Flying a flag

[BabaYaga]

Just flying the flag as I pointed out is only an indicator of the nationality of the ship. It is the registration document that is the proof.. The OP needs to speak to his register about temporary registration (as you can in the UK) if possible, or register in another state for the delivery trip. Better to take advice from people who deal with this sort of issue such as local dealers or yacht brokers. sure he is not the first person who has this problem.

I agree the OP has to make sure that he carries the relevant documents for the passage.
Temporary registration or registration in another state only for this trip appears to me to be a bit over the top, unless any of the likely involved states (Finland, Estonia, Latvia, all EU members) has the registration of visiting yachts as a requirement for entry. Worth checking up.
However, the subject of this thread was 'what flag to fly?'
As by the example given in post #38, registration in a nations's boat register does not necessarily bring the right to fly that nations flag.
So what is the 'nationality' of a boat that is registered in Finland but owned by a non citizen?
The subject for another thread, perhaps.

 

[Graham376]

Just flying the flag as I pointed out is only an indicator of the nationality of the ship. It is the registration document that is the proof.. The OP needs to speak to his register about temporary registration (as you can in the UK) if possible, or register in another state for the delivery trip. Better to take advice from people who deal with this sort of issue such as local dealers or yacht brokers. sure he is not the first person who has this problem.

A friend of ours has recently purchased a mobo in Spain and the previous owner cancelled registration. New owner will be applying for Polish registration but at the moment it's unregistered. He had a problem with one transport company who wouldn't cross the Portuguese border with it but fortunately, another did. Just hoping authorities don't do one of their random yard inspections.

 

[DownWest]

On the subject mentioned earlier about minimum size for registration. Here in France, 'beach toys' like inflatable kayaks/ paddle boards are limited to 300mtrs from a beach. Further, then registration. Tenders get away with 300 mtrs from the beach or the mother ship, so 600 mtrs.
Otherwise, registration and insurance. And, if a primary propulsion is an engine, a driving licence for over 9hp (not sure about this, used to be 6hp)
When I registered my home built fearing, it was free, with the stipulation I did not sell it before five years from first launch. When I quizzed the guy about the five years, he said 'By then, it will be proven, and it's your neck up till then.' That, in theory, works up to 24 mtrs.
For the OP, a bit of information about where would have helped.. But if UK based, he could just get an SSR and fly the Red Ensign (sorry, wear)
If in the baltic, try a message to 'refueler' of this parish. He is based around there.

 

[Buck Turgidson]

The vessel is unregistered whether he flies a flag or not. In doing so he's is declaring the boat to be registered which it is not. He would be entering territorial waters in an unregistered vessel falsely claiming to be registered.
Make of that what you will!

 

[Buck Turgidson]

On the subject mentioned earlier about minimum size for registration. Here in France, 'beach toys' like inflatable kayaks are limited to 300mtrs from a beach. Further, then registration. Tenders get away with 300 mtrs from the beach or the mother ship, so 600 mtrs.
Otherwise, registration and insurance. And, if a primary propulsion is an engine, a driving licence for over 9hp (not sure about this, used to be 6hp)
When I registered my home built fearing, it was free, with the stipulation I did not sell it before five years from first launch. When I quizzed the guy about the five years, he said 'By then, it will be proven, and it's your neck up till then.' That, in theory, works up to 24 mtrs.

The 5 years is for CE non compliance. It's so people can't build and then sell non CE marked goods. Nothing to do with registration.

 

[DownWest]

The 5 years is for CE non compliance. It's so people can't build and then sell non CE marked goods. Nothing to do with registration.

True, but I rambled on from the 'free' bit... There were questions up in the thread about taking small boats by trailer to the the EU, something that friends in the Dinghy Cruising Ass are concerned about, but more about trailers not complying if home built. usually their boats are SSR reg.

Oh, and back in the pre Br***t days, nobody in the UK payed any attention to the 5 yr rule, as with no registration, there was no verifiable age for a boat. .

 

[awol]

For those UK residents who have dual nationality with an EU country and boat on the UK SSR - what is the best ensign to wear when entering EU waters and do they need to announce their presence/visit a port of entry or just carry on as before B?

 

[Graham376]

For those UK residents who have dual nationality with an EU country and boat on the UK SSR - what is the best ensign to wear when entering EU waters and do they need to announce their presence/visit a port of entry or just carry on as before B?

UK ensign and SSR. To wear EU ensign, the boat will have to be registered there and subject to local regulations, surveys etc. When arriving in or leaving EU, need to go to official port of entry. Once booked in, carry on as normal.

 

[john_morris_uk]

UK ensign and SSR. To wear EU ensign, the boat will have to be registered there and subject to local regulations, surveys etc. When arriving in or leaving EU, need to go to official port of entry. Once booked in, carry on as normal.

A pedant suggests there’s no such thing as an ‘EU Ensign’. There are ensigns of the member states of the EU though.

 

[capnsensible]

Has anybody ever been boarded by the flag police in this or any other state?

Yes. Morocco.

 

[harvey38]

So, as UK registered vessel, I wear/display/fly an ensign at all times when at sea/day light hours irrelevant of what country I am in, I fly a Q flag when entering a port when I need Immigration/Customs clearance
then replace the Q flag with a flag of the country I'm in, correct?

Bloody hell, I much prefer the GB sticker I have on my car

 

[awol]

So, as UK registered vessel, I wear/display/fly an ensign at all times when at sea/day light hours irrelevant of what country I am in, I fly a Q flag when entering a port when I need Immigration/Customs clearance
then replace the Q flag with a flag of the country I'm in, correct?

Bloody hell, I much prefer the GB sticker I have on my car

Your GB sticker is off course now outdated si nce we took back control of something or other. You need to change it before you head forth from this sceptred isle or face the wrath of Johnny Foreigner.

 

[Pump-Out]

I fly a Q flag when entering a port when I need Immigration/Customs clearance
then replace the Q flag with a flag of the country I'm in, correct?

No.
The courtesy flag is flown once entering territorial waters. Ideally from starboard yardarm.
You fly both until having completed immigration stuff, then haul down the Q.
Courtesy flag remains until you leave territorial waters.

 

[john_morris_uk]

No.
The courtesy flag is flown once entering territorial waters. Ideally from starboard yardarm.
You fly both until having completed immigration stuff, then haul down the Q.
Courtesy flag remains until you leave territorial waters.

Indeed. And woe betides you in some places if you fail to follow this simple etiquette/regulation.

 

[Graham376]

Indeed. And woe betides you in some places if you fail to follow this simple etiquette/regulation.

We got a bollocking in Marina Bay Gib one time when I had forgotten to stow the Spanish courtesy flag! Here in Portugal, they require ensign and courtesy flag 24 hours for visiting boats.

 

[Beneteau381]

I manage merchant ships. I have to know this stuff to earn a living. This isn’t etiquette; this is law.

You don’t say where the boat is starting from or going to on this delivery. There is no such thing as a stateless boat. A boat may not be registered by her owner but she still has nationality.

Wars have started over this.

I’m going to answer the simple case: a boat which is owned by a British subject and is not registered is British. In British waters she does not need to wear an ensign. If she does, she must wear the red ensign.

All the other cases are more complicated and I’m not going to write a book. If you want to know about a particular different case, ask away.

* The Second Anglo-Chinese War began with a dispute over the registry of the lorcha “Arrow”.

PBO got a good article this month on it

 

[Kukri]

Has anybody ever been boarded by the flag police in this or any other state?

I wasn’t boarded but I was bollocked through a loud hailer by a Belgian Police launch for tacking into their territorial waters and forgetting to take in my Dutch courtesy flag.