<hr width=100% size=1>Two boats please one here n one in the Med

 

[Blue_Blazes]

Re: re W = W.

...and big equals crew. Assuming you're not going to pay them to sit on their arses, they can do some of the (very considerable) maintenance work.

Bill.

<hr width=100% size=1>One of these days I'll have a boat that WORKS

 

[jfm]

baglietto = fab stuff

Agree other comments. Except Baglietto is very well known and respected Med brand. So no resale probs in Med due to unknownness. See their current range, totally fab boats. As TCM says, built with pride by skilled boatbuilders, only a minority of whom will have passed through Lanchester in their Alfa Romeos

Dunno if you have seen just one. There are a few 18 and 20m 70's plywoods for sale secondhand. Last year when my brother bought his new boat he got details on a few Bags. Some at the 100-130k mark.

I would worry about maintenance. Even assuming it's 100% pukka now, it will need much upkeep, including paint and varnish. Timewise can you do yourself? But labour costs down there aren't cheap and alternatively hiring a hands on captain is also quite spensive (if you are lucky enough to find one who will do maintenance)

Sound good though, hope it works out. Post pics if poss

Most times you wont need b/thruster. But if you sail with plenty of crew and find yourself docking in a difficult wind, drop the RIB in and use that as bow thruster. Tell driver (with hh VHF) to push left or right. Big boats often do this. Works fine. JetRIB £10k = same cost as bow thruster, loads more fun, and less likely to annoy HLB

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[tcm]

Re: jetribs- just say no

all agreed cept for the effing jetrib. Do NOT buy these, guys, if at all poss. They are nice and posy but thats' it. You get an rib with an inboard, so if the rib is knackered so is the whole 10k boat. No,not happended to me but read on. The jet is so whippy that it has little or now low-speed waterski-useful grunt and seems to alternate between 1knot and then (rather quickly) to about 27 knots, after which speed increase is smooth to over 40 knots. Great. Handling -wise, if u bust the crane the whole kaboodle is stuck in the water - no chance of lifting the 'gine off and then the rib out. Next door's crane is just shagged -so his brand new rib is in the water for another barnacley week.

Long-term, no chance either of re-engining (or re-boating) an otherwise perfectly fine Rib (or engine). Avoid, imho

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[jfm]

Re: jetribs- just say no

Flippin eck have you taken doom and gloom tablets? It might never happen! D2 has inboard engines too. And probly you can re-engine a rib for same price as a similar HP outboard. But I agree, every boat should have back up cranes in case one breaks

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[Divemaster1]

Re: baglietto = fab stuff

Thanks for the info ....

Actually three of four for sale .... two really interesting ... there of one with charter cert .... don't worry about bow thruster really ... can do lots of other wizzy things with high power, directional jets, so if I want to I could have some fun with new techy stuff later...

Maintenance is the big worry... If I go ahead she will be on full management for 2004, & maintenance is included. and with three crew, they better do some work to keep her at the stage she is, or better. some serious conditioning in the contract will be built in (wording accepted in principle by the way ).



<hr width=100% size=1>Alf

 

[jfm]

Re: baglietto = fab stuff

Sounds great. Where is she?

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[Divemaster1]

Re: baglietto = fab stuff

One is in Spain (Costa Del Sol), other is in the Canaries......(Interesting delivery trip...)

Have some images & will post whe I have soem time .... cannot believe I'm here on a Sat night....



<hr width=100% size=1>Alf