European RGR?

[goeasy123]

If you want to go round the world from the UK, in a UK VAT paid boat you can do it without incurring a VAT charge if taking more than three year. Even before the law was changed earlier this year you could get clearance from NIRU to take more than 3 years.

How do you achieve the same, 3 year plus capability with an EU VAT paid boat leaving from the EU? There must be 1000's of yachts that have done it. I guess not many if any have paid reimportation duty or VAT.

 

[Tranona]

The RGR rules in the EU are exactly the same as the UK, but the implementation is the responsibility of each individual state. As you can imagine there is huge variability as the 3 years is not specific with "exceptions" allowed, just as the UK used in the past. So it is highly unlikely that you will get a definitive answer. As you say EU Europeans have been sailing outside the EU for all the time (30 years) that these rules have been in place seemingly without problems.

 

[goeasy123]

The RGR rules in the EU are exactly the same as the UK, but the implementation is the responsibility of each individual state. As you can imagine there is huge variability as the 3 years is not specific with "exceptions" allowed, just as the UK used in the past. So it is highly unlikely that you will get a definitive answer. As you say EU Europeans have been sailing outside the EU for all the time (30 years) that these rules have been in place seemingly without problems.

The UK law changed this year. For the practical purpose of sailing away for more than 3 years there is no longer a charged levied on return by HMRC.

You say "exception". It would be good to to know what country offers an acceptable exception that would allow a long distant sailor to leave and return at their leisure??

Or maybe somebody representing EU owners (such as the RYA and CA did in the UK) could lobby the EC to get the asinine, un-policable and worthless law changed.

 

[Tranona]

The UK law changed this year. For the practical purpose of sailing away for more than 3 years there is no longer a charged levied on return by HMRC.

You say "exception". It would be good to to know what country offers an acceptable exception that would allow a long distant sailor to leave and return at their leisure??

Or maybe somebody representing EU owners (such as the RYA and CA did in the UK) could lobby the EC to get the asinine, un-policable and worthless law changed.

In your dreams! The law on RGR has not changed in the UK as it applies to all goods. The" exception" has always been there. What has changed is the recognition that there were potentially large numbers of boats owned by UK owners and taken from the UK that when we were in the EU could come and go as they please. Brexit changed that and the "concession" is primarily to deal with those who want to bring their boats back into the UK VAT area. In reality the number who really need the concession is likely to be small and fall to nothing over the coming years.

As for getting any central "ruling" from the EU forget it. That is an example of the fundamental flaw of the EU legal system. Directives set the principles and then the individual states bring their own laws into line, then most states devolve the implementation further down the line. You will recall the oft stated claim that the UK "gold plated" EU laws - this is a reflection of how much leeway there is between the principles of a Directive and the actual law and rules in each state. However if a state enacts laws that do not comply with the directives then the remedy is to take it to the Commission who can force the state to change its law or procedures. This has happened recently with both Croatia and Greece in the way they were treating UK owned boats with EU VAT paid status under the withdrawal agreement.

 

[goeasy123]

In your dreams! The law on RGR has not changed in the UK as it applies to all goods. The" exception" has always been there. What has changed is the recognition that there were potentially large numbers of boats owned by UK owners and taken from the UK that when we were in the EU could come and go as they please. Brexit changed that and the "concession" is primarily to deal with those who want to bring their boats back into the UK VAT area. In reality the number who really need the concession is likely to be small and fall to nothing over the coming years.

As for getting any central "ruling" from the EU forget it. That is an example of the fundamental flaw of the EU legal system. Directives set the principles and then the individual states bring their own laws into line, then most states devolve the implementation further down the line. You will recall the oft stated claim that the UK "gold plated" EU laws - this is a reflection of how much leeway there is between the principles of a Directive and the actual law and rules in each state. However if a state enacts laws that do not comply with the directives then the remedy is to take it to the Commission who can force the state to change its law or procedures. This has happened recently with both Croatia and Greece in the way they were treating UK owned boats with EU VAT paid status under the withdrawal agreement.

With regard to your first paragraph (Customs Reliefs from a Liability to Import Duty and Miscellaneous Amendments) (EU Exit) Regulations 2020) became law on the 23th February 2022. Amongst other things it abolishes the 3 year RGR limit on pleasure craft, owned by the exporter and returned substantially unchanged. If this change was not to remove the concept of 'exception' what does it do? I can now sail away for as long as I want without having to claim relief and the fear of it being refused.

How to I get my boat EU boat out of and back into the EU without fear of being charged the taxes?

 

[sailaboutvic]

As said 1000s have done it and still do .
How do they do it ?
They just do it , who question it .
Of course if someone wants to open a can of worms and say , hey I'm back how do I claim RGR that's another story .

 

[Tranona]

With regard to your first paragraph (Customs Reliefs from a Liability to Import Duty and Miscellaneous Amendments) (EU Exit) Regulations 2020) became law on the 23th February 2022. Amongst other things it abolishes the 3 year RGR limit on pleasure craft, owned by the exporter and returned substantially unchanged. If this change was not to remove the concept of 'exception' what does it do? I can now sail away for as long as I want without having to claim relief and the fear of it being refused.

How to I get my boat EU boat out of and back into the EU without fear of being charged the taxes?

OK, but as I explained the driver for the change was mainly to deal with the large number of boats that became subject to RGR as a consequence of the withdrawal agreement which was clearly an injustice, not for cruising boats moving in and out of the EU/UK where there was never a problem with extending the 3 years.

For the EU nothing has changed and there will be no pressure as there was in the UK to get specific exemption for pleasure boats. As Vic says, just sail in and out like everybody else.

 

[Graham376]

One point to remember, if someone is a resident as opposed to citizen of an EU country, residence can be lost if away for long period which could be more of a problem than RGR.