Foreign flagged boats in Portuguese waters

Lorrendraaier

Lorrendraaier

Member
Joined
7 Sep 2018
Messages
34
Location
the Netherlands
www.lorrendraaier.nl
Recently the Portuguese authorities have been asking EU flagged boats to not only present a VAT declaration, proving that VAT has been paid in the full, but yachts are also required to have on-board a so called T2L document (*).

In this case a very strange request, which also surprises officials in other EU states, as a T2L document is only valid for a period of 90 days and is not used in the context the document is meant for.

Whether the Portuguese T2L requirement will be upheld is the question, as formal protests are being submitted.


(*) The T2L document is a customs document used in the European Union as a proof of the Inter-European community character of the export / import. The exporter, importer and the country the shipment is loaded from and delivered to have to belong to the EU member countries in order for this document to be issued. The T2L document is certified by the customs authorities of the country the products are loaded from and the importer needs to receive it in order to start the import procedure. [ref. International Freight Seeking Services | CargoTransport]
 
The Liveaboard forum (or Scuttlebutt) might be a better place to ask this, I've been hearing from quite a few folk in Portugal on this thread running in Liveaboard at the moment and this hasn't come up (yet)...
 
It is a regular occurrence for boats in Portugal to be asked for one but it is considered 'unlucky to be asked for a T2L' (most people in the past were not asked for one) therefore most people do not bother getting one. Until that is their boat is impounded in a marina (or sent to a marina from a anchorage - or sent to a marina from sailing in Portuguese waters in one case I know of) and not allowed to leave the marina till one is produced. You have 3 weeks to produce one, I think. I do not know what happens if you do not produce the document in 3 weeks. Probably a fine.

Don't try and rationalise it because it is not rational. It is a strange request and you are correct it is not what the document was intended for!

How I got my T2L

As a member or the RYA I asked them to send me the form (when I was in Portugal) and they also send a very helpful guide to filling in the form. You fill in the form and post it off (in my case to a English address as stated on the form) with a self addressed envelope with UK stamps on it. They post it back and you are all set.
 
Lorrendraaier said:
Recently the Portuguese authorities have been asking EU flagged boats to not only present a VAT declaration, proving that VAT has been paid in the full, but yachts are also required to have on-board a so called T2L document (*).
Click to expand...

Where did you hear about this? It's news to me and I've been based in Portugal for many years.

Portuguese authorities have been looking at Netherlands flagged boats as some owners have been using it as a flag of convenience, to avoid Portuguese registration. It turns out that the Netherlands register they used does not give them the right to fly the ensign so, they have been warned to cancel it and register their boats properly.
 
T2L | Boating Abroad | Knowledge & Advice | RYA - Royal Yachting Association

Everyone knows, including the RYA, in the Algarve you may be asked for a T2L document! How much proof do people need that the reality is not having a T2L can be an extreme inconvenience.

It is disingenuous not to recommend the correct paperwork to others who are here for help and guidance. If they choose not to be armed with the correct forms so be it. They have taken an informed decision.
 
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I have been in Portugal for 20 years with a UK SSR boat. I have been inspected once during that time and they only asked for my license, SSR certificate and light dues certificate. Nothing else. I do have a T2L along with an array of other paperwork just in case I need them but the truth is that in a SSR registered vessel you are unlikely to be stopped and inspected unless you have an incident or you annoy them in some way by doing stupid things like anchor too close to the beach etc etc.
I also have a Portuguese registered boat which I use for fishing. In 2 years I have been checked 6 times. Initially to check my fishing license and then to inspect safety gear and paperwork. I also have to have a certified inspection on that boat every 3 years. The Portuguese are subject to many more checks than any foreign flagged vessels.
That is why they try to register their boats under foreign flags and avoid certified safety inspections and reduce the number of ad hoc inspections.
Hence the problems at the moment with the Netherlands registration which has been used as a flag of convenience for years over here and the Marine Police have finally caught up with the practice. Unfortunately, it seems the genuine Dutch boats have also been looked at closely as part of the process.
 
The Dutch "ICP", the sort of "Watersports club registration", has been used countless times to avoid paying VAT: buy a US boat, register under an ICP issued by ANWB, ask ANWB for a Radiation certificate, register into a suitable EU register where not many checks are done.
With all the recent changes in flag requirements in EU countries, I'd think more controls should not be unexpected.
 
Graham376 said:
Where did you hear about this? It's news to me and I've been based in Portugal for many years.

Portuguese authorities have been looking at Netherlands flagged boats as some owners have been using it as a flag of convenience, to avoid Portuguese registration. It turns out that the Netherlands register they used does not give them the right to fly the ensign so, they have been warned to cancel it and register their boats properly.
Click to expand...

We were informed of this by clients and through the Customs in the Netherlands, as Dutch boat owners sailing a boat registered in the Dutch ships registrar were confronted with the request for a T2L document.

It is correct that the ICP, an unofficial form of proof of ownership, is no longer accepted in Portugal.
 
Lorrendraaier said:
We were informed of this by clients and through the Customs in the Netherlands, as Dutch boat owners sailing a boat registered in the Dutch ships registrar were confronted with the request for a T2L document.

It is correct that the ICP, an unofficial form of proof of ownership, is no longer accepted in Portugal.
Click to expand...

Thanks. So far, this doesn't appear to be a problem for other nation's flags as only a tiny minority have been asked for a T2L and from what I'm told, some if not all, have been relatively new boats which they possibly suspect have been supplied VAT free with owners declaring they were leaving the EU. VAT in Portugal is 23%.
 
Lorrendraaier said:
Recently the Portuguese authorities have been asking EU flagged boats to not only present a VAT declaration, proving that VAT has been paid in the full, but yachts are also required to have on-board a so called T2L document (*).

In this case a very strange request, which also surprises officials in other EU states, as a T2L document is only valid for a period of 90 days and is not used in the context the document is meant for.

Whether the Portuguese T2L requirement will be upheld is the question, as formal protests are being submitted.


(*) The T2L document is a customs document used in the European Union as a proof of the Inter-European community character of the export / import. The exporter, importer and the country the shipment is loaded from and delivered to have to belong to the EU member countries in order for this document to be issued. The T2L document is certified by the customs authorities of the country the products are loaded from and the importer needs to receive it in order to start the import procedure. [ref. International Freight Seeking Services | CargoTransport]
Click to expand...

Lorrendraaier,
Please keep us informed with your progress. Is getting a TL2 as easy for a Dutch boat as it is for a British one? My link to the RYA above may be useful. They have an amazing telephone help-desk dedicated to cruising sailors.

It is interesting to note that this forum, as a database of useful information, is an important asset to all boat owners. Just because a single issue may not affect one boat it most surely will affect another boat. Even the tiny minority needs to be considered imho. When I first started boating these forums were a lifeline. I will endeavour to help in any way I can to repay the many posters here who have a passion for the sea and all things boaty...including the dreaded paperwork.
 
Star-Lord said:
Is getting a TL2 as easy for a Dutch boat as it is for a British one? My link to the RYA above may be useful. They have an amazing telephone help-desk dedicated to cruising sailors.
Click to expand...

No regretfully not. In the Netherlands it has to go through a Customs Clearance Agency. If the vessel is no longer physically in the Netherlands, they are not too keen on issuing a T2L. The big problem occurs for vessels which are registered in the Dutch, German, Belgian, French, Spanish etc. ships registrar but were never actually exported from the flag state.

I will most definitely post relevant updates.
 
The RYA link above describes it best. Some countries insist on the TL2. I am on the way to Croatia and I am glad I have the TL2 because Croatia sometimes asks for one. I do not know under circumstances but my guess will be after 2020 the correct paperwork will be paramount.
 
roaringgirl said:
I don't understand, is a proof of vat paid not sufficient?
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Unless the paperwork trail from new is complete, it's actually difficult to prove that VAT isn't due on an old boat, even if the original invoice is present. Although it may have been paid on purchase, a chargeable event could have taken place since, in the case (say) where the boat has since changed hands outside the EU. Here in Portugal, even an outboard engine has to have its paperwork trail and original invoice or, the authorities won't register it to the boat.
 
Bellacruiser said:
Quick question whilst on the topic, I presume that T2L is obtained (well, at least sought!) in the flag state, and not determined by owner nationality/residency or anything else?
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AFAIK it should be obtained where the VAT was paid. For UK boats, HMRC only issues T2L's to UK addresses.
 
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