Fly the Union Jack

toad_oftoadhall said:
That's the reality on the South Coast. Too many t**ts about. There's a pedantic dayskipper on every pontoon, rubbernecking about to spot something to whine about. There was a guy on another thread who spent a day photographing boats without motoring cones! John 11:35.

It didn't happen 25 years ago - I blame the RYA.
Click to expand...

It does make you wonder. If I drive a PWC around the Solent with a Union Jack on it I am legal because a PWC is not a boat. Do the same thing on my rib and I am not.

Just who is it that is upset by a flag?

Thanks for the comments of support, fighting fund etc. In true British fashion I shall now consult my lawyer, and do a Health and Safety Risk Assessment to make sure my campaign doesn;t hurt, offend or interest anyone.
 
Woodlouse said:
I think the best reason not to fly the union jack is because the fact that Britain has not one, but three ensigns reflects a fantastic and glorious history in seafaring achievement and dominance.
Click to expand...

Four ensigns, thank you very much. At least.

450px-Scottish_Red_Ensign.svg.png
 
NorthUp said:
No, you may not, any more than you can fly a French flag there, just because you like the look of it.
Click to expand...

That's not quite true. he can't fly a French flag because that would indicate the wrong nationality. He can't fly a union jack (dammit) only because there is a specific provision against that one national flag.
 
toad_oftoadhall said:
........It didn't happen 25 years ago - I blame the RYA.
Click to expand...

Its always happened in leisure boating and was certainly happening 25 years ago. Sailing is still an elitist sport and Britain is still riddled with class. Establishing a non compliance is a particular trait of the elite. I think the RYA are irrelevant with regards to this subject as they have actually tried to bring sailing to all sectors of society.

I suspect that this posting is really about mischief making in the world of forums (there must be a name for it) than a true burning anal desire to fly a so called Union Jack. If the OP is genuine in his banality then they should just get on with their need after all the majority wont give a toss.
 
I support the campaign to fly the union flag for the same reason as you; when abroad the great majority cannot understand why a British yacht is not flying a union jack. Trying to explain the niceties of flag etiquette when abroad is pointless.

If the purpose of a flag is to identify the nationality of the yacht, we should fly a flag that people from other countries recognise.
 
SolentBoy said:
The Union Flag Bill of 2008 (yes that is from our own parliament) says that you can call it the Union Jack or Union Flag - it's up to you.
Click to expand...

You've got a Union Flag called Bill now have you..Just when I was getting used to it being called Jack or Flag. I'm confused. :confused:

Tim
 
temptress said:
A::rolleyes:

Merchant Shipping Act 1995 (c. 21)

......"

(1) The flag which every British ship is entitled to fly is the red ensign (without any defacement or modification) and, subject to subsections (2) and (3) below, no other colours.

(2) Subsection (1) above does not apply to Government ships.

(3) The following are also proper national colours, that is to say—

(a) any colours allowed to be worn in pursuance of a warrant from Her Majesty or from the Secretary of State;

(b) in the case of British ships registered in a relevant British possession, any colours consisting of the red ensign defaced or modified whose adoption for ships registered in that possession is authorised or confirmed by Her Majesty by Order in Council.​

(4) Any Order under subsection (3)(b) above shall be laid before Parliament after being made. "

So you need an act of Parliment to do what you want.............:confused:

the act goes on to define:

"Offences relating to British character of ship

(1) If the master or owner of a ship which is not a British ship does anything, or permits anything to be done, for the purpose of causing the ship to appear to be a British ship then, ,,,,,,

.......
....apply in particular to acts or deliberate omissions as respects—

(a) the flying of a national flag; "
Click to expand...

and a vessel flying the skull and crossbones can be fired on without prior warning.

So why don't we have a whipround and buy a few for the Somalis?
 
BlowingOldBoots said:
I think the RYA are irrelevant with regards to this subject as they have actually tried to bring sailing to all sectors of society.
Click to expand...

I disagree. I think the RYA invented the idea that there were a plethora of 'wrong' ways to go sailing. When I started to sail you went out and did what worked. You certainly didn't look about to see what other people were doing wrong. If anything you looked about for best practice to move yourself up to the front of the fleet not to find a excuse to whine about others.

But yeah, this thread is just one long troll and anyone who doesn't enjoy a good squabble should stay out! :-)
 
Ubergeekian said:
That's not quite true. he can't fly a French flag because that would indicate the wrong nationality. He can't fly a union jack (dammit) only because there is a specific provision against that one national flag.
Click to expand...

Err, Geneva Convention, 1977 Protocol, prohibits use of the Red Cross or UN insignia in false flag ops, but:

"2. Ruses of war are not prohibited. Such ruses are acts which are intended to mislead an adversary or to induce him to act recklessly but which infringe no rule of international law applicable in armed conflict and which are not perfidious because they do not invite the confidence of an adversary with respect to protection under that law. The following are examples of such ruses: the use of camouflage, decoys, mock operations and misinformation... 3. Nothing in this Article or in Article 37, paragraph 1 ( d ), shall affect the existing generally recognized rules of international law applicable to espionage or to the use of flags in the conduct of armed conflict at sea."

So he *can* wear a French ensign - of course, traditionally, it should be hauled down and replaced with the Proper Ensign *just* before opening fire ;-)
 
Sadlermike said:
I support the campaign to fly the union flag for the same reason as you; when abroad the great majority cannot understand why a British yacht is not flying a union jack. Trying to explain the niceties of flag etiquette when abroad is pointless.

If the purpose of a flag is to identify the nationality of the yacht, we should fly a flag that people from other countries recognise.
Click to expand...

Spot on.

I personally would have no problems with removing my Bluey Ensign and hoisting a Union Jack.

However, this might just be a bit previous as the union might soon no longer exist.
 
SolentBoy said:
Did I miss something here? Why is sailing full of pedants?

The Union Flag Bill of 2008 (yes that is from our own parliament) says that you can call it the Union Jack or Union Flag - it's up to you.
Click to expand...

This is a Bill ,not an Act, and I doubt if it will get passed due to constraints on parliamentary time. At present it has no legal standing.
Do any other countries have a maritime flag different to their national flag or are we alone in this?
 
Well I have heard it all now :-
An individual who wants to fly what most regard as the national (Great Britain) flag and reading between the lines doing so with pride, is being blasted for doing so or at least for suggesting it .
What is wrong with some of you ?
This forum is rife with over complication,over reaction , over emphasis, and over the top replies to a simple question.
Are you the ones that tried to stop the flag of St.George being flown by patriots a while ago ?

BUT , I am not deriding to correct usage of marine flags but I do think the replies to the OP could have been treated with a little more eeeerr uuuummm sympathy ( for need of a better word):D

skellythong-1.jpg
 
Last edited:
Flagging

What is wrong with the Red one? It has a nice little 'Union Flag' in the corner so strangers can see who we are. (less it's faded!!)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Other threads that may be of interest

mogmog2
Maxwell windlass 10 VW looks interesting (to a windlass noob)
2 3
Replies
59
Views
1K
mogmog2
mogmog2
EugeneR
Help with getting sold boat data
Replies
8
Views
526
Tranona
T

Share this page

Top