Flash, Bang but...

[Cornishman]

...no Wallop, we hope.
In the latest edition of Navigation News there is an interesting article about attracting attention to yourself if you feel collision might be imminent.
It involves a rocket similar to the para red we all carry, but instead it sets off 5 flash and bang explosions. This almost, but not quite, fulfils Rule 34 (d).
The rocket emits a parachute enhanced to make a good radar target which as it descends sets off the explosions and bright white flashes which occur at about 1 second intervals using a delayed fuse system.
Good idea? Or not?

 

[snowleopard]

It also appeared in last moth's YM. Not too sure about its effectiveness as it would be difficult to get it close enough to the ship for them to notice while still leaving time for effective avoiding action. I'd like to see it tested though, I'm sure it would be more use than a white hand flare.

Bring back the days of the verey pistol when you could shoot a flare onto their bridge!

 

[SteveB_Sigma33]

Bring back the days of the verey pistol when you could shoot a flare onto their bridge!

I bet that gets the attention of the tankers! In fact all shipping in a 100M if the ship goes bang!

Does 1 massive bang cover I'm throwing Schrappnell port, starboard and astern!

 

[peterb]

Yes, but it raises an interesting question.

I assume that the intention of the device is to attract the ship's attention so that it can take avoiding action. How much notice does the ship need? It seems to me that there are several possible cases:

1 The ship has already seen you, and established that there is no collision risk

2 The ship has seen you, established that there is a collision risk and is taking action

3 The ship has seen you but has decided that "might is right"

4 The ship hasn't seen you.

Presumably the 5 star rocket is intended to cover case 4; it won't help in the other cases. So here we have a ship that is apparently on a collision course (since otherwise you wouldn't be bothered), but which has only just seen you (or seen the 5 stars). How much time (and distance) will it need to first assess the risk and then to take avoiding action?

Colregs (Rule 7) tell us to establish the collision risk by taking compass bearings. Anyone who has tried this when crossing a busy shipping lane will know that initially the bearing hardly changes. It's only as the ship comes closer that the bearing starts to change. Presumably the same would apply to the bearing of a small boat seen from a big ship. So how long will it need to wait before it can decide that a collision is in the offing? And will it then have the necessary room to take collision avoidance action?

My worry is that the device will need to be fired early, before a proper assesment of collision risk can be made by the boat If this is so, then it would be necessary to fire a flare for any ship which looks as if it might be on a collision course. I don't know how much the new flare will cost, but I'll bet it's not cheap

Carrying on down a similar thread, I've heard many suggestions as to the minimum acceptable closest distance of approach. Frequently it's suggested that 0.5m is too close. Accepting that as a reasonable figure, and supposing that the ship is doing 25 kn while the boat is doing 5 knots, how far apart will the ships have to be to achieve this CDA? My approximate answer is that the gaps between the ships will need to be at least 5 miles long. Do ships in the Dover TSS have that sort of spacing?

 

[Twister_Ken]

One suspects that the bloke on the bridge will be so gobsmacked looking at the pretty firework and thinking "what the fork was that?" that it'll take a good few seconds for him to realise that it must have come from somewhere, and by then his night vision will be shot to hell.

Maybe the Guy Fawkes special should be used in conjuction with a white handheld, as a sort of "Oi! Mister! I'm over here" technique.

 

[Das_Boot]

Fire red flares directly at the bridge of oncoming vessel our Masters do it when they are on gaurd duties. Usually at fishing boats but sometimes at cargo vessels.

 

[jamesjermain]

Several points here:

1. When a prachute flare goes off, it is too far way from the vessel to pin point it sufficiently for collision avoidance purposes.

3. The sound signal might, however, attract the attention of a watchkeeping officer who would then spot the vessel by its lights or a handheld white flare.

4. A white parachute flare might well be counter productive by distracting the OOW and killing his night vision.

5. If the flare can be seen at more than half a mile there is sufficient visibility for the yacht to take avoiding action anyway, without troubling the ship - and it should.

6. There might be a case for this device in fog, when the rocket might get the flare above low lying fog and the explosion might attract attention to it. But, again, the ship would only have a very general idea of the location of the yacht - insufficiently precise for it to be able to make reliable decisions - it could actually turn into the path of the yacht. However, a sleeping OOW might then turn to the radar and spot the yacht on it

7. If you were becalmed in a shipping lane with a broken engine, the flare and sound signal may attract the attention of approaching ships at sufficient distance for them to take avoiding action. But the pararchute flare and explosions must be followed by a handheld flare on board.

FWIW

 

[Cornishman]

You might get away with that sort of behaviour where you are, but do it down here and you will get a lot more than just an ear full from the CG.

 

[jimi]

I've been really tempted to let one of these

off mid channel at night

 

[Guest]

Red flares ...

Das Boot ... I think means WHITE flares ... as Red are distress jobs.

We used a lot on Seismic ships - we used to fir them at Guard Ships as well ... a lot of em used to kip out ... boring job sallying around oil fields etc. reckon guy used to wake up see us chugging through and without thinking start to try and chase us off ... yeh my a...e !! Take that and go away ... I have 3 mile of cable behind that is worth a fortune and is working for the oil co who pays your bills !!!

Yep - White flares !

Saw one guy fire one on one seismic job I was on ... it hit the deck of a Libyan fish boat ... boy did they jump around !! Then they took tarpaulin of the old rusty gun fitted ahead of wheelhouse .... took a few VHF calls for help to get it sorted.

Them were the days !!