EA at HRR

[miket]

Yes. My reply was a little remote from the original comments.
I was Treasurer of TTBR for 20 years and would have been delighted if EA had provided safety cover FOC. I seem to remember that ERT, excellent that they were, came at a significant cost.

 

[Pump-Out]

What can they do if a boat has too many people on it?

I also agree that HRR should cough up some cash for the EA presence.
The Henley Rewind and Reading festival employ the services of rescue boats to patrol the waterfront

With respect, not quite the same thing.
A team travel down from Nottingham to provide safety cover for HRR competitors.
The EA are there to preserve a safe navigation for vessels NOT included in the event itself
An NGO provides safety cover between the course and the Berkshire bank for public on the towpath (or falling off towpath!)

Weather or not HRR should pay for the EA to maintain some sense of normality I agree is up for discussion. I can tell you that, some years ago, they refused to pay for traffic police at the junction of Leander Way.

As for the overloading - drives me mad. Wait until there is an accident then we will all be restricted to carrying one guest and a dog. Thames Bylaw 73 should be enforced - make the skipper produce his non-existent licence at Reading during working hours - which can then start proper legal action.

 

[oldgit]

Just quick observation,which was also relevant to that EA river licencing argument recently.
The most critical thing needed for the Henley bash to take place would possibly be water.
To provide sufficient amounts of this stuff requires considerable outlay and a contribution from all enjoying the benefits would be nice ?

 

[Parabordi]

Just quick observation,which was also relevant to that EA river licencing argument recently.
The most critical thing needed for the Henley bash to take place would possibly be water.
To provide sufficient amounts of this stuff requires considerable outlay and a contribution from all enjoying the benefits would be nice ?

So next year, EA should drain the reach for a week....?

 

[oldgit]

So next year, EA should drain the reach for a week....?

You might think that.....could not possibly comment however if urgent repairs suddenly and most regretably became necessary !

 

[oldgit]

You might think that.....could not possibly comment however if urgent repairs suddenly and most regretably became neccesary !

 

[Chris_d]

Don't understand all the vitriol against the biggest annual event on the river, attracts 1000's on land and 100's of boats its a real feel good festival.

However agree HRR should pay the EA for their extra presense, are we sure they don't?

 

[Old Crusty]

Don't understand all the vitriol against the biggest annual event on the river, attracts 1000's on land and 100's of boats its a real feel good festival.

However agree HRR should pay the EA for their extra presense, are we sure they don't?

I agree with you, it's all of that and a bit of English tradition, however, it is a costly and showcase event for the EA and has become a strain on resource over the last 10 years (let's ignore the silly tweets and childish PR stunts for a moment). The Waterways team in the role of navigation authority exists to protect the public right of navigation across all parts of the river and HRR/Festival absorbs much of the EA capability for over two weeks each season.

Most of the incidents they will refer to are very minor and that could just as easily be dealt with by other boaters or any of the many stewarding craft flitting up and down the course. To have five PBs plus crews and senior managers, a so-called command centre with welfare facilities and be there for two weeks is expensive.

I don't have a problem if the EA is actually regulating the river but it's time HRR and Festival made a contribution to the policing work on the river. Certainly up to 2016, the EA received no payment for attending these events as there have been none throughout recent history. Dialogue with HRR was opened and HRR refused to consider any payment. If you look at HRR's accounts for last year, I think you might conclude that a small contribution wouldn't put much of a dent in the balance sheet:

https://document-api-images-prod.s3...47003e2b424bad38dccc819de61a6dd0a315aa406966e

 

[Chris_d]

Sounds like the EA just need a better neigotiator, HRR aren't going to pay for something if they can get it for free and the EA can't refuse to attend as they have navigation and public safety to consider. Both would be negligent if there was serious incident.

 

[Andy Soper]

Old Crusty wrote:
'I don't have a problem if the EA is actually regulating the river but it's time HRR and Festival made a contribution to the policing work on the river. Certainly up to 2016, the EA received no payment for attending these events as there have been none throughout recent history. Dialogue with HRR was opened and HRR refused to consider any payment.'

EA Thames Waterways confirmed at the February 2018 Thames Navigation Users Forum that HRR and the Festival continue to refuse to make any contribution towards EA costs of attending HRR. EA do not help themselves by over-egging attendance. For public safety 2 patrol boats based at Hambledon would seem more appropriate - one patrolling and Angel Guard. However that would not enable them to show off to the EA Chair, CEO etc. all their toys and to entertain them at the expense (60%) of our registration fees. What a rip-off! Thankfully the overtime bill at the locks should be down a bit this year with over 100 hours of volunteer labour at Hambledon - and perhaps similar at Marsh.

This may be scuttlebutt by me but I bet HRR charge the Music Festival for access and the swimmers (Henley mile etc) for exclusive use of 'their' water.

 

[TrueBlue]

Old Crusty wrote:
'I don't have a problem if the EA is actually regulating the river but it's time HRR and Festival made a contribution to the policing work on the river. Certainly up to 2016, the EA received no payment for attending these events as there have been none throughout recent history. Dialogue with HRR was opened and HRR refused to consider any payment.'

EA Thames Waterways confirmed at the February 2018 Thames Navigation Users Forum that HRR and the Festival continue to refuse to make any contribution towards EA costs of attending HRR. EA do not help themselves by over-egging attendance. For public safety 2 patrol boats based at Hambledon would seem more appropriate - one patrolling and Angel Guard. However that would not enable them to show off to the EA Chair, CEO etc. all their toys and to entertain them at the expense (60%) of our registration fees. What a rip-off! Thankfully the overtime bill at the locks should be down a bit this year with over 100 hours of volunteer labour at Hambledon - and perhaps similar at Marsh.

This may be scuttlebutt by me but I bet HRR charge the Music Festival for access and the swimmers (Henley mile etc) for exclusive use of 'their' water.

Perhaps I misunderstand but, charging the festival for access seems reasonable to me. However, charging for use of the water is really a step to far. After all, the navigation channel is split in twain once HRR is over.
Would you care to clarify??

 

[boatone]

Tweet from EA Harbourmaster at beginning of last week:

Rather a hollow invitation - restricted to a narrow navigation channel and stop at your peril.
Have you seen the price of moorings bank side along the course?
As for his use of the hashtag #welovethamesboating no one else, and I mean no one, is using it.

 

[Andy Soper]

Perhaps I misunderstand but, charging the festival for access seems reasonable to me. However, charging for use of the water is really a step to far. After all, the navigation channel is split in twain once HRR is over.
Would you care to clarify??

But it is not - when the Henley mile swim takes place boat traffic is forbidden in the regatta course.

See - https://mail.google.com/mail/u/0/#l...FRvwtQRxGVgqGgB?projector=1&messagePartId=0.2

And on a wider point nearly every HM Notice restricts navigation, enjoyment and often mooring opportunities for paying launch (motor boat) users to the advantage of rowers, swimmers and sailors who contribute very little to the management of the levels and flow of the river.

 

[boatone]

A previous waterway manager confided in me that they were surprised that powered craft users had not challenged the paltry contribution from the rowing community. They can hardly plead inability to pay, after all an individual membership of a Thames rowing club is several hundred pounds a year and even junior members pay 3 figure subs. The cost of registering a rowing eight is less than an angler pays for a rod licence.
As Andy says, every river restriction notice is effectively a denial or restriction of service for power boat users,
The EA will shortly issue a “consultation” proposing increases in Thames registration fees of 5.7% p.a. for 2019 and 2020. That will add around £80 to the fee for the average powered craft and approx. £3.40 for a rowing eight.
We currently contribute some £4 million to the river budget. This years contribution from British Rowing around £80k.
Please don’t tell me we are all in this together !

 

[Parabordi]

A previous waterway manager confided in me that they were surprised that powered craft users had not challenged the paltry contribution from the rowing community. They can hardly plead inability to pay, after all an individual membership of a Thames rowing club is several hundred pounds a year and even junior members pay 3 figure subs. The cost of registering a rowing eight is less than an angler pays for a rod licence.
As Andy says, every river restriction notice is effectively a denial or restriction of service for power boat users,
The EA will shortly issue a “consultation” proposing increases in Thames registration fees of 5.7% p.a. for 2019 and 2020. That will add around £80 to the fee for the average powered craft and approx. £3.40 for a rowing eight.
We currently contribute some £4 million to the river budget. This years contribution from British Rowing around £80k.
Please don’t tell me we are all in this together !

Your best post ever - now you are representing my views!

 

[oldgit]

One of the reasons the Maidstone River Festival foundered was that, after being in existence for a decade or two, the local Police became obliged to charge for their appearances, usually in the form of half a dozen specials walking up and down the river bank, asking folks to move their BBQs off the footpath.
Duties mainly involved making sure that the town did not grind to halt due to sheer amount of traffic and people attending the event, this would have been in addition to normal crowd control.
The police estimated this cost to be around £75.000 pounds, later reduced.
As the event was managed by half dozen local businessmen volunteering in their spare time, it was the final nail.
All this took place over 24 hours. Wondering if Henley asked to cough up for any additional police cover over entire week . ?

 

[Actionmat]

It's easy to spot the Police at Henley. They're the only ones who aren't wearing red trousers.

 

[boatone]

One of the reasons the Maidstone River Festival foundered was that, after being in existence for a decade or two, the local Police became obliged to charge for their appearances, usually in the form of half a dozen specials walking up and down the river bank, asking folks to move their BBQs off the footpath.
Duties mainly involved making sure that the town did not grind to halt due to sheer amount of traffic and people attending the event, this would have been in addition to normal crowd control.
The police estimated this cost to be around £75.000 pounds, later reduced.
As the event was managed by half dozen local businessmen volunteering in their spare time, it was the final nail.
All this took place over 24 hours. Wondering if Henley asked to cough up for any additional police cover over entire week . ?

Regrettably, all these discussions re a little bit extra charged here and there are just noise - at best sticking plasters of little consequence. The scale of the funding problem is now so large that they will only scratch the surface of providing a solution.
EA inform us that funding gap for all EA Waterways (of which Thames is by far the largest and most important) is around £20million. We currently contribute about £4million via registration fees and income from all other sources including grant in aid (public purse) for Thames is approximately another £4 million. Given current legislation and Treasury rules it is simply impossible to make the sums add up.

Watch this space.