epoxy and varnish on toe rails

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mikecontessa26

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Hello everyone, i'm about to eopxy and varnish my teak capping rails, i've gone for west systems epoxy with the clear resin that doesn't yellow. I wondered if anyone had any tips or could recommend a two pack varnish?

Thanks

Mike
 
If it was up to me, I wouldn't apply epoxy to the toerail, because when moisture gets under it [and it will] it will be trapped there, and scraping off the epoxy will be very hard work.

I would just varnish it [Epifanes is good] or use Deks Olje.
 
I do my toerails in Varnol, a varnishing oil. Why?

OK, they get a lot of wear, and get chafed. Oil like this is very easy to apply and is very easy to touch up. Yes, you do have to re-apply every 8 weeks, but its no bother. The best bit is, you won't rot the wood and the rails themselves take an hour to look fabulous. epoxy is vulnerable to UV damage and must be varnished to protect it. Otherwise it rots like that plastic is is. So, don't epoxy, pick a varnish and use it.
 
will the varnish look as good as epoxy? How long will varnish, epiphanes for example last? How many coats of Epiphanes will it take?
 
From the responses you have got to your posts on this, you will realise that there is not a lot a lot of support for using epoxy. Reasons - does not stick well to teak, does not like UV, difficult to seal a toe rail completely, needs special varnish (which West do) to get a good bright finish, difficult to get off if you want to do repairs etc.

For bright finishes there are a number of choices. Conventional varnishes such as Epifanes, International, Blakes which are easy if tedious to apply, easy to touch up, but not very abrasion resistant. Each brand has its advocates.

Two pot finishes from the same manufacturers. More difficult to apply correctly but harder and longer lasting. More difficult to touch up and can fail if the film is broken.

Oil based products such as Deks Olje which are claimed to soak into the wood and protect it better. Easy to apply but the basic coat gives a matt finish, but some have a top coat which gives a gloss finish, but not as gloss as varnish.

Solvent based porous stains such as Sikkens Novatech. Easy to apply. Can be used just with the base coat and matt finish or with a gloss top coat. Not as gloss as varnish and have a pigment so darken wood. Long lasting, easy to touch up and allow wood to breathe.

Polyurethene such as Colean. Encapsulates wood. Expensive, not high gloss but lasts a long, long time.

There are others such as water based sealers that can be used but i have no experience of them.

I have used all except Colean over the last 30 years, but now only use Sikkens on external brightwork including mast as the ease of application and long life outweigh the lower gloss appearance.

The fact that all products exist in the market suggest they all meet a need. You will have to make up your own mind which meets your needs best.

If your prime requirement is a high gloss "yacht" finish, this is most easily achieved with conventional varnish - anything up to 6/8 coats depending on brand - and now is not a particularly good time to do it as they don't like damp and low temperatures!

Hope this helps!
 
I agree with Tranona, Sikkens is the best all rounder I have been unable to do much maintenance over the past two years so my varnishwork is at least three years old. It does look a bit tired now but I would normally give it a rub down and two coats every other year. My Iroko toe rails still look quite good but I put four or five coats on after stripping them down to bare wood. It worked very well for me.
 
I agree with everyone else varnish is your best bet, But id be wary of polyuerethane varnishes as Ive found them almost as bad as epoxy to remove if you wish to strip back to bare wood in the future. I use three coats of danish oil and then 3 to 4 coats of le tonkonois varnish (available from trad boat supplies)I have been very happy with this as it gives a good colour, deep shine and its easy to repair scratches and scuffs etc. I have also recently discovered after some years of constant brightwork maintenance. The joys of an all over boat cover, this has almost made maintenance of her painted deck and varnish finish unneccessary, Hurrah. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
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will the varnish look as good as epoxy?

[/ QUOTE ]

Are you kidding? Varnish looks so much better. Epoxy will deteriorate faster than varnish or varnish oil. It must in any case be covered with one or the other.

So, what you really want is a beautiful shiny toerail which needs a wipe with a damp rag every five years to keep it sparkling. No coating on earth does this. There are varnishes which are longer lasting than others, but have harder finishes so won't stand up to chafeing.

So why do I like Varnol for the toerails? It takes maybe 3 coats at 50% mix and three at 100% strength. This needs re-coating every eight weeks or when damaged. It dries within about half an hour in warm sun. However, I like varnishing these as it only takes about half an hour and lets me examine the state of the deck thoroughly - yes, I have a complicated deck. Varnol and Int. Original is cheap and easily put on.

Like a lot of people, I don't have the time or resources to try loads of different types. I'm actually just experimenting, but I've loads of experience with Int Original, and the Varnol was on the boat already. Seems to work well, though.

Varnish is a state of mind - you either like doing it or you don't. If you don't, sell up and get a plastic boat.

Final point mentioned above. You can really extend the life of your varnish by keeping the UV of sunlight off it. This means covers. If you can make or afford covers for the toerails, and any other bits you want to cover. Doesn't have to be pretty, just keeps the sunlight and the rain off.
 
Try 3 coats of Sicomin Wood Impreg 120 followed by 4 coats of Sicomin PU 360 for UV protection.
I am a professional varnisher who, until this year, would have told you to use Epifanes Varnish ( at least 10 coats!), but have lost my Luddite tendencies in favour of a new,versatile product that works better than anything I have encountered before.
Unlike West, it is not solid and brittle but does have some elasticity whilst standing up to any knocks well.
Regards,
Chris Reynolds
 
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