Due Diligence

[wakeup]

Good to see you are outing this MB. I think this is the only way to deal with this on the forum.

We should have a board with a list of offending baots (raggies and stinkies) with details of the offence and give them an opportunity to respond (if they read the board) or just let it be known that those particular boats have incompetnant skippers.

yada yada..<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by wakeup on Mon Jun 17 12:19:12 2002 (server time).</FONT></P>

 

[tcm]

not all mb\'s are inconsiderate

I am already on record as totally disagreeing with many of the posts below, some of which i hope are jokey. Doesn't cost much if anything to give smaller and saily boats a wide berth.

Dreadful sorry to hear of yr knackered TV. PM me your address and I will send a free 6" tv. Very used, also has clock radio, morphy richardsy, but works. Needs an external aerial, but there is a socket for it. Mite only be 5".

 

[sailbadthesinner]

At least you cannot complain about his sense of Irony.

If it Cooks Flys or Floats, Rent it.

 

[halcyon]

KevB

OK you have convinced me that we need l a licence scheme and tests, keep it up you will convince the authorities next.

Most of the problems are way are from people buying a first boat, and just bashing around, resulting in wash problem from boat with bows in the air. They concider skippering a motor boat is the same as driving a car, after all it's got a engine, wheel, gears and a accelerator, unfortunatly no rearview mirror.


I've been pottering around here for nearly 20 years with motorboats or yachts, what have you done?


Brian

 

[wakeup]

Re: not all mb\'s are inconsiderate

I am a keen skier and I hear exactly the same argument when it comes to boarders versus skiers.

Basically you get the same scenario, some baorders are less considerate than others and the same goes for skiers, although the skiers adopt a holier than thou approach because skiing is thought to be 'original' where as boarders are the upstarts.

Now in reality what casued the problems was skiers moved in one way and knew how to predict the movement of other skiers and same wiht snowbaorders but skiers could never predict boards and vice versa and hence many collisions occuured when overtaking.

The only rule that works on the slopes is to give each other plenty of space and the same should apply to the water.

It takes very little effort for a stinkie to throttle back and steer clear of a raggie, it takes an awful lot more effort for for a raggie to tack under sail.

So it is all about common sense at the end of the day rather than a divine right of way.

Just maybe there isn't enough common sense around these days.

yada yada..

 

[jfm]

Re: A code please

I must say I'm in favour of a written or defined code (see the scuttlebut thred).

Castaway I'm sorry you had a bad day and can understand your annoyance. But the other skipper might simply have known the bad effects he was causing - throught carelessness and ignorance perhaps, but not malice. 14 knots feels slow in a big Fairline, and in that location (the "channel" where you line up the war memorial and apartment bock, right?) he may have been reluctant to give a wider berth.

I'm not at all condoning or condemning. I'm just saying that a given set of actions can be considered rude/annoying by one person, and perfickly OK (perhaps thru ignorance/stupidity) by another. So we need an agreed code, like the 100m rule etc, and prefrably the RIBs, as suggested on scuttlebut.

We need a competent authority to do this, not mbc. RYA or someone wd be a good start, or the Southampton Harbourmaster if considered mostly a Solent prob

All IMHO

 

[hlb]

I'm getting to feel like mother hen. First we have to give way to them all the time. Because there uncontrolable. Then we have to guess which way there going next. Now they want us to slow down to three knots in order to pass them. Costing us gallons in extra fuel, not to mention the time lost in the pub. Aint going to get anywhere by tea time at this rate. Maybe they should just sail round in the bath. <G>

No one can force me to come here-----------
----- I'm a Volunteer!!!

Haydn

 

[Col]

Hang on a minute........

Don't forget, regardless of what supplimentary rules/code of conduct you can dream up, this skipper was already breaking the law.

There is a 10 knt speed limit extending 1/2 nm out side harbour entrance.
As this is a navel dockyard, the penalties are severe, from memory, up to £2000 and/or 6mnths imprisonment.

If this didn't put him off, do you think a code of conduct would?

http://www.arweb.co.uk/argallery/album02/

 

[KevB]

Well done halcyon, I take it what you are saying is for the past 20 years you have gained a lot of experience and that makes you better than me? Congratulations!
Unfortunately that's not always so, my 85 year old neighbour has been driving for more years than I have been alive and he is a menace on the road. Always dithering and generally not aware of what's going on around him. So be careful because you may just fall into that category. (an old fuddy duddy who hasn't a clue).

Keep it up the good work ;¬)

what d'ya mean it's not made to get wet!!

 

[castaway]

Re: not all mb\'s are inconsiderate

Thanks very much for yr kind offer, however I asked a friend to pop in to Maplins to pick up another ( they are only 20 quid).

I can say that the really encouraging message that comes as a result of my original post is how many MB owners take the matter wake seriously ( of course with the usual notable exceptions ). In the crowded playground of the Solent that can only make for better relationships and after all we do this for fun dont we.

All best Nick

 

[KevB]

Re: not all mb\'s are inconsiderate

Excuse me, I resemble that remark!

what d'ya mean it's not made to get wet!!

 

[halcyon]

Well the lad by us has been driving for 12 months, had for speeding two times, does that make him a safer driver.


Brian

 

[KevB]

No, doesn't mean he is unsafe either just unlucky.

 

[lanason]

Re: not all mb\'s are inconsiderate

I'm sure most of us on here actually do care about wash (even if we have all taken the p*ss in this thread).

I'm lucky that Milford Haven is massive and with few boats its easy to give a wide berth, except for that damn great big Irish Ferry that chased me accross the channel - big b*gg*r that one.

However I'm sure that the wash I give out at full plan is muchg smaller than doing 12 knts pushing water out the way. And mines only a little boat. Obviously doing 3knts hardly breaks wind (oooops) breaks water.
Am I right with that comment or not ????
So is 30 knts better than 12 knts for a raggie ???

Adrian

Any jobs going ??

 

[jfm]

Re: Bit of a fallacy on high speed/small wake imho

Not sure that's correct. I know that wake size does not increase proportionately to speed, and can get smaller as speed increases on some parts of the curve, but at all speeds above when the bow begins to rise, till flat out, the wake will be pretty massive to a raggie. It's just that the wave in the wake moves laterally at an almost fixed speed, so at 30kts your wake will be long and thin, and you will be so far away from the victim when he gets hit that you wont see imho

 

[Bergman]

Re: Bit of a fallacy on high speed/small wake imho

Sounds right but not entirely convinced

Once played at being safety boat during powerboat championships.

Those things were wizzing past at around 90 -100 mph, never noticed any particularly big wash from them. Closest was about 50 mtrs away - which starts to get a bit worrying.

The helicoptors were the worst part - they followed the boats about 10 ft above the water with a cameraman dangling out the side. Thought I might have had to extract my mast from the remains a couple of times.

 

[lanason]

Re: Bit of a fallacy on high speed/small wake imho

mmm taking that a stage further is the wake is long and thin it will take longer to travel laterally and therefore more time to dissipate. Thus safer for Raggies. ????

Once fully on the plane then the amount of water being displaced is very low thus the wake will be low. Or am I taking out of my transom ????

In case anyone thinks I am suggesting that going past a raggie at full speed is a good idea, I am just trying understand more about wakes. Interestingly along with many others I'm sure I will be EVEN more considerate after having read this thread.
Being a raggie must be similar to me being over taken on the Motorway by an Artic lorry when towing my caravan. Even less opportunity to turn into the wake !!!!

Adrian

Any jobs going ??

 

[halcyon]

Re: Bit of a fallacy on high speed/small wake imho

Would not say speed is a problem, from watching the wake on mates Sealine, at high speed there is little wake.
From memory all the problems have been with badly trimmed powerboats ie bow up/stern down, or displacement boats at max speed.
The worst we have are Navy patrol boats, threy now slow down in Carrick Roads, but out at sea 3-4 ft wakes are common.

In all honesty if powerboats gave yachts a working clearance, the wake could be handled by the yacht, and yachts would not be tacking under motorboat bows.


Brian

 

[hlb]

Re: Bit of a fallacy on high speed/small wake imho

So thats it, in a nut shell. If you slow down for the raggies, you make more wash. So to keep the raggies happy ( If you can.) Then flat out is the best.
Must get bigger engine for raggies.
Must get bigger engine for raggies.
Must get bigger engine for raggies.
Must get bigger engine for raggies.
Must get bigger engine for raggies.
Must get bigger engine for raggies.
Must get bigger engine for raggies.
Must get bigger engine for raggies.
Must get bigger engine for raggies.
Must get bigger engine for raggies.
Must get bigger engine for raggies.
Must get bigger engine for raggies.
Must get bigger engine for raggies.
Must get bigger engine for raggies.
Must get bigger engine for raggies.
Must get bigger engine for raggies.


No one can force me to come here-----------
----- I'm a Volunteer!!!

Haydn

 

[tcm]

badly fitting cap

well, at least praps this shows that wake isn't a "non-issue"....