Fischer Panda Generator advice needed

27000 hours out of one of our Cummins onan generators before the oil pump regulator went bad. It’s based on a kubota. Usual servicing. The water flow sensors normally the problem sensor. But a spare is easily carried and the faults easily identified.
I hold them in high regard.
FP’s just aren’t wellput together electrically that’s the route of most problems I think. The small ones especially the 3000 rpm sets just aren’t built to last just built to be compact.
 
rotrax said:
All 1500 RPM Gensets will be better than 3000 RPM ones, quieter by far too.

Our Westerbeke is powered by a Mitsubishi 1 litre three cylinder diesel. All I did to that bit was a service including the impeller,heat exchanger and anodes, new hoses, new glowplugs and new fuel lines. I discarded the simple and small engine mounted fuel filter and now the electric Facet fuel pump supplies the fuel through two large JCB filters, one with a 30 micron element, the other a 10 micron element.

Northern Lights do have a good reputation, that is for sure.

Some friends with a boat like ours have an Onan Genset. The repairman is always out, usually a ' sensor ' problem. Every time its 75 quid call out plus the cost of the fix.

Not for me - if I cant fix it, dont want it on the boat!
Click to expand...

Though the Northern Lights seems to have a slightly better reputation I don't think one could go wrong with the other brand names like Onan, Westerbeke, Kohler. My one objection to Westerbeke after owning two boats with Westerbeke engines, the parts are atrocious. Current engine is a W58 which I discovered is the same block as a Perkins 4.154. Water pump from Westerbeke $290. Identical pump from Perkins $90.
 
We are just about to renew and had whittled it down to between Northern Lights and Cummins Onan when I noticed that Beta Marine do a Kubota based 4 Pole 1500rpm range - The Beta machine also offers easy options including engine beds, exhaust kit, and 24v starter / alternator options (we are 24v onboard) so I have almost settled on the Beta unless somebody has a contrary view?
 
Thank you all for your thoughts. The FP generator has been removed from the boat and I have decided not to spend anymore money on it.

The next phase is to see whether I sell it for scrap or whether someone is interested in buying it as it stands, and the engineer who removed it is looking into that for me.

On the positive side, it's freed up a lot of space in the engine compartment.
 
Whitlock said:
Thank you to everyone who has replied so far. I'm thinking.
Click to expand...
Just a heads up on technical stuff. 50 hz gennies run at multiples of 50 to get he hZ so speed is 3000 rpm.
60 hz runs at multiples of 60 so 3600 is right
HOWEVER if you have been running at 3600, which is too fast for a 50 hz gennie, were you over speeding it? Was that the cause of the broken crank?
 
Beneteau381 said:
Just a heads up on technical stuff. 50 hz gennies run at multiples of 50 to get he hZ so speed is 3000 rpm.
60 hz runs at multiples of 60 so 3600 is right
HOWEVER if you have been running at 3600, which is too fast for a 50 hz gennie, were you over speeding it? Was that the cause of the broken crank?
Click to expand...
If a 2pole 50Hz alternator was running at 3600rpm it would have most likely burnt a few appliances as it would put out in excess of 250VAC.
Unless fancy el. controllers however they are called...
 
Rebecca & Steve said:
We are just about to renew and had whittled it down to between Northern Lights and Cummins Onan when I noticed that Beta Marine do a Kubota based 4 Pole 1500rpm range - The Beta machine also offers easy options including engine beds, exhaust kit, and 24v starter / alternator options (we are 24v onboard) so I have almost settled on the Beta unless somebody has a contrary view?
Click to expand...

we have a beta gen 7 which is good for its power rating of 0.8pf up to 5.6 kw above that the load response isn’t great and the inverter charger in our case will tend to disconnect. - but below that it’s fine. They are quite open about what the sets achieve (times quoted figure by 0.8 and that’s you max output with acceptable frequency deviation)

as regarding the set.It’s easy to work on and based on the same engine as most of the rest anyway. And this particular one has 2500 hours, had a new water pump and that’s about it apart from normal servicing. You need to do the heat exchanger o rings regularly but it says that in the book! The Mecc alt alternators are good for the money. And pretty simple beasts regs are available and cheap to change if required.

parts in the uk are easy and fairly universal and there a good variation of exhaust elbows should that be needed.

it’s a generally fairly low noise set this ones not in a housing and you can barely hear it in the wheel house.

I would personally ask for a dse 3110 control which are a little more sophisticated but still simple. It also allows for a contactor to be used to give warm up and run down periods and inputs for emergency stops which is nice to have.

there is only oil and coolant temp shutdown on the beta, so I would think about an exhaust alarm like the silicone marine ones as a sensible addition.

you don’t generally need the big frame for it so sit on, the feet it comes with standard are fine on a flat surface.

24v option is quite expensive you might consider to have a separate 12v starter battery for the generator. That’s nice in some ways anyway. The isolated earth return option is to be avoided unless you need it (lots more to go wrong!)
 
jwfrary said:
we have a beta gen 7 which is good for its power rating of 0.8pf up to 5.6 kw above that the load response isn’t great and the inverter charger in our case will tend to disconnect. - but below that it’s fine. They are quite open about what the sets achieve (times quoted figure by 0.8 and that’s you max output with acceptable frequency deviation)

as regarding the set.It’s easy to work on and based on the same engine as most of the rest anyway. And this particular one has 2500 hours, had a new water pump and that’s about it apart from normal servicing. You need to do the heat exchanger o rings regularly but it says that in the book! The Mecc alt alternators are good for the money. And pretty simple beasts regs are available and cheap to change if required.

parts in the uk are easy and fairly universal and there a good variation of exhaust elbows should that be needed.

it’s a generally fairly low noise set this ones not in a housing and you can barely hear it in the wheel house.

I would personally ask for a dse 3110 control which are a little more sophisticated but still simple. It also allows for a contactor to be used to give warm up and run down periods and inputs for emergency stops which is nice to have.

there is only oil and coolant temp shutdown on the beta, so I would think about an exhaust alarm like the silicone marine ones as a sensible addition.

you don’t generally need the big frame for it so sit on, the feet it comes with standard are fine on a flat surface.

24v option is quite expensive you might consider to have a separate 12v starter battery for the generator. That’s nice in some ways anyway. The isolated earth return option is to be avoided unless you need it (lots more to go wrong!)
Click to expand...


That is very useful information, thank you for taking the time to post it all. We will go for the Beta and take heed of the points you make. Thanks again.
 
Whitlock said:
4 years ago I had a Fischer Panda 4000S diesel generator installed on my boat at considerable expense and it was beset with problems from day one. It has turned out to be an expensive mistake.

The engine part of the generator is a Farymann 15W/18W and after 3000 hours the crankshaft broke and the engine is a write off.

I don't want to waste any more money having the engine rebuilt so will either sell the whole thing for scrap, which it is at the moment, or find another engine.

Here is my question:
Is there an engine that I can buy (not Farymann) that will drive the generator part which is still working well?
Click to expand...
I just realised you are doing 750 hours a year on your generator! That is massive use. what are you running that needs that many hours? As liveaboards we only use ours for making water and running power tools and the vacuum cleaner. We do less than 100 hrs per 9 month season. Using a generator that hard may need something more commercially orientated
 
geem said:
I just realised you are doing 750 hours a year on your generator! That is massive use. what are you running that needs that many hours? As liveaboards we only use ours for making water and running power tools and the vacuum cleaner. We do less than 100 hrs per 9 month season. Using a generator that hard may need something more commercially orientated
Click to expand...


Well picked up!

My used Westerbeke has only 1570 hours and it was twelve years old when purchased.

We use it for an hour each morning when on the hook or away from shorepower, a tank of hot water for showers, boil the electric kettle - save gas - and give the batteries a kick. If we need power tools or the vaccum cleaner It gets put on again. 100 hours each year perhaps.

That use of the FP is almost two hours per day, every day, 365.

Far too much for a 3,000 RPM unit IMHO. :(
 
geem said:
... Using a generator that hard may need something more commercially orientated
Click to expand...
Which is what I was led to believe that it was good for. We live aboard and I prefer to use a generator for battery charging rather than the boat engine.
We believe in being comfortable and use about 1Kwh of power in a normal day. In the summer our solar provides all of that now, but in the darker days a generator for 3 or 4 hours is the answer for us.
Now using a Hyundai suitcase generator which cost £500 and I can buy 14 of those for what the FP cost to buy and be installed. When the Hyundai wears out I'll buy another one.
Who in their right mind would pay that much for a diesel generator if they new that it was only good for a few thousand hours?
For those who are worried about the rpm. The FP rpm is/was controlled at 3000, no doubt, but I believe that the engine itself had a potential for 3,600 rpm.
Water under the bridge now.
 
You were sold the wrong kit for the job IMHO.
:(
Or you chose the wrong kit for the job.

jwfrary states 27,000 Hours from his 1500 RPM Genset.

Our used Westerbeke came off a disco/tripboat on the River Dee at Chester. The 8KW output proved marginal so a larger one was fitted and we were lucky to win it for a maiden bid on ebay.

If using a petrol suitcase generator, please be VERY aware of wind direction and exhaust fumes.

CO poisoning is a terrible thing.
 
rotrax said:
You were sold the wrong kit for the job IMHO.
:(
Or you chose the wrong kit for the job.

jwfrary states 27,000 Hours from his 1500 RPM Genset.

.
Click to expand...
If I was running for the kind of hours the OP does I would look for a 1500rpm unit probably from Northern Lights or Koeler. Their 3 cylinder units are reliable and cost effective. You will need space to locate such unit. The attraction of the FP generators is their tiny footprint but they are a toy compared to a proper low revving machine.
 
geem said:
If I was running for the kind of hours the OP does I would look for a 1500rpm unit probably from Northern Lights or Koeler. Their 3 cylinder units are reliable and cost effective. You will need space to locate such unit. The attraction of the FP generators is their tiny footprint but they are a toy compared to a proper low revving machine.
Click to expand...


Our boat was designed with a genset as an likely extra.

It has a dedicated - and quite large - Generator Garage.

We were very lucky - the first owner never ordered a Genset but the boat came with 250KG's of lead ballast ready installed to balance a genset.

Nice ?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page

Top