ex charter boat survey

[pathfinderstu]

man thanks for all your advice so far its been extremely useful especially bobc pointers on potential grounding damage etc. and the offer for a survey check list along with the others.
my position now is that i will walk away if any serious faults are found prior to getting a surveyors report or drydocking (which bye the way have been quoted 700 euros.) if there is a dispute regarding faults then i will get a surveyor in to back up the findings.
however i must say that the broker for the eastern med moorings co. here has been extremely helpful and professional, is even taking the day off to come over with me to kos island to oversee things. broker agrees that if for example theres water in the rudder that would be enough for me to reclaim my deposit and walk away. i will report back on this if anyone is interested.

the boat bye the way is a beneteau cyclades 43, seems ideal for the type of pottering around i want to do with friends and family in the e.med so no bleach bottle digs please am very sensative.!

 

[jonic]

however i must say that the broker for the eastern med moorings co. here has been extremely helpful and professional, is even taking the day off to come over with me to kos island to oversee things. broker agrees that if for example theres water in the rudder that would be enough for me to reclaim my deposit and walk away.

Good luck and do report back.

Water in the rudder is pretty common, I've sailed boats across the Atlantic with it.

 

[jimi]

Water in the rudder is pretty common and would'nt normally be a show stopper.

 

[Tranona]

man thanks for all your advice so far its been extremely useful especially bobc pointers on potential grounding damage etc. and the offer for a survey check list along with the others.
my position now is that i will walk away if any serious faults are found prior to getting a surveyors report or drydocking (which bye the way have been quoted 700 euros.) if there is a dispute regarding faults then i will get a surveyor in to back up the findings.
however i must say that the broker for the eastern med moorings co. here has been extremely helpful and professional, is even taking the day off to come over with me to kos island to oversee things. broker agrees that if for example theres water in the rudder that would be enough for me to reclaim my deposit and walk away. i will report back on this if anyone is interested.

the boat bye the way is a beneteau cyclades 43, seems ideal for the type of pottering around i want to do with friends and family in the e.med so no bleach bottle digs please am very sensative.!

baggywrinkle and Bobcs comments are spot on for ex charter boat. One of the reasons why the big operators sell boats after around 6 seasons is that they can go downhill quickly after that, not just because of wear and tear, but because they end up as "orphans" as clients choose newer boats.

I have an ex-charter Bavaria, but I bought mine new and monitored it closely over the time (7 years) it was on charter. So when I took it over I did not have a survey - bit did spend over a week supervising the remedial work (mostly trivial but still necessary) before acceptance. The price you are paying reflects the fact that some work will be needed. You need to be clear that your contract reflects what you are buying. Doubt you will be covered by UK contract law, but if you engage a UK surveyor ensure that your contract is with him direct and covered by UK law and his insurance.

It is a mistake to think of the survey as a cost to be minimised if you do not know the history of the boat. I expect Sunsail (if it is like the manager I used) will have a written specification of what the boat should be like. Clearly it is not a new boat, but it should all be serviceable and particularly all the agreed equipment should be there. Loose equipment tends to be shuffled around among boats so you need to check the inventory fully and identify everything to the boat.

As has already been suggested, the most common serious problems are groundings and low speed collisions damaging hull/deck joints. Electrics/ electronics and water systems get a hammering and steering needs close inspection. Engines tend to do well because they get lots of running and good servicing. Saloon upholstery is often worn, but other cabins should be OK. Some companies have a policy of replacing sails around year 4, but otherwise try to negotiate a good set - not unknown to switch from boat to boat.

Follow the guides such as John lilley and Chinita have suggested and you will get a good feel for what you are looking for, and remember Sunsail don't want to sell you a duff boat so are likely to behave properly if you do raise issues with them.

 

[minkysailing]

Pathfinderstu,

Consider your surveyor not as an extra expense, but as your insurance policy when making a large purchase decision. We are here to help and to protect you from making a mistake. Our survey reports give you the information you need to make an informed decision and this may include a re-negotiation on the purchase price supported by the finding of your surveyor.

The surveyor should be on board for a full day and be available after and during the survey if you are available to discuss the findings. Many surveyors will be happy for you attend the survey which can prove very useful for you.

Should you check over the vessel before appointing a surveyor, absolutely!...I would. Don't however limit the scope of the survey by doing so.

Best of luck.

 

[jonic]

Pathfinderstu,

Consider your surveyor not as an extra expense, but as your insurance policy when making a large purchase decision. We are here to help and to protect you from making a mistake. Our survey reports give you the information you need to make an informed decision and this may include a re-negotiation on the purchase price supported by the finding of your surveyor.

The surveyor should be on board for a full day and be available after and during the survey if you are available to discuss the findings. Many surveyors will be happy for you attend the survey which can prove very useful for you.

Should you check over the vessel before appointing a surveyor, absolutely!...I would. Don't however limit the scope of the survey by doing so.

Best of luck.

+1

 

[Sneaky Pete]

Maybe I have missed something here but if you pay a deposit for a boat and want to inspect the boat at least have an idea of what to look for not asking for direction from a forum prior to visiting the boat. Find out what to do many months ago when the idea was first in your head about a prospective purchase.
You may wish to consider a book by Don Casey called “sailboat maintenance manual” in it there is a chapter called boat buyers 30 minute survey. It gives good information on how to assess the condition and quality of a boat the first time you visited it. It also states that if you are happy with your own survey the next step is to appoint a professional surveyor, hopefully one that will check it from A to Z, go round with the surveyor when they do the inspection you may learn something.

 

[pathfinderstu]

Maybe I have missed something here but if you pay a deposit for a boat and want to inspect the boat at least have an idea of what to look for not asking for direction from a forum prior to visiting the boat. Find out what to do many months ago when the idea was first in your head about a prospective purchase.
You may wish to consider a book by Don Casey called “sailboat maintenance manual” in it there is a chapter called boat buyers 30 minute survey. It gives good information on how to assess the condition and quality of a boat the first time you visited it. It also states that if you are happy with your own survey the next step is to appoint a professional surveyor, hopefully one that will check it from A to Z, go round with the surveyor when they do the inspection you may learn something.

hi sneaky, thanks for info about the book.

i entirely disagree with your comments though, i have recieved a wealth of information from experianced persons on the subject and has given me a huge ammount of knowledge about the questions i asked.

i think that it was this forums all about .

months ago i had no idea that is would be intending to buy an ex charter boat, i had to lower my sights due to finacial restrictions, but having gone thru all the debates about exchart will be very pleased if the boat is sound.

so i think you are wrong to critisize me for asking the forum for direction on the subject the ammount of friendly knowledge passed on to me
has been fantastic and put me in a very strong position to sort out any problems right from the start.

 

[Mr Cassandra]

hi sneaky, thanks for info about the book.

i entirely disagree with your comments though, i have received a wealth of information from experienced persons on the subject and has given me a huge amount of knowledge about the questions i asked.

i think that it was this forums all about .

months ago i had no idea that is would be intending to buy an ex charter boat, i had to lower my sights due to financial restrictions, but having gone thru all the debates about exchart will be very pleased if the boat is sound.

so i think you are wrong to criticize me for asking the forum for direction on the subject the amount of friendly knowledge passed on to me
has been fantastic and put me in a very strong position to sort out any problems right from the start.

Well said. Hope everything go`s swimmingly for you

 

[Sneaky Pete]

hi sneaky, thanks for info about the book.

i entirely disagree with your comments though, i have recieved a wealth of information from experianced persons on the subject and has given me a huge ammount of knowledge about the questions i asked.

i think that it was this forums all about .

months ago i had no idea that is would be intending to buy an ex charter boat, i had to lower my sights due to finacial restrictions, but having gone thru all the debates about exchart will be very pleased if the boat is sound.

so i think you are wrong to critisize me for asking the forum for direction on the subject the ammount of friendly knowledge passed on to me
has been fantastic and put me in a very strong position to sort out any problems right from the start.

I must apologise if you felt my comments were a little too assertive it was how I read your original post believing you were attempting to survey a boat with no prior knowledge and looking to the forum for guidance. Yes this forum is a wealth of knowledge derived from years of experience and it will continue to provide a pile of information that would otherwise be difficult to find.
On a lighter note good luck with the boat hope all goes well and this craft meets your expectations.

 

[Shuggy]

I have mixed views on surveyors. When I bought my first 'proper' boat I got a survey done. I was in Scotland and the boat was in the east of Engiand. The surveyor did not spot two rusty redundant fuel tanks that had been blocked off while still containing 50 gallons of fuel. When I got her to the Caledonian Canal one of the hidden fuel tanks burst, emptying 20 gallons of fuel into the bilges. As we were in the canal I could do nothing about it so the prop shaft sprayed diesel all over the bilges as it was submerged. Surveyor didn't care and would accept no liability. So from that day I have not trusted surveyors. I was lucky on my current boat. The previous buyer-to-be pulled out due to illness, having spent £1500 on a lift out and survey. I bought into the survey for £50. As per the last time, he did not notice the significant things wrong with the boat which, now I know about them, should have been pretty obvious to a professional.

My experience says don't bother with a survey except for insurance purposes. If you do get a survey for assessing the boat's condition rather than for insurance purposes, make sure the surveyor knows you will pursue them for costs arising that they have not spotted. Then take everything with a pinch of salt. You are the only true judge if your boat is fit to go to sea in. Either that or I've not found a decent surveyor yet!