First time cruiser

[LittleSister]

All of the above suggestions could be fine (though none as good as a Samphire 23, of course!), there's a wide range of potentially suitable boats. Best to chose primarily on the basis of condition (there are a lot of rough boats out there, and only a few gems).

If you're sailing mainly in the Alde, having a shallow draft will be a major advantage - whether lifting keel/centre-plate, bilge keel or shoal draft single keel (like the Samphire 23, for instance!).

I'd say make sure whatever you buy is easy to sell again. You will almost certainly have a clearer idea of what you want, and change your priorities, after a year or two. If you can sell your boat easily that'll enable you to move on to something more to your emerging tastes, if you are still content with your first boat you have lost nothing.

I'd second the suggestion you get some training in navigation, etc. (e.g. RYA Dayskipper Theory).

 

[armchairsailor]

Four-21 is a nice one too, if you can find one. Came in bilge or fin config, tough as old boots, sail decently (sails herself too), packed a lot in for <22', straight transom ready for your new outboard too if the engine has packed up.

 

[Seajet]

Some observations on boats mentioned;

J24, nice racing boat round the cans but daft for the OP

Seal 22 - check the coachroof configuration, a lot have a silly very sloped removable wooden cockpit bulkhead which drastically reduces accomodation and never struck me as very seaworthy ( I have sailed in company with them ).

Hurley 24 - check the keel with the boat raised ! There was one at my club and the keel wobbled like a jelly, visibly wobbling laterally as the hoist slowly trundled to and from the slip, it became something everyone crowded around to watch; I have no idea if it's a common problem but would seem to be a structural issue, there was no damage or repair evident on the boat in question.

 

[Seajet]

tzread,

a new trailer for a 22'ish boat will be around £3000+.

If it's just for delivery to your sailing grounds, sailing her there with help from an experienced chum or forumite may well be possible, otherwise a flat bed lorry with a hi-ab is often the answer.

NB the police are hot on towed boats, and to be legal often requires something like a RangeRover.

With all lift keel boats an inspection of the keel lowered with boat in a hoist is vital, as plates are often neglected, especially with boats on trailers.

I keep my lift keeler on home made trestles every winter, they're high enough to allow lowering the keel for maintenance, easy to make and stow flat when not in use, I send the simple plans to Anderson owners, a lot of whom use them now.

The boat is lifted on and off the trestles at the sailing club, I have never fancied the cost, hassle and keel maintenance problems of a trailer, a friend with an A22 alternates between trestles at the club one winter, trailing her home the next, but he has adapted his trailer to allow lowering the keel, and never ever puts the trailer in salt water, he has the boat hoisted on and off the trailer.

 

[photodog]

Have you thought about a samphire 23? Nice boats, ideal for the Alde...

 

[Way]

Some observations on boats mentioned;

J24, nice racing boat round the cans but daft for the OP

Seal 22 - check the coachroof configuration, a lot have a silly very sloped removable wooden cockpit bulkhead which drastically reduces accomodation and never struck me as very seaworthy ( I have sailed in company with them ).

Hurley 24 - check the keel with the boat raised ! There was one at my club and the keel wobbled like a jelly, visibly wobbling laterally as the hoist slowly trundled to and from the slip, it became something everyone crowded around to watch; I have no idea if it's a common problem but would seem to be a structural issue, there was no damage or repair evident on the boat in question.

Seajet are you referring to a bilge keeler or centerplate/lift keel? As a couple of us have said re our own 24/70s theyre encapsulated keels so wobble is really impossible (the fins that is)

 

[prv]

how would one transport it

If it's relatively nearby, sail it, but this sized boat could potentially take a long time to cover serious miles so unless you're retired and in need of an adventure, a flatbed lorry is the usual way. Get one with a built-in HIAB crane so it can pick up and set the boat down anywhere; otherwise you'll be paying extra for cranes each end which is just silly. Big HIABs have serious reach - to collect our old boat the lorry had to park on the other side of a farmyard slurry pit, reach across and pick up the boat. That boat was 3.5 tonnes which is pretty heavy for a 24-footer.

Pete

 

[Cbjroms]

Just made the transition from a dinghy (Laser Std) to an 18ft pocket cruiser (Sunstar 18) myself.

The sailing, of course, is just the same but feels much, much slower but proprtionally more comfortable! Still getting used to the unease as the boat heels and there is no potential for hiking-out!

Not sure about the outboard arguments above, especially as I am on a swing mooring. I have a 6hp Tohatsu SailDrive hanging-off the back and it is a bit of a pain. Too heavy to lift on/off and thus a pretty obvious attraction to the local thieves. I would prefer a well maintained inboard really.

Where are you by the way?

 

[BruceDanforth]

I waste quite a long time looking for a decent Sonata. My price bracket was similar and all the ones I saw for that price were pretty comprehensively shagged.

You could add a Seal 22 to your list. There is one on Apollo Duck just now that looks OK. This will feal more like a proper little yacht than a dinghy with it's inboard diesel. Although those can be a mixed blessing as Dylan found.

And another one to look at is a Hunter Sonata. These get raced a fair bit so there is an active market. A bit more performance but not so easy to trail and sail.

 

[BruceDanforth]

When I went down this route a couple of years ago I decided to look for something with an outboard as I couldn't afford to replace an inboard installation and without a knackered rusty trailer that would cost as much to put right as the boat.

I think i will stick with looking for something within sailing distance. OTherwise my budget will end up getting smaller as i would have to cover transport costs as well and a low loader doesn't sound cheap. I'm sailing on the river alde in aldeburgh suffolk, but with the view of going out onto southwold or woodbridge when i gain confidence.

 

[photodog]

I think i will stick with looking for something within sailing distance. OTherwise my budget will end up getting smaller as i would have to cover transport costs as well and a low loader doesn't sound cheap. I'm sailing on the river alde in aldeburgh suffolk, but with the view of going out onto southwold or woodbridge when i gain confidence.

I know of a very nice samphire 23 in your neck of the woods... I believe the owner is looking to sell....

 

[Tam Lin]

As you are going to be sailing on the East Coast have you had a look at Andy Seedhouse in Woodbridge? He has a lot of older and cheaper boats in all conditions and has a website. We always stroll around his yard when we are up that way!

 

[TQA]

As you are going to be sailing on the East Coast have you had a look at Andy Seedhouse in Woodbridge? He has a lot of older and cheaper boats in all conditions and has a website. We always stroll around his yard when we are up that way!

Just had a look at his site. There is a Jaguar 22 lift keel advertised for £1995. I would go and have a shuftie at that. Sail it for a year then decide if you like it, if not it will be easy to resell.

 

[LittleSister]

I know of a very nice samphire 23 in your neck of the woods... I believe the owner is looking to sell....

Well, that was the plan (with the emphasis on the 'was'!). As it turned out we have made shamefully little progress on the Samphire 26 'renovation project' we bought for reasons that now elude me. Can't face a season without a boat on the water. Hence our treasured Samphire 23 has not been marketed, has just gone back in the water, and we are off this weekend for a jolly around the East Coast (unless I can sneak us over to Holland while the First Mate is snoozing!).

Might put the 23 on the market at the end of the season, but at the moment not really thinking beyond Ore or Blackwater first next week (or Oosterschelde! )?

 

[PaulJS]

Hi tzread,

Did you see the thread about a gentleman called Bill Serjeant in the PBO forum? Apparently he's selling a West Wight Potter which might be smaller than you're looking for, but is a trailer sailer.

http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?367952-Bill-Serjeant-Pottering-On-A-Budget

I don't know anything about these boats but just happened to notice your thread and this one and thought I ought to point it out.

Paul

 

[jac]

So i took someones advice on here and looked at andy seedhouse and found some boats which fit my bill. My next question is what sort of annual costs are associated with the boat? So far i have got, insurance, petrol costs, mooring, lifting out of the water and storing on land over winter, anti fouling......... anything else? Also how much is anti fouling going to come to, and do you HAVE to do it every year? Are there any costs which would be associated with outboards but not inboards and vice versa?

Re Anti Fouling. No you don't HAVE to do it every year but it does make sense. AF wears off and then you end up with a forest growing underneath which will slow you down. As for cost, not too bad, look around for deals, a single can should do you. All in if you spend £100 I'd be surprised. Of course your can go the whole hog and pay someone to do it for you and 5 times as much but no need.

As for other costs you've probably got most of them but there are some others to consider - e.g. Will you join a club? - membership fees. Does mooring include car parking for the car - if not where will you park that. Will you need a dinghy to get out to the boat? Where will that be stored and how much?

Also worth putting some aside each year for general titivation of the boat, e,g, polishing hull, scraping and varnishing woodwork, replacing worn lines, tired fenders.
Other costs will be having sails laundered and repaired - depends on size but £200 should cover it (depends on condition as well) plus servicing engine. £100 max if DIY - £300 if paying someone. Anodes - maybe £20 depending on size.

Then it's really replacing worn out bits and upgrading as required.

 

[Seajet]

So i took someones advice on here and looked at andy seedhouse and found some boats which fit my bill. My next question is what sort of annual costs are associated with the boat? So far i have got, insurance, petrol costs, mooring, lifting out of the water and storing on land over winter, anti fouling......... anything else? Also how much is anti fouling going to come to, and do you HAVE to do it every year? Are there any costs which would be associated with outboards but not inboards and vice versa?

Tzread, yes antifouling has to be done every winter, it's around £60-70 for the required 2 coats on a 22 footer.

Beware of the costs of having the boat lifted out at Autumn and back in the Spring, a good sailing club will make you aware of this and be much cheaper than a marina !

The good thing about boats under 26' is that with an outboard engine in a well you can take the engine home to work on or even replace it, while old inboards can be a financial nightmare - ask me how I know !

I was contacted by someone looking at A. Seedhouses's place, he was a novice who had spotted an Anderson 22 there ( I run the A22 owners' association ).

I happened to have seen and been on the boat in question, the worst built shabbiest example of the class !

When I phoned up on behalf of the potential buyer asking for an inventory, the reply was " Oh we don't do inventories " ;- ' well can you at least tell me if it's got an anchor ? '----" Oh we have a secondhand shop with a few anchors " ...

Unsurprisingly, no sale.