Ex-Lifeboat engines

[Old Bumbulum]

I am considering an engine change due to an old and underpowered engine.

There are ex lifeboat engines adverised for sale (usually Bukh) that are claimed to have done "only 250 hrs" for only two or three grand.

I'm sure this will all have been cold running, just periodic 5 minute checking runs over the years.

Is this likely to have caused excessive wear - and are these engines thus a good value option or a bit of a risk?

 

[bedouin]

I fitted one of these a few years ago and consider it a good purchase, and I think a couple of other forumites have done so too.

 

[Kukri]

Yes. Started once a week by the Third Engineer. May have gone for a spin round a harbour once a year or so.

 

[Airscrew]

I am considering an engine change due to an old and underpowered engine.

There are ex lifeboat engines adverised for sale (usually Bukh) that are claimed to have done "only 250 hrs" for only two or three grand.

I'm sure this will all have been cold running, just periodic 5 minute checking runs over the years.

Is this likely to have caused excessive wear - and are these engines thus a good value option or a bit of a risk?

This is thread is 6 months old.
Just seen it.
However, at the time of the first post, we had just committed to the option above.
I have very positive experience and feedback.
If you need more, PM me.

 

[Refueler]

Its funny ... if I had seen this years ago when I was on the ships - I would have said no way ... many were awful Lister or similar lumps of crap that the 3rd Eng often had to take a hammer to !!

As 3rd Mate assisting in check running engine - I spent a lot of effort turning the b****y handle or holding the valve lifter !

But todays LB's are a world apart from the old ..

 

[LittleSister]

The availability of second-hand Bukhs from lifeboats strongly influenced my choice for my latest 'new' (40 years old!) boat.

I could afford either a replacement (old) boat or a replacement new engine, but not both! I needed to be able to obtain a relatively affordable replacement if the engine in the boat I was buying turned out to be a dud. With ex-lifeboat Bukhs available, I could, if needed, drop a replacement straight in. (Though note some (most? all?) lifeboat engines seem fresh-water keel-cooled, so may need addition of a sea-water pump and heat exchanger.)

As it turns out my 40 year old Bukh seems sound, start easily and runs nicely, including non-stop across the North Sea (though a recent injector pump failure - fuel seal gone - hit me surprisingly hard in the pocket).

The Bukh DV series twins and triples have been in production since the 1970s. So they are well proven and almost all parts are readily available (if pricey). These engines are now very expensive new, and lifeboats, rather than new yachts, seem to be the main market for this series these days. I guess they are used for lifeboats because they are robust, relatively simple (no complex electronics etc.) and, unlike most more modern engines, can be hand-started.

 

[Kukri]

Yes; it’s the hand starting thing.

 

[Poignard]

My BUKH starts easily enough by hand.

 

[Refueler]

Hand starting is the one thing I miss with the 4-107 I have. When they were fitted to cars ... they had starting handle connection on the crank pulley ... but on boats ... nothing.

 

[rogerthebodger]

I have a hydraulic starter motor from one of the small perkins. I was going to set it up with a hydraulic hand pump and pressure vessel. I sold the engine so never did fit it.


The engine setup came off a road sweeping machine.

 

[Poignard]

If the BUKH DV10 was available from these firms I would probably buy one.

 

[Poignard]

Yes. Started once a week by the Third Engineer. May have gone for a spin round a harbour once a year or so.

I remember a few of us going for a run ashore in one. Did they carry fenders? I can't remember.

 

[Refueler]

I remember a few of us going for a run ashore in one. Did they carry fenders? I can't remember.

Fenders ? No.

As a cadet - we ran ashore in Bonny Nigeria to the village and got introduced to local brew based on Palm .... very interesting ride back to the ship !!

 

[Beneteau381]

The availability of second-hand Bukhs from lifeboats strongly influenced my choice for my latest 'new' (40 years old!) boat.

I could afford either a replacement (old) boat or a replacement new engine, but not both! I needed to be able to obtain a relatively affordable replacement if the engine in the boat I was buying turned out to be a dud. With ex-lifeboat Bukhs available, I could, if needed, drop a replacement straight in. (Though note some (most? all?) lifeboat engines seem fresh-water keel-cooled, so may need addition of a sea-water pump and heat exchanger.)

As it turns out my 40 year old Bukh seems sound, start easily and runs nicely, including non-stop across the North Sea (though a recent injector pump failure - fuel seal gone - hit me surprisingly hard in the pocket).

The Bukh DV series twins and triples have been in production since the 1970s. So they are well proven and almost all parts are readily available (if pricey). These engines are now very expensive new, and lifeboats, rather than new yachts, seem to be the main market for this series these days. I guess they are used for lifeboats because they are robust, relatively simple (no complex electronics etc.) and, unlike most more modern engines, can be hand-started.

The inly issue on the 3 cylinder ones seems to be the liner O rings, they leak eventually.

 

[LittleSister]

The inly issue on the 3 cylinder ones seems to be the liner O rings, they leak eventually.

Oh no! Now you tell me!

Seems strange that the triples would be that different to the singles and twins that preceded them in such a basic thing (though it is a different engine - the layout is different to that shared by the singles and twins), and that if it is a known weakness they haven't noticeably addressed it in the 40+ years they've been in production. (Not that the latter would help me: mine is one of the very earliest of the DV triples.)

 

[ghostlymoron]

I'm intrigued by this thread. What kind of lifeboat are we talking about? Presumably not 40 knot RNLI boats.

 

[Poignard]

I'm intrigued by this thread. What kind of lifeboat are we talking about? Presumably not 40 knot RNLI boats.

Ships'lifeboats. Many are fitted with BUKH engines which have very low hours. Shipbreakers sell these engines on.

 

[bedouin]

I'm intrigued by this thread. What kind of lifeboat are we talking about? Presumably not 40 knot RNLI boats.

No - the sort of lifeboats carried by commercial ships. They are well looked after and usually get only a few hours running a year so you are getting a nearly-new engine.

Most of them are Bukh DV24 which is a pretty good marine diesel - I guess SOLAS have a requirement that they are not dependent on a battery to start and there aren't that many designs around that can be hand started these days.

 

[vyv_cox]

Ships'lifeboats. Many are fitted with BUKH engines which have very low hours. Shipbreakers sell these engines on.

The lifeboats in use on North Sea platforms, and maybe on ships(?) are keel cooled for use in heavily contaminated water in emergency. So although raw water cooled they have always run on antifreeze. Internal corrosion should be minimal.

 

[LittleSister]

The lifeboats in use on North Sea platforms, and maybe on ships(?) are keel cooled for use in heavily contaminated water in emergency. So although raw water cooled they have always run on antifreeze. Internal corrosion should be minimal.

I am hesitant to question a statement from someone as knowledgeable as Vyv, but my understanding (perhaps mistaken) is that the keel cooled ones are not raw (i.e. sea or river water) cooled, but freshwater (with anti-freeze) cooled in a closed system. These have a 'circulation' pump, but no raw water pump. I believe such circulation pumps, by virtue of their design, materials and lack of a removable impellor, are unsuitable for use for raw water and the debris and salts that involves.

For subsequent indirect cooling use (i.e. without the keel cooler) these lifeboat engines would need the addition of a raw water pump and heat exchanger (as per my earlier post).

For subsequent direct seawater cooling (though I can't see the point if you already have the circulation pump) you would still need a raw water pump added, but no heat exchanger would be required and the circulation pump would be redundant.

Just for completeness, I'll add that the throughput volume required of the raw water pump and circulation pumps are very different, and that required of the raw water pump is somewhat higher for indirect cooling than direct cooling (same pump, different cam). E.g. for DV 36
COOLING WATER SYSTEM (Direct cooling)
COOLING WATER TEMPERATURE . ........................................ ......................................50 – 70oC
TYPE OF CIRCULATING PUMP / CAPACITY AT 3600 rpm...... ..............................CENTRIFUGAL / 24-30 Litres/min

COOLING WATER SYSTEM (Indirect cooling)
COOLING WATER TEMPERATURE . ........................................ ......................................70 – 95oC
TYPE OF SEAWATER PUMP / CAPACITY AT 3600 rpm .......... ...............................CENTRIFUGAL / 36-42 Litres/min
TYPE OF FRESHWATER PUMP / CAPACITY AT 3600 rpm ..... ..............................CENTRIFUGAL / 135 Litres/min
COOLING WATER CONTENT .......... ........................................ .........................................7.0 Litres