Elephants' Graveyard

[Ohdrat]

Re: MOT

mmm well maybe we should have a compulsory test for boat owners that also encompassed maintenance A compulsory test would reduce the number of boats on the water or sitting in marinas as Gin Palaces, increase safety and if it incorporated a refresher test at 5yr intervals it would reduce insurance premiums (at a guess)

 

[Twister_Ken]

Re: Elephants\' Graveyard

This is a "seriously though, folks" reply.

Last CA mag looked at what can be done to scrap/recycle a GRP boat. Answer, basically, was not very much.

The nature of GRP - inherently a mixed material, glass, resin, balsa cores, etc - makes it an almost totally useless product when it is no longer boat shaped. There are worries too about the hazardous nature of the residues that you'd get from grinding/shredding it. And if you burn it, it gives off very nasty fumes.

So, like the upturned boat which served as a house in the last production of Peter Grimes that I saw, maybe we'll have to find a way of converting shagged-out boats into garden sheds, garages, novelty motels, etc.

 

[tyger]

Re: Seriously though Folks

Many years ago one of the boating mags suggested stripping out the hulls of unwanted GRP yachts and shipping them to developing countries for use as fishing boats. Might save a few trees.

Perhaps HMG or the EU could encourage this by giving VAT tax breaks on new boats if the buyer donates an old one to a worthy cause;-)

PS re Ken's suggestion: didn't Wooden Boat have a department for the most twee use of old boats ashore?

 

[chippie]

Re: Seriously though Folks

A fellow on the North Shore of Auckland recycled a 40' keeler mould into a swimming pool. Maybe the old hulls could be stripped out for that. You guys would need a prettty big heater though! ;-)

 

[vyv_cox]

Re: Elephants\' Graveyard

There's a vast population to our East who: a) would love to go sailing, b)have little money compared with us, c) have no knowledge or respect for what is fashionable. For years and years, automotive "old bangers" have been exported to the eastern bloc, as there is no market for them in Holland, Germany, Belgium and France. Boats will follow as soon as some bright spark thinks up the most economic way to do it.

 

[pandroid]

Alternative View

Back in the 60s/70s the advent of cheap GRP allowed the manufacturers to flood the market with cheap boats. All that happened once the market reached satuaration is that they all went bust (e.g. Rogers etc). The market then stagnated for a while, with the remaining builders building bigger boats 'cos all the smaller GRP ones were still around. They still are, but are now 30 years old. The 'flooding' is now happening at 40 ft rather than 30ft. Once the latest raft of Ben/Jen/Bavs reach saturation, are we in for a deja-vu experience?

 

[SimonD]

Re: Elephants\' Graveyard

Not to worry. I expect that as soon as the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs has dealt with the fridge mountain, it will turn it's attention to the boat mountain (hope it's more effective though).

But seriously folks (as TK says) regulators, both here and in the EC, are increasingly concerned with matters environmental. Apart from the fidge fiasco, there is much talk of cars becoming too expensive to scrap, a tax on plastic bags etc. Probably some way off yet, but some form of environmental regulation governing disposal of disused boats is probably somewhere in our futures.

 

[jimi]

Should\'nt it be White Elephant?

NM
;@)#

Jim

 

[Guest]

Re: Where do us sailors go then ?

After the week i've had Peter I'am checking in tonight !

p.s. just one more sail then......

 

[petery]

Re: Elephants\' Graveyard

Sink them in groups to provide shelter for fish and hopefully snag the nets of the pair trawlers that have turned the sea bed into a ploughed field around here

 

[Guest]

Re: Where do us sailors go then ?

Vic,you'd better make that last sail a long one,,,'bout 30 years I reckon

 

[Chris_Robb]

Re: Elephants\' Graveyard

I agree with what you say. with more solidly built classics the owners approach to keeping up with the maintenance will have a big impact on the value, and the extent of use will have little effect as they do not have a finite life time.

With the modern lightweight, the most important aspect of the value will be the amount of use it has had. Owners who have looked after - but cruised extensively will find that they are competing against the little used boats, which still have many years of life ahead. Why on earth would anyone buy a heavily used (eg ex Charter boat) when there will be loads of hardly used boats around.

The friend who bought the heavily used wobbly Bav is bitterly regretting it even at the knock down price he paid.

So where will the elephants grave yard actually be - I know what will be in them.

 

[Roberto]

Piraeus ship graveyard

Near Piraeus in Greece there is a wide bay where a huge lot of ships has been left at anchor, too expensive to destroy/recycle, they are stripped of everything and left there in the hands of mother nature.
A very sad sight, like floating wrecks if they ever existed.
Couldn t old sailboats be used as fenders ?

 

[zefender]

Re:hardly used = high resale?

I suspect that the very infrequently used boat is more likely to have more serious (i.e. expensive) faults than a frequently used one. Also, a frequently used boat may not necessarily be a heavily used one. The reason why some charter boats look very sad, before the end of the expected life, is that they get a very heavy use relative to the mileage they've done. Whether it's a novice/uncaring skipper using it as a fender or grinding the halyards rather than helming properly, or a bonkers 'team building' corporate race day, they'll get a terrible hammering of the kind that's just as likely (probably) to knacker a 'classic' as a modern design. Conversely, an owner using the boat frequently is more likely to spot and fix little faults before they become big ones, or, by definition, enjoy the boat so much that he (or she) will pay for proper maintanance to be carried out by professionals.

What is a 'wobbly' Bav?

Finally, much is spoken about resale values. Boating is expensive. But boats depreciate much less than cars. It never figured in my decision to buy. By then my car and my boat are both made by Bavarians!

 

[jimi]

Re:hardly used = high resale?

I find it hard to believe that charter & training companies are going to use the lightest & most easily damaged boats. On the contrary the fact that they are used & abused, taking the usual lifetime usage in 4 years, speaks volumes for their quality of build. Look at Sunsail's Sunfast 36's which have probably been the most hammered fleet in history since the Spanish Armada, despite looking "tired" at the end of their period there probably was little structurally wrong with them, and a after fitting a new engine will probably give many years to future owners.

What do ya think? .. would you buy a Port Solent Sunfast?

Jim

 

[zefender]

Re:hardly used = high resale?

As a bertholder at Port Solent, I probably wouldn't buy one! I've seen too many come back with very bent noses! My point was that they've had bad (for them) owners, not that the boats are bad.

But I agree with you on your main point which is that these boats, like many other modern designs can take an awful lot of punishment. I'd have thought that if it made better commercial sense (i.e. depreciation) to have specified Bowmans or HR on the business model they would have done so.