For those contemplating doing Holland this year.

[sailorman]

Now here are a few things that should be banned :-


1. A nose ring and bifocals

2. Spiked hair and bald spots

3. A pierced tongue and dentures

4. Miniskirts and support hose

5. Ankle bracelets and corn pads

6. Speedo's and cellulite

7. A belly button ring and a gall bladder surgery scar

8. Unbuttoned disco shirts and a heart monitor

9. Midriff shirts and a midriff bulge

10. Bikinis and liver spots

11. Mini skirts and varicose veins

Thats me done for then

 

[wingdiver]

Alcohol is not a good analogy. It is not possible to buy alcohol that has not been deemed duty paid in Europe, so it is therefore assumed that duty has been paid. This is the same as the assumption that duty has been paid on white diesel.
Red Diesel is assumed to have had no duty paid on it and that is why the onus is on the user to prove that duty has been paid.
The problem is the UK government coming up with a stupid scheme where duty can be paid on red diesel, making it legal to use (in the UK). I'm sure the Dutch (and French and Belgian?) customs officers would much rather just check that white diesel is being used, rather than the confusion of receipts and logs that now has to be put in place.
Additionally, the forecourt price of white diesel over here is about 1.15 Euros, or about the same as the concessionary price on Red or if the concessionary price you are getting is less, then enjoy your subsidised boating and quit whinging.

I shall assume this is a general comment and not take umbrage at the last part of your post. I would just say that ALL diesel has duty paid on it in the UK, including red. Once the cheap red diesel stopped being in place about 18 months ago, all red diesel at the marinas is charged at full whack if it is deemed to be for non-domestic purposes and lower rate for domestic (like oil for heating and cooking at a house) so I will have paid either HM Customs suggested 60/40 split or some different figure based on actual consumption. If that other figure is wrong, it is down to UK Customs to clobber me with the extra duty and fines etc. if I can't prove my split is reasonable as it is the UK Government's loss. I don't see where the Dutch have a right to question what duty I have paid on the red in my tanks because, on the face of it, I will have paid duty on it in the UK. Red diesel charged with full duty at the marina in the UK is more expensive that white from a forecourt. I guess the same applies to red at heating rates from a marina compared to the deliveries you get to houses, so we DON'T enjoy subsidised boating any more.

 

[FullCircle]

Just to make your post a little more complicated Vince, are you saying that all goods imported into Holland with the differing rates of VAT ought to be reassessed at the gates of Amsterdam?

These rates are Corporation Tax, Income tax annd last one is VAT...

Austria 25% 50% 20% [1]
Belarus 24% 30% 18%
Belgium 33.99% 50% 21%
Bosnia and Herzegovina[2] 30% (10% in Srpska) 5% Federal + 0%-15% per location 17%
Bulgaria[3] 10% 10% 20%
Croatia 20% 45% 23%
Cyprus 10% 30% 15%
Czech Republic 21% 15% 20% (10% on selected goods and services)
Denmark 25% 58% 25% (VAT free on aeroplanes)
Estonia 20% 21% 20% (9% on selected goods and services)
Finland 26% 53% 22%
France 33.33% 40% 19.6% (2.1% drugs, newspapers, theatres), (5.5% raw food, books)
Germany 15,825 % (federal) plus 14,35 % to 17,5 % (local) 45% 19% (7% on selected goods and services)
Georgia 20% 12% 18%
Greece 25% 40% 19%(9% on selected goods and services)
Hungary 16% 36% 20%
Iceland 26% 45.58% 25.5%
Ireland 12.50% 41% 21% (0%, 4.8%, 5.2% and 13.5% for selected goods and services)
Italy 37.25% 45% 20% (10% and 4% on selected goods and services)
Latvia 15% 23% 21% (10% certain goods and services)
Lithuania 20%[4] 21%[5] 21%
Luxembourg 29.63% 38.95% 15%
FYR of Macedonia[6] 10% 10% 18% (5% VAT on food, medicine, IT technology and other products)
Malta 35% 35% 18% (0% VAT on food and medicine)
Montenegro 9%[7] 15%[7] 17% (7% for certain goods and services)
Netherlands 25.5% 52% 19% (6% for certain goods)
Norway[8][9] 28% 54.3% 25%(foodstuffs 13%)
Poland 19% 32% 22% (some products i.e. food - 7%)
Portugal 27.50% 42% 20% (5% for first need products)
Romania 16% 16% 19%
Russia 24% 13% 18%
Serbia 10% 14% 18% (8% basic necessities as bread, milk etc.)
Slovakia 19% 19% 19%
Slovenia [10] 22% 41% 20%
Spain 30% (28% Basque Country & Navarra, 4% ZEC companies in Canary Islands) 45% 16% (7% and 4% on selected goods and services)
Sweden 26.3% 55% 25% (12%/6% for certain goods and services)
Switzerland 25% 45.5% 7.6%
Ukraine 30% 15% [11] 20%
United Kingdom [12] 21%-28% [13] 40% [14] 17.5% (some items at 5%, some items 0%)

 

[sailorman]

Den Haag Jim

 

[PaulGooch]

Why not charge all foreign boats entering the UK additional duty on their fuel ? If for instance a Dutch boat enters the UK and Dutch diesel is €1.15 per litre and over here it's €1.35 per litre, we charge €0.20 x the tank capacity.

What happens if a Dutch boat is returning from a trip to a non EU country, do they have to pay duty on the fuel in their tanks ?

EDIT. What happens when a non-EU boat visits Holland ? Do they have to pay duty on the fuel in their tanks ?

 

[PaulGooch]

Just to make your post a little more complicated Vince, are you saying that all goods imported into Holland with the differing rates of VAT ought to be reassessed at the gates of Amsterdam?

These rates are Corporation Tax, Income tax annd last one is VAT...

Austria 25% 50% 20% [1]
Belarus 24% 30% 18%
Belgium 33.99% 50% 21%
Bosnia and Herzegovina[2] 30% (10% in Srpska) 5% Federal + 0%-15% per location 17%
Bulgaria[3] 10% 10% 20%
Croatia 20% 45% 23%
Cyprus 10% 30% 15%
Czech Republic 21% 15% 20% (10% on selected goods and services)
Denmark 25% 58% 25% (VAT free on aeroplanes)
Estonia 20% 21% 20% (9% on selected goods and services)
Finland 26% 53% 22%
France 33.33% 40% 19.6% (2.1% drugs, newspapers, theatres), (5.5% raw food, books)
Germany 15,825 % (federal) plus 14,35 % to 17,5 % (local) 45% 19% (7% on selected goods and services)
Georgia 20% 12% 18%
Greece 25% 40% 19%(9% on selected goods and services)
Hungary 16% 36% 20%
Iceland 26% 45.58% 25.5%
Ireland 12.50% 41% 21% (0%, 4.8%, 5.2% and 13.5% for selected goods and services)
Italy 37.25% 45% 20% (10% and 4% on selected goods and services)
Latvia 15% 23% 21% (10% certain goods and services)
Lithuania 20%[4] 21%[5] 21%
Luxembourg 29.63% 38.95% 15%
FYR of Macedonia[6] 10% 10% 18% (5% VAT on food, medicine, IT technology and other products)
Malta 35% 35% 18% (0% VAT on food and medicine)
Montenegro 9%[7] 15%[7] 17% (7% for certain goods and services)
Netherlands 25.5% 52% 19% (6% for certain goods)
Norway[8][9] 28% 54.3% 25%(foodstuffs 13%)
Poland 19% 32% 22% (some products i.e. food - 7%)
Portugal 27.50% 42% 20% (5% for first need products)
Romania 16% 16% 19%
Russia 24% 13% 18%
Serbia 10% 14% 18% (8% basic necessities as bread, milk etc.)
Slovakia 19% 19% 19%
Slovenia [10] 22% 41% 20%
Spain 30% (28% Basque Country & Navarra, 4% ZEC companies in Canary Islands) 45% 16% (7% and 4% on selected goods and services)
Sweden 26.3% 55% 25% (12%/6% for certain goods and services)
Switzerland 25% 45.5% 7.6%
Ukraine 30% 15% [11] 20%
United Kingdom [12] 21%-28% [13] 40% [14] 17.5% (some items at 5%, some items 0%)

Shouldn't have mentioned that Jim. When they see our VAT is only 17.5% they'll want to charge us 1.5% on the value of our boats if we stay too long.

 

[wingdiver]

Shouldn't have mentioned that Jim. When they see our VAT is only 17.5% they'll want to charge us 1.5% on the value of our boats if we stay too long.

In that case, can I claim a rebate from them as my boat entered the EU and had VAT paid in Holland. Now it's in the UK I want my 1.5% back! Darn, should have asked last year when our VAT was only 15%!

 

[FullCircle]

Shouldn't have mentioned that Jim. When they see our VAT is only 17.5% they'll want to charge us 1.5% on the value of our boats if we stay too long.

It says 6% on certain goods, so maybe we will get a rebate of 11.5%. My glass is half full.

 

[sailorman]

I have sent this link to the RYA for "Comment"

 

[Tin Tin]

Interesting

I have sent this link to the RYA for "Comment"

Would be interesting to see what they have to say about this

The editor goes on to blame the RYA for the current situation.
When the tax relief on red diesel for leisure craft came to an end a few years ago the RYA campained to keep red diesel (but taxed) in order to spare marina operators the cost of having their tanks cleaned.
In Belgium - the only other country (apart from Malta) where red diesel was provided to yachts - marina operators were ordered to clean their tanks. The problem does not exist there.

If it's true, it seems to me that in protecting the interests of the few (marina owners) the RYA may have caused a lot of avoidable problems for the average cruising sailor.

 

[FullCircle]

If it's true, it seems to me that in protecting the interests of the few (marina owners) the RYA may have caused a lot of avoidable problems for the average cruising sailor.

Not really. Its a local problem to the East coast, we are just about the only ones who go there regularly.

 

[Simon_and_Tanja]

Tax differentials

Just to make your post a little more complicated Vince, are you saying that all goods imported into Holland with the differing rates of VAT ought to be reassessed at the gates of Amsterdam?

These rates are Corporation Tax, Income tax annd last one is VAT...

Don't be fooled by the attractive (in comparison) income tax rates in the UK - our govenment is just much better at the hidden tax game than many of our neighbours. When you add council tax and NI contributions (employer and employee) top band tax on my income is nearer 60% than 40%.

Have to agree with other posters: Surely this "fine" is illegally seeking to overlay a dutch duty on top of duty already paid in the UK. Issue is surely proving that the fuel you have is not duty free, i.e. bought at a marina and not syphoned out of a tractor - lets dye duty paid marine diesel purple and then nobody has to clean out their old red-stained tanks. Easier still the customs officials could just "get a life".

Whilst on the subject of Dutch customs officials... Whilst moving all my wife's belongings from Amsterdam to Belfast we were requested to open the completely stuffed transit van for
inspection at the Hook of Holland. The rear door catch broke as I attempted open the doors and after a few minutes of unsuccessful attempts to free the catch the customs official lost interest and waved us through. So fill-up with red diesel, sail over and just accidently mislay your filler key as you approach the Dutch docks

 

[Peegee]

Ho Hum

Last year 50% of cruisers bottled out of going to Holland as the scare mongers claimed that you would be shot if you sh*t, or roggered if you radioed.
In the end there was absolutely nothing, zilch, nix, bu**er all, to worry about....if you were sensible!
I would suggest waiting for an "official" dictat befor we all abandon hope.....Anyway, I'm going.

 

[sailorman]

Inisial responce from the RYA

Last year 50% of cruisers bottled out of going to Holland as the scare mongers claimed that you would be shot if you sh*t, or roggered if you radioed.
In the end there was absolutely nothing, zilch, nix, bu**er all, to worry about....if you were sensible!
I would suggest waiting for an "official" dictat befor we all abandon hope.....Anyway, I'm going.

As the forum link you provided is to a rather long thread, I am unclear exactly what information you are seeking clarification on. Information regarding the use of Red Diesel abroad is provided on the RYA web-site at: http://www.rya.org.uk/infoadvice/boatingabroad/Pages/reddieselabroad.aspx. Information specific to the Netherlands is available at http://www.rya.org.uk/infoadvice/boatingabroad/countries/Pages/netherlands.aspx however please note you will need to be logged in as a member to access this page.

If having read the information on the web-site you have questions you would like to ask, please feel free to come back to me with them.


My answer
Hi Carol
thanks for the prompt response.
i understand the agreed requirements for Holland but the Dutch Customs seem to be singling the British Boater out due to "Red Diesel" again.
the first post ( Guapa) explains this.
is there anything the RYA can do in this regard as the season is about to kick off & us on the East Coast regularly visit Holland. (or used to )
Kind regards

 

[PaulGooch]

Thanks for the post, but reading the first link i can see that they RYA has already advised UK boaters to carry fuel receipts and keep an engine log, exactly as stated in the first post. Based on that, it seems the Dutch are just enforcing the RYA advice to the letter.

Not being a member of the RYA, i can't read the second one.

 

[Peegee]

sensible !

Its just about being sensible. We know that at least one British yacht got collared a couple of years back, and since then, being forwarned, I for one made sure I kept my receipts, and did not carry copious ammounts of spare fuel in the locker, so I did not turn up in Holland with a brimming tank after motoring up the Walcheren.
I sometimes feel a bit critical of the yachting press (and RYA) of putting the frighteners on us without going into more depth on the subjects, but I suppose that in truth it's up to us to get to the bottom of it. I know that Sailorman was ace last year over ATIS, perhaps some of our Dutch forumites could help us with some firm details on this particular niggle.

 

[Leighb]

thats perfectly ok as the Dutch havnt yet mastered the Art of Good Cheese Making have they.

You cannot have tasted Oude Gouda then. Great cheese, real flavour and keeps for ages unless of course you eat it all at once .

 

[sailorman]

You cannot have tasted Oude Gouda then. Great cheese, real flavour and keeps for ages unless of course you eat it all at once .

Might Have even been to Gouda on market day waiting for the bridge to be repaired
all the rest tastes the same & very salty.

 

[MoodySabre]

As far as I understand nobody uses their VHF in Holland anyway as communication is by mobile phone. Anyway in preparation for 6 weeks there this year I have had my SH handheld reprogrammed for ATIS for £32 and will leave my old non-DSC but perfecty fine fixed VHF switched off.

 

[sailorman]

As far as I understand nobody uses their VHF in Holland anyway as communication is by mobile phone. Anyway in preparation for 6 weeks there this year I have had my SH handheld reprogrammed for ATIS for £32 and will leave my old non-DSC but perfecty fine fixed VHF switched off.

nobody will notice
keep looking over the stern the barges dont hang about