Ecoli

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pathfinder

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I have used a seawater tap at the galley for many years without any problems.Its primary use is to rinse off dirty dishes before washing up, I find this saves a considerable amount of freshwater which of course mean the fw tanks go a lot further.Every now and then the epa issue ecoli warnings for various harbours that I frequent.Could anybody offer an opinion on how dangerous it is to allow seawater(with ecoli present) to flow through the galley sink.We do prepare food on a nearby work top but wipe down regulary with antibacterial spray,washing up is also done with a antibacterial liqiud.would appreciate any input.
Thanks.
 
I think it's all a matter of degree. We all have to eat our peck of dirt, but this doesn't mean that hygiene doesn't matter. I suspect that you are right to be concerned and if it were me, I might refrain from using the seawater in polluted areas, with the possibility of acquiring some nasty viruses as well as e coli. The act of washing, though, should get rid of the worst risks, as happens with normal domestic dirty plates.
 
I would not want to use seawater from a source known to be potentially contaminated with sewage (the implication of a high E coli count) as my final rinse on crockery but would be happy to use it to rinse off dishes before washing with hot fresh water containing washing up liquid. As someone with a PhD in microbiology I get very worried though about overuse of antibacterial wipes, sprays and washing up liquids etc which to me just seem like a recipe for encouraging the selection of resistant bugs. It's hard to beat very hot fresh water and soap/detergent as a way of cleaning surfaces.
 
Interesting replies, my thinking is the other way around: use s/w for all the washing up, then rinse off with my hallowed f/w supply...
Washing up with f/w from the boat's limited supply encourages bad, incomplete washing up and rinsing, whereas washing up in s/w means the duty scrubber can splash and scrub thoroughly, with just a final rinse in f/w to remove the plankton, ecoli, shark spaffings or whatever.
 
jerrytug said:
Interesting replies, my thinking is the other way around: use s/w for all the washing up, then rinse off with my hallowed f/w supply...
Washing up with f/w from the boat's limited supply encourages bad, incomplete washing up and rinsing, whereas washing up in s/w means the duty scrubber can splash and scrub thoroughly, with just a final rinse in f/w to remove the plankton, ecoli, shark spaffings or whatever.
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Fair enough as long as the last thing that happens is hot, clean water in contact with the plates etc. Not sure "splash" is what I would want in contaminated water though. Interestingly the latest advice on dealing with raw chicken is not to wash it before cooking as washing sprays campylobacter all over the place
 
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We use seawater for cooking too. Haven't lost a crewmember or visitor yet. I also swim in seawater regularly & even learned to swim in the Mersey back in the days when raw sewage actually was discharged into it. It really is very unlikely to be an issue around the UK coast with its strong tides, excellent & comprehensive sewage treatment & relatively few living on boats.

Might be a different matter in Manila harbour though.
 
stuartwineberg said:
I would not want to use seawater from a source known to be potentially contaminated with sewage (the implication of a high E coli count) as my final rinse on crockery but would be happy to use it to rinse off dishes before washing with hot fresh water containing washing up liquid. As someone with a PhD in microbiology I get very worried though about overuse of antibacterial wipes, sprays and washing up liquids etc which to me just seem like a recipe for encouraging the selection of resistant bugs. It's hard to beat very hot fresh water and soap/detergent as a way of cleaning surfaces.
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I thought a high coliform count could indicate faecal contamination by animals (e.g. seabirds) as well as by sewage - also undesirable of course. But in general I agree with your points, in this and your later post.
 
Many 'idyllic' and romantic locations (so this might exclude many places in the UK :)) suffer from red tides, which has nothing to do with 3rd world services. I would not want to swim in nor use water when this natural event occurs.

Jonathan
 
RAI said:
Add more fw tankage. Use the sw when on ocean passages and fw endurance is needed.
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That would be my thinking.

Also nowadays where almost any pub or cafe serves edible food, often including breakfasts, I use far less fresh water than when I started trundling around in the 1970's.
 
johnalison said:
I think it's all a matter of degree. We all have to eat our peck of dirt, but this doesn't mean that hygiene doesn't matter. I suspect that you are right to be concerned and if it were me, I might refrain from using the seawater in polluted areas, with the possibility of acquiring some nasty viruses as well as e coli. The act of washing, though, should get rid of the worst risks, as happens with normal domestic dirty plates.
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I would also add that a dirty dish cloth or tea towel could also be a potential source of germs. We cannot live in a sterile environment, but must keep potential level of germs to a minimum.
 
J Neeves said:
Many 'idyllic' and romantic locations (so this might exclude many places in the UK :)) suffer from red tides, which has nothing to do with 3rd world services. I would not want to swim in nor use water when this natural event occurs.

Jonathan
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Hmmph! :) Our idyllic and romantic coastal locations can suffer from nuisance algal blooms, though I don't know offhand if any are red. A number of UK locations have Phaeocystis blooms, which result in great gobbets of foam - see e.g. http://www.bikerunswim.co.uk/marine-algal-blooms-across-the-south-devon-and-cornwall-coastlines/. Having said that, it's not toxic AFAIK, but I wouldn't want to wash up with it (foam it may be, but it turns brown and smells bad).
 
Hmmph indeed :)

Red tides are toxic (and they are red!) - but I have only heard of them being an issue in warm waters, primarily tropical. One is recommended to not use a desal unit in areas with a red tide. Whether red tides might occur in the Med or secluded and idyllic locations in the UK, do not know.

My point was its not only polluted third or developed world waters one need be wary of - 'polluted' waters occur in nature.

Jonathan
 
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J Neeves said:
Hmmph indeed :)

Red tides are toxic (and they are red!) - but I have only heard of them being an issue in warm waters, primarily tropical. One is recommended to not use a desal unit in areas with a red tide. Whether red tides might occur in the Med or secluded and idyllic locations in the UK, do not know.

My point was its not only polluted third or developed world waters one need be wary of - 'polluted' waters occur in nature.

Jonathan
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Absolutely - 'natural' is not always 'safe' I agree, and I am familiar with the red tide phenomenon. I did a quick check but am not aware of any in our coastal waters (though we do of course have toxic blue-green algal blooms in freshwaters). I would not wish to wash up in Phaeocystis water - a colleague once told me that the brown foam/scum used to be mistakenly attributed to sewage discharges, such is its smell.

But I am happy to accept that your idyllic and romantic locations have many more hazardous organisms than ours. :)
 
Hydrozoan said:
Absolutely - 'natural' is not always 'safe' I agree, and I am familiar with the red tide phenomenon. I did a quick check but am not aware of any in our coastal waters (though we do of course have toxic blue-green algal blooms in freshwaters). I would not wish to wash up in Phaeocystis water - a colleague once told me that the brown foam/scum used to be mistakenly attributed to sewage discharges, such is its smell.

But I am happy to accept that your idyllic and romantic locations have many more hazardous organisms than ours. :)
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And some of them are really quite complex organisms, blue stingers, sharks, salt water crocodiles - idyllic and romantic take on quite new meanings :(

Jonathan :)
 
I always remember the advice given by the University health service before heading off on expedition to Spitzbergen. The doctor advising us used the words from a hymn: "Though every prospect pleases, and only man is vile". In other words, natural water sources are generally OK as long as there isn't human contamination upstream! And in fact we tested that (inadvertently) when we discovered the carcass of a long dead reindeer in a stream upstream from where we'd been taking our drinking water! I'm still here, and none of us suffered from even an upset tummy.

However, that advice was for the polar regions, where algal blooms and other planktonic nasties are unlikely. Blue-green algae (which thrive in the UK under the right conditions) are very nasty, as well as the more exotic red tides and so on. In general a reverse osmosis plant SHOULD remove the toxins, but some of them are neuro-toxins active at such low concentrations that I wouldn't risk it.
 
Some years ago way up in the far north east of Newzealand at a little place called Pukanui I put my leg through a hole in a sloping boat ramp and badly cut my lower leg.
Bad enough but it became infected with ecoli- in otherwords gas gangrene.
After weeks of ineffective antibiotics finally it was knocked on the head.
The source probably being the public toilets which drained straight into the lagoon nearby.
When receiving the initial treatment at Hokianga Hospital I was told there were similar problems in the Hokianga largely as a result of farm run off.
 
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