Foot rope. Huh?

zoidberg

zoidberg

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May I inquire of those deeply experienced among us regarding what you... er, me... might expect of a sailmaker when you specify 'loose-footed' and 'no reef-points' fitted in the body of the sail?

Would you be pleased to note that a kindly sailmaker-loft had stitched in a foot boltrope, and three rows of diamond-patched eyelets for reefing cords across the sail....? That the luff length on the new sail was 17cm longer than the old one ( supplied for comparison ) ....and that ONE luff slide had been provided within a couple of feet of the headboard when TWO had been specified as that area would be subjected to high loads when deep-reefed in heavy weather.....?
 
What might I expect?

A new post here from somebody who ordered a sail with "stitched in a foot boltrope, and three rows of diamond-patched eyelets for reefing cords across the sail.... etc" and had instead received what you had ordered!

Seriously though, if what I received was not what I ordered I would expect the sailmaker (as with any supplier of goods) to supply what he was contracted to supply.
 
I had a similar experience with reefing points and a well known sailmaker. It wan discussed, nicely, and the sail was replaced. I have since placed further orders with them since. If you have an order form that states 'no reefing points', clearly that's what you should receive, regardless of the other points. Do you have an order form with the specs on or was it verbally specified.
 
There are so many discrepancies that it does sound as though there has been a mix up somewhere .
 
Thistle said:
Start by discussing the discrepancies in a no-blame fashion with the sail loft concerned?
Click to expand...

I get that one should avoid going in all guns blazing, but I would quibble (in a no-blame fashion, of course!) with your choice of words there.

If one orders x, and receives y, could this possibly a result of pure chance, or the actions or omissions of anyone but the supplier?
 
JB1966 said:
I had a similar experience with reefing points and a well known sailmaker. It wan discussed, nicely, and the sail was replaced. I have since placed further orders with them since. If you have an order form that states 'no reefing points', clearly that's what you should receive, regardless of the other points. Do you have an order form with the specs on or was it verbally specified.
Click to expand...

It WAS discussed in detail and specified sitting with the Managing Director of the long-established firm at last year's Southampton Boat Show. I had made a 120 mile round trip specifically for that purpose. Towards the end of last year I queried the lack of info on progress and, as a specific request by one of the production staff, I again provided details of the available Hoist/Luff or 'P' and the same for the Foot/'E'. He/they requested I provide them with the old mainsail - although they had the original designer's specifications - and I made a 500 mile round trip to deliver this to them myself. There were several further tele-conversations with staff and I formed the impression that the notes of our conversations taken by the MD - if any - had not been made available to his staff....

There's more.

One week after my first visit to SIBS in early September, I made another 120 mile visit to this sailmaker's stand, and brought my wife along. This time, we discussed in detail, specified and agreed with the MD another order - for a genoa and a working jib this time, both to set on furlers. My lady was persuaded to part with the deposit.

That was 10 months ago. Despite my querying progress several times, no work has even started on either headsail.

D'you think it was something I said...?
 
I'd try and get the main sorted out first, in the amicable ways suggested above. A polite letter setting out what's wrong and asking how they expect to deal with it.

Once that's resolved, one way or the other, you can write a "time is of the essesnce" letter for the other sails (it isn't unless the original contract says so) and, if your reasonable demand for a delivery date isn't met, cancel. If they're slow to refund the deposit, talk to your CC company.
 
LittleSister said:
I get that one should avoid going in all guns blazing, but I would quibble (in a no-blame fashion, of course!) with your choice of words there.

If one orders x, and receives y, could this possibly a result of pure chance, or the actions or omissions of anyone but the supplier?
Click to expand...

You're assuming everything WAS clearly specified by the customer, with no ambiguity, no late changes etc, to confuse the supplier.
 
I ordered a 100% high cut Yankee to replace a worn out 135% Genoa at SIBS about twelve years ago. The boat manual for the boat in question, an Island Packet 350, was superb and had full rigging and sail dimensions from the OE sail supplier, Elvstrom.

The company in question poo-poohed these and insisted in doing their own measuring.

An order form was completed and a sail built.

When supplied it was too long in the luff and had the UV strip on the wrong side.

Getting it put right was not easy and unlike my own companies philosophy when we sold a motorbike " Sir - if you get a problem we will fix it quick and fix it with a smile! " it was some time before it was rather acrimoniously sorted.

Last year Pete Sanders made me a 175% Reacher, It fitted perfectly and is a great light wind sail.

I shall use him in future.
 
I think you should expect what you asked for. I had a main and Genoa made for my boat last winter by Grant Piggott at Warsash. Both made on time, at a good price, exactly as agreed and they set perfectly.
 
rotrax said:
I ordered a 100% high cut Yankee to replace a worn out 135% Genoa at SIBS about twelve years ago. The boat manual for the boat in question, an Island Packet 350, was superb and had full rigging and sail dimensions from the OE sail supplier, Elvstrom.

The company in question poo-poohed these and insisted in doing their own measuring.

An order form was completed and a sail built.

When supplied it was too long in the luff and had the UV strip on the wrong side.

Getting it put right was not easy and unlike my own companies philosophy when we sold a motorbike " Sir - if you get a problem we will fix it quick and fix it with a smile! " it was some time before it was rather acrimoniously sorted.

Last year Pete Sanders made me a 175% Reacher, It fitted perfectly and is a great light wind sail.

I shall use him in future.
Click to expand...
I had a similar 'difficulty' with a new main that didn't fit, despite their own man measuring up - nearly eight months after the initial order.
Excuses were "You measured incorrectly", then "We found the measurement were standard, so used the manufacturer's sizes" and "It's set high for safety".
They finally took it back and made it fit the boom, at least. Certainly have not used this Wroxham-based company since.

My genoa was made by Pete Sanders, later that year - perfect fit & took less than six weeks to arrive. Much better!
 
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