Form Over Function

[hlb]

An earlier thread reminded me some thing I've noted before.

When deciding on a boat, what factors are taken, into account. I dont mean make or type, I mean size.

Now I can understand that obviously if you ain got a great deal of money, you cant really afford a big one. So thats sorted.

But presuming money no object, it seems that alot of folk just seem to buy the biggest boat they can. Regardless as to what it's going to be used for and severley limiting what it can be used for.

Fair enough, if you have ten kids or a load of mates to drag around with you. But I only ever see a bloke and his wife on an enormous boat.

I met one a couple of years ago in Falmouth. They'd parked the boat in the council marina and hired a car for two weeks. Even went up the river in the trip boat, rather than take there own. Then they were scooting all the way back to the Solent in one hit. His wife did not look to happy about this!!

Now OK, if you want to cruise any distance, you need a reasonable sized boat that can handle the sea, and big enough for comfort whilst moored. Say 35/40ft??

No one goes out and buys a jugernaught sized car and theres no street cred in owning a double decker bus.

Obviously, a big boat is needed if really long distance cruising is envisaged, or maybe for the med, which seems to accomodate much bigger boats.

But in the UK theres loads and loads of places that the bigger the boat, the more you are disadvantaged, moorings are limited and it becomes more and more difficult for it to go up rivers, or sneak onto pub pontoons for an hour.

Then course there seems to be the ones where the owners seem far to scared to take them anywhere most of the time, so they never move. Whats the point in that!!

 

[Dave_Snelson]

Haydn - I have no idea what the formula (excuse the pun) is. Moreover, I think different peeps use different formulae.

My own formula is reputation. So no matter the size of the boat, it has to have an established reputation for handling, performance, build quality and sea worthiness.

One of the most distressing things about boats is the number that end up as floating caravans. So if you ain't gonna use, don't buy it.

 

[hlb]

Nowt to do with the quetion. Though I dont disagree.!

 

[ShipsWoofy]

What is also interesting is the difference between us raggies and you stinks.

Questions often appear on both forums, and go like, if you won the lottery which boat would you be ordering.

The raggies will more often suggest craft between 40 and 49ft, often the shorter end of that scale so that two crew can handle, on here in Mobo world the answers are generally superyachts 60m+ in length carrying 45ft powerboats as tenders.

I find the difference in these answers, quite often is fundamental to what separates your average raggie to your average stinker. To the stinkers it makes us in their eyes pipe smoking slipper wearing farts to not want to own the biggest boat in the marina.

I also think there is a lot less boat envy on the raggies side, I admire some of the BIG yachts, but I have no desire to ever own one, too impracticable.

Is weird yes?

 

[GC1]

It's not just boats but houses as well, I guess the same applies. Some may want a huge house but can't afford to heat, furnish and maintain it, some prefer to get a house that is comfortable and they can live in luxury and have 4 great foreign holidays a year. Same with some big boats which are bought without fully understanding the maintenance costs, this could lead you to having to give up other luxuries and be so financialy tied to the boat you feel you have to spend every spare moment there. Whereas with a smaller boat it doesn't matter, you can have it all and just as much fun in my opinion (well with local cruising anyway)

Me, well I am more concerned in safety and having a boat I can handle, I am not ashamed to have such a small boat at least I am still alive. 45' - 47' will be my ultimate limit from knowledge I have picked up (sail or power), how long it takes to get there I don't know, but anything more than that would be a waste, for me anyway.

As for cars, I do think it is nice to have one of each dependent on what mood you are in or indeed where you are going and weather, sports, 4x4, luxury cruising and city car. I must say looking into the competitive price of hiring cars nowadays, there is something that appeals with that e.g. no maintenance, depreciation, insurance costs and storage. I wonder if there was a more competitive boat rental/charter system if people would use that?

 

[adrianm]

I went for quite a large boat (16.5m) because I needed 4 cabins.

Mind you, by the time I've finished building the bl**dy thing the kids will have grown up and left anyway!

I wouldn't have gone for anything too much smaller as I want to have a proper sofa and a normal sized bed with full headroom throughout.

A week on my old S37 used to drive me nuts with the lack of space with 7 on board. I'm planning to spend months at a time on the new boat so it needs to be roomy.

 

[hlb]

In the last fifteen years of boating, the two kids have been on the boat five times, between them. Before that, I suppose they had to come with us!! There now in there 30's.

 

[tico]

couldn't agree more. Smaller means you can get closer to shore and into smaller inlets and harbours.
Wouldnt like to try to get a 50 footer into Solva or Saundersfoot. Means you miss out on lots of the most interesting places
What also amazes me is the crap design i see re side decks and doors.
Do most new mobos never anchor? or are they designed for dwarves scrambling up and down the steps from helm to inside?

 

[[2068]]

There is a set of people that don't use the full capabilities of their boat, and you probably meet them at the marina cos they haven't gone anywhere. You're highly unlikely to meet tcm in similar circumstances, probably battling 8 ft waves across Biscay or other madness. Some use their boat for 2 - 3 weeks (in 1 lump) a year only, using it as a floating holiday residence. Who's to say that's not a valid use of a boat ?

Me, I've got accomodation I hardly ever sleep in, and use it fairly regularly thru thru the season, but mainly as a dayboat, which probably wasn't what was intended by the builders, either...

dv.

 

[deborahann]

we've moored outside some sea boats well actually, not much more than 40' but its a route march and almost dangerous to get off them, some are like a block of flats. And thats when they are tied to the pontoon. Would hate to arrive in one.

& as for cleaning a big boat ! would have to get it valeted, or I'd in bed for weeks with a bad back. I just don't understand the need for a big boat, (unless you really need one) its honestly not the cost, but having somthing you can easily use, and maintain, without appointments with others to do this or that.

 

[Nautical]

Would agree with you mostly on the proviso that its only two of you cruising. At the lower end of your scale 35' four people crusing any distance is a pain, normally only one heads and a tiny second cabin, six is a non starter as you have to convert the dinette and faff about with infills etc. Even on 40' six is a squesse and again not many have second heads.

All depends on what you are looking for, if the peeps you cruise with are matesy and don't mind sharing everything then not a problem but it all gets a bit embarrassing with a second couple you've invited for the weekend and you are all sharing the 'facilities'.

Personally, 45/6' is ideal, you can get to most places, usually have two good sized cabins with ensuites, big saloon for relaxing and inviting guests on and the whole affair is much more spacious and comfortable. With good wifey/ hubby crew can easliy mangage as a couple.

A little bit extra in the size gives you a bit more weight and power to play with and more comfortable for crusing the up and downy stuff if it gets a bit blowy.

The boat handly bit can depend very much on the make, two peeps on some 40's can be a handful and on others 50' can be bob on. Once delivered a mid sized 30' something and it was a pig to get alongside, was so shallow in the draft and flat bottomed any wind at all and you were everywhere, horrible thing!. Skippered 50'+ and could have done it nearly single handed, rock steady in the water.

Less than 30' and really its a day boat with the ability to overnight as a couple and a couple of friends at a squash.

If I did no cruising just day's out and blasting accross the Irish sea I'd have super sleek 36/7' sports cruiser with big motors and fab deep Vee hull, might even go for surface drives for the hell of it /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif, but thats a different story and one that will have to wait till next season! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[hlb]

Err, well, yes. But I cant remember ever seeing more than two on any of them. /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

 

[Dave_Snelson]

Dunno really Jools??

I think some of the bigger stinky boats do just end up as floating caravans, as I mentioned in my reply to Haydn.

Then we've got horses for courses. For me, cruising around the Llyn and mebbe to Ireland, the mobo is ideal. Seriously though (and don't laugh) if I were to go long distance (say Morocco for example) I would sell CI and buy a rag& stick boat. Coz it just makes sense.

And it ain't all speed either. I really liked the Nordhaven 47 featured in this months MBM. Top speed? 8kts. No faster than Top Cat, but still a mobo - and one with an Atlantic crossing range of approx 3000nm at 1.9 gph.

When I do decide to cut loose and go to Morocco by boat, it won't be a mobo for sure. So I may need some sailing lessons /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

 

[powerskipper]

We started boating on a 43 flybrigde and with 4 adult and 2 kids it was cramped, we were Lucky we could go up and had a 52ft with 2 double cabins and a crew cabin , we did a lot of cruising with her 800 hr in about 2.5 years, regularly 6 on board for a week or 2. big enough to get places but on the limited for most marinas.
Now we have a S 34, great for local trips [ time limited now /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif], will do the longer stuff with planning, but rarely have more than 4 max on board now.
each type has its advantages and disadvantages, it very much what you want to do with it that is the decision maker................... OH and cash /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[hlb]

Thats the other thing. Sailing I dont mind. It's the string all over the place that does my head in. And, no where comfy to sit down.

 

[MapisM]

A couple of thoughts

[ QUOTE ]
But I only ever see a bloke and his wife on an enormous boat.
...They'd parked the boat in the council marina and hired a car for two weeks

[/ QUOTE ]
Ahem. I've seen people with small boats doing precisely the same.
I guess it's rather a matter of personal preference, than of boat size.

[ QUOTE ]
Obviously, a big boat is needed if really long distance cruising is envisaged

[/ QUOTE ]
That's not the only reason.
We bought a big(ish) boat because we like to spend our holidays at sea.
Not necessarily doing long cruises, but definitely staying on board, mooring as far as possible from any marina.
That's only possible with enough water and fuel load, which is strictly related to the boat size.
And boat type, of course, displacement boats having a big advantage vs.planing boats in terms of range.
In fact, we went for the first, after years of experience with the latter.

 

[hlb]

Re: A couple of thoughts

Dont get me wrong. I'm not having a go at any one. Each to there own. It's just an observation. Great big boats, with two people, struggling. I've there happy, no problem. Deb's wants a smaller boat next. I dont.

Our boat is far to big for living on. We have never used the dining room! It's become a sort of an office. Or a place to drop the junk. Bit difficult this. Debs boat is 50ft but mines 35ft. She wants smaller Iwant same or maybe slightly bigger. But I dont think Debs understands the ride.!! WE are both 6ft plus. On the other hand we hae two settees to crash out onto.

Still not understanding the folk that need 50ft boats. Now, if they all turn up next year with six or eight aboard, no problem.. But I've never seen it yet.


Maybe a bit hopefull like when I built my barn???

 

[deborahann]

Re: A couple of thoughts

being the Deb's in question. I really think you only need the space you actually use in a boat, its just to me, being only the two of us boating, a question of ease of use. Balanced by sea going ability.

We boat on HLB's boat about 10 weeks of the year, and have to say of the large motor boats we have encountered recently, with the odd exception, have had only two people on board. Maybe families are put off mooring near us !

 

[jointventureII]

I guess its similar to housing. 2 people can live in a fairly small space. Obviously this isn't the case - couples live in huge houses. Its just a comfort thing. I'd rather have the space of a 45ft-er than the somewhat cramped arrangement on our day angler 23, although you cant beat sleeping under the stars sometimes.

 

[hlb]

Yes. But you dont have to drive a house about. You dont actually have to try and fit it between two council houses, do you!

If folk did the same with cars, they'ed have an artic with two or three trailers behind it!!