Boater Sam
Well-Known Member
Its very rare if a bank gets the money sucked back if the transaction is lawful. Not like Paypal.
If you make an unlawful transfer its your fault.
Engine Sale - Buyer Scam?
- Thread starter Chuncky
- Start date
If you make an unlawful transfer its your fault.
john_morris_uk
Well-Known Member
I am told that if you do a 'family and friends' transfer on PayPal, they can't reverse the transaction. I don't know whether this is true or not.
ghostlymoron
Well-Known Member
There are frequently reports of suspected scams on my local Facebook page. Some are so obvious I wonder anyone bothers to ask the question.
My advice has been assume everything is a scam - unless it isn't.
My advice has been assume everything is a scam - unless it isn't.
Jim@sea
Well-Known Member
Never trust a bank if their interest is more important than yours, I once read about a businessman who had a large business overdraft, his daughter worked for him and as part of her wages he would transfer £100 pounds a week into her savingings account with the same bank. There was a new bank manager who pulled the overdraft and emptied the daughters savings account to help clear it.
Moral of the story, if you borrow money dont have any savings with the same bank. ?
Whiterose
Well-Known Member
Just say no!
Tamar
Well-Known Member
I sold a motorcycle a few years ago on eBay, almost straight away I had a Romanian guy contact me offering the asking price.. I insisted on cash on collection, he wanted to pay me via bank draft. I was suspicious as his FB page was empty.
He finally agreed to cash, I didn't expect him to turn up for the bike but he sent me pictures of his journey to prove he was coming. He drove over 200 miles and was as good as his word. He didn't even look at the bike, he just put it straight into his hire van, I had just spent £200 on a new windscreen motor.
He said he was going to take the bike and a few others to Romania and sell them.
He finally agreed to cash, I didn't expect him to turn up for the bike but he sent me pictures of his journey to prove he was coming. He drove over 200 miles and was as good as his word. He didn't even look at the bike, he just put it straight into his hire van, I had just spent £200 on a new windscreen motor.
He said he was going to take the bike and a few others to Romania and sell them.
Tranona
Well-Known Member
Moral of your "story" is don't believe hearsay from some bloke on the internet. Bank can only take money from an account in such circumstances if it has a charge over the account. There is always at least 2 sides to a story and as it did not happen to you how do you know what really happened?
Stemar
Well-Known Member
I'd have to question that story too. Taking money from one someone's account without permission sounds like theft to me, and while banks go in for all sorts of legalised theft, they tend to be a bit careful about the illegal kind.
Bru
Well-Known Member
They certainly can't take money from one person's account to cover a debt owed by someone else
However, they definitely *can* move money between accounts held by one person, including joint accounts
IE. If your current account is persistently overdrawn but you have money in a savings account, they can use your savings balance to repay your overdraft.
They do not, I believe, nowadays do this routinely, you have to be a long term defaulter (I think there's a code of practice covering it) but back in the bad old days Barclays did it to us - we (my wife and I) each had a current account which for convenience were joint accounts. Due to an unexpected bill I went temporarily overdrawn and Barclays removed money from my wife's account to cover it. This caused several bills to go unpaid and cost us dearly in fees and charges. I swore I'd never do business with Barclays again and I haven't.
colind3782
Well-Known Member
Back in the 80s I worked for a very dodgy boss who was always overdrawn on the business account. His personal account was with the same bank and they did take from it to clear the business overdraft.
Tranona
Well-Known Member
That is essentially the issue. I expect the daughter's account was still linked through her status in the company and gifts from the company would have been from the overdraft, that is the banks money. The fact that it was paid direct to her account rather than paid as wages and taxed etc is the key difference.
Somewhat similar to the Opal case where they transferred money from the trading account which was in overdraft to the client account . The bank did not like that idea and made a claim for its return.
KompetentKrew
Well-Known Member
A "genuine mistake" isn't theft though.
Tranona
Well-Known Member
Some people think that overdrafts are "normal" and don't have strings attached. they are if you keep within the terms and pay them back when due as the vast majority of private people do. However those small businesses that have their working capital financed by the bank through an overdraft will find there are lots of strings - especially to prevent people from using the bank's money to finance their own lifestyle or treat it as their own personal funds. Having the ability to take funds from a private account to honour the terms of the overdraft is a pretty powerful eapon.
jac
Well-Known Member
Having worked in lending in a bank let me just set some things straight.
Banks have right of set off - basically your credit balance v your debit balance. However this only applies to the same legal entity ( unless permission has been granted.) So My current account to my savings account is fine or to my either to sign joint account is fine. For a business, if that is a partnership or LTD then taking from the owners account would be verboten although a sole trader T/A would be permissible as same legal entity.
However it is now frowned on and discouraged as it is down to customers to manage their money and their are always issues about "Mr" spending on the joint a/c yet the money to settle being taken from "Mrs" so not routinely done ( Debt recovery is a different matter.)
Back to OP - Never use Paypal as the seller - FAR too risky as mentioned. Whilst it's technically possible to reclaim payments made into accounts ( basically unpaid ones) from abroad it's rare and shouldn't happen with UK ones. ( Especially once the banking day has finished and funds are not showing as pending.) Cash can be forgeries and cheques are dodgy as we all know. Giving your a/c no and s/c are no more risky than giving someone a cheque ( and that also includes your signature.)
Personally i would give my a/c no and s/c - wait until it was showing as cleared. If any doubt, ring your bank nad ask if it was cleared.
For high value items CHAPS is the most secure method as in that case, both banks confirm it is received and no way it can be reclaimed later. on that basis, if worried ask seller to CHAPS the money and agree for you to cut the sale price down to cover the CHAPS fee/ ( £20-£25 ish)
Banks have right of set off - basically your credit balance v your debit balance. However this only applies to the same legal entity ( unless permission has been granted.) So My current account to my savings account is fine or to my either to sign joint account is fine. For a business, if that is a partnership or LTD then taking from the owners account would be verboten although a sole trader T/A would be permissible as same legal entity.
However it is now frowned on and discouraged as it is down to customers to manage their money and their are always issues about "Mr" spending on the joint a/c yet the money to settle being taken from "Mrs" so not routinely done ( Debt recovery is a different matter.)
Back to OP - Never use Paypal as the seller - FAR too risky as mentioned. Whilst it's technically possible to reclaim payments made into accounts ( basically unpaid ones) from abroad it's rare and shouldn't happen with UK ones. ( Especially once the banking day has finished and funds are not showing as pending.) Cash can be forgeries and cheques are dodgy as we all know. Giving your a/c no and s/c are no more risky than giving someone a cheque ( and that also includes your signature.)
Personally i would give my a/c no and s/c - wait until it was showing as cleared. If any doubt, ring your bank nad ask if it was cleared.
For high value items CHAPS is the most secure method as in that case, both banks confirm it is received and no way it can be reclaimed later. on that basis, if worried ask seller to CHAPS the money and agree for you to cut the sale price down to cover the CHAPS fee/ ( £20-£25 ish)
Irish Rover
Well-Known Member
Boys and girls, relax. OP disappeared about 2 hours after starting this thread. He probably realised it was a mistake and took evasive action to avoid being sucked into the twilight zone vortex which is the inevitable fate of anyone looking for financial or legal advice on YBW.
Fantasie 19
Well-Known Member
Yep - I use the same process, got a separate bank account just for internet purchases - I transfer exact money in to pay for the item, otherwise nil balance all the time, also no arranged overdraft
Bru
Well-Known Member
For purchases, you're much better off using your credit card due to the protection that gives you (i.e. you can legally claim the money back from the credit card company if the goods do not arrive or are not as advertised and the vendor will not resolve the complaint)
Fantasie 19
Well-Known Member
Well that depends on whether you like credit cards - but I take your point, for purely personal (and probably illogical) reasons I've never owned one apart from work one's I have to use
Stemar
Well-Known Member
Like so many things, they're a good servant, but a very bad master. Pay it off at the end of the month, and no worries, plus the advantage of cover against fraud. Pay off the minimum and, well, you just don't want to go there. Then I've heard of folk who thought it was free money "Waddaya mean I have to pay it back?"
Bru
Well-Known Member
This is what I do. Indeed paying off the full balance on the credit card is the first payment each month