Fall arrester

[ean_p]

You didn't read the link. No it doesn't. The link reinforces the fact that suspension trauma is not a thing.

Mmmmm that's not what I read........I read it as saying that the syndrome is proven in a lab environment ( symptoms including feeling faint, dizzy, palpitations, sweating, nausea and loss of vision. Loss of consciousness has occurred after a variable amount of time from 7 to 30 min. etc) but there is no definitive proof of death in the field.
Anecdotally it refers to 'Between 1957 and 1968, post-mortems were carried out on people killed in mountain‐climbing accidents, of which five climbers who were left hanging on the rope had no obvious external or internal injuries to account for their deaths. The explanation was that they may have died from suspension trauma.' You perhaps have a different reason as to why they died that a PM was unable to find?
It concludes that significant occurrence is now prevented by good harness design and understanding of the potential. That isn't the same as saying it doesn't exist!
Moving on, it is suggested in the link that the syndrome isn't just a function of harness design though obviously it may be alleviated and or exacerbated by the design and resultant body positioning . but it goes on to mention the well recorded issues of standing vertically motionless for a significant time and also of being suspended more or less vertically using our 'sit bones' yet still motionless. As in;
'In other research, symptoms have been reproduced in healthy volunteers using passive tilt table tests with a head‐up tilt of 50° from the horizontal, with the subject supported by a bicycle saddle. This resulted in hypotension, bradycardia and presyncopal symptoms in 69 out of 79 (87%) subjects within 1 h '

Suspension Trauma: A Clinical Review

 

[geem]

Even in recreational climbing they are supposed to be retired, so you may want to look into buying a replacement. It may be expensive, but if it's degraded it won't be safe. Stitching is likely to be the first bit to go, and it'll go suddenly.

We inspect it regularly. Its seriously over engineered. Compare it to my climbing harness and its about 10 times more robust.

 

[Graham_Wright]

I've got this bit for years now. Stainless steel, works well (haven't actually fallen, but tested it of course). Brilliant because it opens, so you can clip it on an existing halyard pulled taut. It's secured against accidental opening.

I've added a bit of rubber to it so it doesn't scratch up the anodizing on the mast.

I use one during my very frequent mast climbs. Highly recommended.

However you climb

DO NOT USE AN ELECTRIC WINCH!

We have heard several nasty accidents over our years of demonstrations (which have now come to an end) but only last week, met someone missing fingers for the well-reported reasons.

 

[Graham_Wright]

However you climb DO NOT USE AN ELECTRIC WINCH!

We have heard several nasty accidents over our years of demonstrations (which have now come to an end) but only last week, met someone missing fingers for the well-reported reasons.

It is a very good question. There have been some epic rescues of people stuck up masts. Suspension trauma (blood pooling and shock) is real.

a. If there are steps, climb down.

b. If were hoisted on a halyard, that means something broke. You are hanging from a back-up halyard. Can that be lowered? Is there another halyard? The assumption is you have a helper.

c. If you were using rope climbing gear something broke. If you have a helper, can they raise one of the halyard ends to you, transfer your weight, and lower? Alternatively, can you rig a rappel with the gear you have, and do you know how to transfer your weight to it?

d. Muscle cramps are another possibility. See c.

If the rope and grabs are in good enough shape to use, failure is a million to one. Focus on using the gear. All of the cases of getting stuck I know of relate to being hoisted with a bosuns chair and a pulley freezing or similar. Hopefully there is another halyard you can transfer to.

All of these require being cool-headed, and experince helps. Carrying a spare sling and a few carabiners can be very helpful. Also a haul line for tools can drag up more rope and whatever you need.

I had climbed rock for a good many years before climbing my first mast, so the contingency stuff seemed obvious.

PLUS - if you are in danger of a heart attack, do not tie yourself on.
Nasty story with that one.

 

[lustyd]

I've got this bit for years now. Stainless steel, works well (haven't actually fallen, but tested it of course). Brilliant because it opens, so you can clip it on an existing halyard pulled taut. It's secured against accidental opening.

I've added a bit of rubber to it so it doesn't scratch up the anodizing on the mast.

That is a very expensive and less flexible prussik knot.

 

[geem]

However you climb DO NOT USE AN ELECTRIC WINCH!

We have heard several nasty accidents over our years of demonstrations (which have now come to an end) but only last week, met someone missing fingers for the well-reported reasons.


PLUS - if you are in danger of a heart attack, do not tie yourself on.
Nasty story with that one.

We also know of some serious injuries using ST electric winches. The reason why we use the rope drum on the windlass. Lots of space to stand well back whilst you use it. No fingers near by and no risk of over running if winch stuck on. Nothing is without risk when climbing the mast. Use judgement and be sensible

 

[srm]

Lowering the mast at anchor (rolling) sounds dubious.

I can only remember one seriously rolly anchorage, a bay in the Isle of Man in gale conditions with a beam on swell set up by the tide stream outside the bay. Otherwise, as I prefer a good night's sleep, the majority of my anchorages, over nearly 50 years, have been well sheltered. However, back in the days of the sailing drifters the main mast was routinely lowered at sea so that the boat could ride to the nets at night then raised to sail the catch to land. Obviously, a case of being correctly set up.

I made the comment partly tongue in cheek, but did once lower a tabernacle stepped mast (in the marina) to investigate a mast head problem. It was fortunate that I did as it took a few hours work to fix.

 

[thinwater]

Even in recreational climbing they are supposed to be retired, so you may want to look into buying a replacement. It may be expensive, but if it's degraded it won't be safe. Stitching is likely to be the first bit to go, and it'll go suddenly.

Yes ... and no.

5 years in industry (6000 hours) and 12 years by an individual (maybe 20 hours) don't even compare.

Harness do NOT deteriorate due to age alone. Not at all (I have tested old stock, and unlike rubber, 20-year old nylon and polyester tend to test like new). Same with climbing ropes. It is UV and abrasion. One of the best indicators is actually fading of printed instructions. The critical failure point is the tie-in point; it can be chafed by the rope, but this takes thousands of climbs to get serious.

Yes, inspect closely, but unless you use it every week, don't worry.

 

[thinwater]

That is a very expensive and less flexible prussik knot.

But a prusik will not follow you up and down as you climb. It requires letting go (not fun if the boat is rolling) and it requires stopping climbing (breaks your rhythm, wastes energy).

Goblin or ASAP, if quality matters.

 

[Daverw]

Looking at many off the types of harness / seats used many of them very dubious and I would not like to be stuck up in many. My wife who normally goes up in a climbing harness with myself hoisting her works well, if I needed to go up would use my full harness from work, as others have said these are very designed but expensive, my latest one I think was over £500, luckily I don’t have pay for it

 

[Daverw]

Also suggest that climbing is also not hanging as we are when up the mast, I’ve been on courses with many high access guys, most young and fit and many can tell stories where they have come close to issues and mist companies now have working / hanging times limited

 

[thinwater]

Also suggest that climbing is also not hanging as we are when up the mast, I’ve been on courses with many high access guys, most young and fit and many can tell stories where they have come close to issues and mist companies now have working / hanging times limited

^^ This. Recretional climbing harnesses are not optimized for mast work. They just are not.

If using a rec climbing harness, add distribution to the leg loops by inserting a bit of stiff foam (like exersize mat tiles) ~ 4" wide inside and duct taping in place. It really helps.

 

[Poey50]

^^ This. Recretional climbing harnesses are not optimized for mast work. They just are not.

If using a rec climbing harness, add distribution to the leg loops by inserting a bit of stiff foam (like exersize mat tiles) ~ 4" wide inside and duct taping in place. It really helps.

Also buy 'big wall' versions with the very wide leg straps. Placing the right foot against the mast allows the left thigh strap tension against the thigh to be eased allowing blood flow, and vice versa. Alternating like that allows a longer stay.

 

[geem]

Also buy 'big wall' versions with the very wide leg straps. Placing the right foot against the mast allows the left thigh strap tension against the thigh to be eased allowing blood flow, and vice versa. Alteratng like that allows a longer stay.

Even with a relatively comfy professional harness, if I know I will be up the mast for a while I also use a traditional wooden bosons chair. Adjusted correctly I can sit on the chair and wear the harness. Vastly more comfortable

 

[lustyd]

Harness do NOT deteriorate due to age alone

Completely at odds with what the manufacturers say. It's not exactly an expensive item so seems sensible to follow their recommendation. Stitching absolutely does degrade, we all see that on boat stuff all the time. I wouldn't bet my life on jackstays not degrading so why would I do it for the sake of a £50 harness?

 

[lustyd]

But a prusik will not follow you up and down as you climb. It requires letting go (not fun if the boat is rolling) and it requires stopping climbing (breaks your rhythm, wastes energy).

Goblin or ASAP, if quality matters.

Did you click the link? I very much doubt that one will either.

 

[thinwater]

Completely at odds with what the manufacturers say. It's not exactly an expensive item so seems sensible to follow their recommendation. Stitching absolutely does degrade, we all see that on boat stuff all the time. I wouldn't bet my life on jackstays not degrading so why would I do it for the sake of a £50 harness?

But they won't show you data. Of course, they will recommend replacement, even if has been on the shelf for 5 years. Liability and sales volume.

Do you leave the harness in the sun, like boat stuff? Not more than a few hours in a year, and not more than a work week for a laborer compared to your use in in 15 years. If I took it cragging every weekend for 5 years, that is MUCH different from your use.

You are comparing apples with hand grenades; only a superficial resemblance, but different principles.

---

Instead, go to the local crag, talk to the expereinced (50 plus) climbers, and see what they say. Ask them how many HOURS they put on a harness before retirement.

 

[Poey50]

Completely at odds with what the manufacturers say. It's not exactly an expensive item so seems sensible to follow their recommendation. Stitching absolutely does degrade, we all see that on boat stuff all the time. I wouldn't bet my life on jackstays not degrading so why would I do it for the sake of a £50 harness?

Two seasons ago I changed my sit harness that I bought for vertical caving in the Picos in ... er ... 1979. It was washed after trips and stored in the dark. Looked absolutely fine but I thought going beyond four decades might be pushing it. I still use the Petzl jammers for mast work that I bought at the same time.

 

[Spanjaard]

Yes ... and no.

5 years in industry (6000 hours) and 12 years by an individual (maybe 20 hours) don't even compare.

Harness do NOT deteriorate due to age alone. Not at all (I have tested old stock, and unlike rubber, 20-year old nylon and polyester tend to test like new). Same with climbing ropes. It is UV and abrasion. One of the best indicators is actually fading of printed instructions. The critical failure point is the tie-in point; it can be chafed by the rope, but this takes thousands of climbs to get serious.

Yes, inspect closely, but unless you use it every week, don't worry.

I wasg told that impacted equipment due to the shock of direct arrest while on a fall would be sufficient to comdemn any harness, rope or lanyards even if they look allright.

I've got a few pieces of equipment from confined space work and for working at heights. All stiching looks good with no cuts or signs of abrassions; however I did ask if the equipment was comnemned or just deemed old.

If the later I definetely would use it. If comdemned I would get the knife and cut it to pieces to prevent anyone re-use it.

 

[geem]

Completely at odds with what the manufacturers say. It's not exactly an expensive item so seems sensible to follow their recommendation. Stitching absolutely does degrade, we all see that on boat stuff all the time. I wouldn't bet my life on jackstays not degrading so why would I do it for the sake of a £50 harness?

There is no reason why stitching and material need to deteriorate. Gore Tenara thread is guaranteed for 15 years. UV will destroy incorrectly specified fabric in the Tropics within 12 months but correctly specified material can last many years with little sign of deterioration. Manufacturers may well quote differently life expectancies depending on what materials make up their product. My professional harness sold for well over £300 when new. I would hope it would lasta while