Dragging whilst on anchor

simonfraser

simonfraser

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Uhh apologies, got a 10kg delta 6mm chain on 8m power boat.
Set at high tide, checked by reversing, in soft mud 30m chain out, now in 1m water.
After 4 hours of 20 knots of wind, no chop to speak of, I have dragged 50 m. Tide has dropped 3m.

It’s on a bow roller, it needs to self stow. Fortress 45’ highly rated, but will it self stow ?

Or ya all know better ?!
 
Soft mud you say... 20 knots of wind you say... how much windage do you have? What was the tide doing? How much scope was 30 m of chain?
 
Know the substrate you are going to be putting your anchor down in as they all have strengths and weakness's. A delta in my experience is no good in really soft mud. I've seen them drag often before in soft mud especially if you are on a short scope which Delta's dont seem to like much. However in so saying did you throw it out into a known good anchorage spot? Not all substrates are conducive to anchoring. I have a claw, great in soft mud, useless when there is weed, great on a short scope. The delta isn't bothered as much by weed. As a result I have both types to cover my cruising grounds and anchorage spots.
 
I assume your anchor is a fortress aluminium anchor, I struggle to understand how their light weight in water allows them to dig in.

The fortress is an aluminium version of a Danforth principle anchor very popular in the 1960's/70's.

I was never very keen on these my father had these on various boats and sometimes they dragged.

I have had Bruce anchors and they don't bite in weed and in mud tey form a ball of mud in the flukes which skids over the surface as I found out.

I have a Delta as in https://www.lewmar.com/node/11595 which I rate. They seem to stow well on most bow rollers.
 
Bandit said:
I assume your anchor is a fortress aluminium anchor, I struggle to understand how their light weight in water allows them to dig in.

The fortress is an aluminium version of a Danforth principle anchor very popular in the 1960's/70's.

I was never very keen on these my father had these on various boats and sometimes they dragged.

I have had Bruce anchors and they don't bite in weed and in mud tey form a ball of mud in the flukes which skids over the surface as I found out.

I have a Delta as in https://www.lewmar.com/node/11595 which I rate. They seem to stow well on most bow rollers.
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I’m sorry but I can’t agree. My Delta now sits on the basement floor by the dryer, apart from there the only place I think it could belong is being towed by a tractor. It’s a plough! It’s made for digging in shallow then breaking the surface, like a.....plough. A spade type anchor digs in, like a spade. I now have a Rocna
 
The trouble with discussing anchors on a forum, is if you ask twenty people you get twenty different viewpoints. On the Scuttlebut forum anchors are almost a banned subject as people come to virtual blows.

Rocna has a good reputation.

There again I have had no problem with my Delta and I have anchored on sand in a 4 knot tideway with a sloppy sea and it worked fine.
 
Bandit said:
The trouble with discussing anchors on a forum, is if you ask twenty people you get twenty different viewpoints. On the Scuttlebut forum anchors are almost a banned subject as people come to virtual blows.

Rocna has a good reputation.

There again I have had no problem with my Delta and I have anchored on sand in a 4 knot tideway with a sloppy sea and it worked fine.
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I will fight you they call me the Rock ,na
 
:) indeed, not wanting to start another argument !

Rocna Vulcan looks interesting too.

just thinking about the 50m drag last night, did it 'set' in very liquid mud and then pulled into a better patch ?
once it had dragged early in the night it set and stopped.

if the anchor is too efficient it may put extra strain on the chain etc, might be better to drag than to lose the anchor altogether ..
 
simonfraser said:
Uhh apologies, got a 10kg delta 6mm chain on 8m power boat.
Set at high tide, checked by reversing, in soft mud 30m chain out, now in 1m water.
After 4 hours of 20 knots of wind, no chop to speak of, I have dragged 50 m. Tide has dropped 3m.

It’s on a bow roller, it needs to self stow. Fortress 45’ highly rated, but will it self stow ?

Or ya all know better ?!
Click to expand...


Are you sure you have dragged? I say this because you have a lot of chain out there: 30 - 1 in one metre (LW maybe), roughly 8 - 1 at 4m height.

Maybe you have just swung. Bights of chain being dragged across the ground can make a very convincing dragging sound. The Delta generally has a pretty good reputation, not up to the finest but 1/3rd of the price.

If you are considering a change Knox anchors have been making friends:
http://www.knoxanchors.com

Very well made, UK designed and constructed but alas not cheap.
 
your post has surprised me I have a slightly smaller delta ( boat 26ft) and anchor in the Mersey with 8mm chain with a 4.1 scope with tides running at up to 7knots and up to 10m tide heights never budged except when it went down on a limestone pavement. Sea bed mainly sand/mud.Just wondering if the fact that you reversed every 10m that the weight of the scope was not allowed to set because of that??
 
simonfraser said:
possible, think i reversed it quite gently, just after the bow turned towards the anchor point i let some more chain out.
westerly wind 20 kts with gusts, was yawing impressively on the nylon V rode.
lying across the tide, tucked up against the shallow shore.
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imo and my own local experience it's not good practise with a Delta to dig it in while pulling when your scope is too short. It lifts the shank and prevents it from burying itself deeply. Let out ~ half your sufficient chain for your depth while holding the boat in place and then pay out as the boat starts to drift away. Once it is all out just gently nudge it in with a soft pull on reverse in idle until the chain becomes taut, then leave it. Dont be tempted to bury it in with too much power, that has the opposite effect.
 
BruceK said:
imo and my own local experience it's not good practise with a Delta to dig it in while pulling when your scope is too short. It lifts the shank and prevents it from burying itself deeply. Let out ~ half your sufficient chain for your depth while holding the boat in place and then pay out as the boat starts to drift away. Once it is all out just gently nudge it in with a soft pull on reverse in idle until the chain becomes taut, then leave it. Dont be tempted to bury it in with too much power, that has the opposite effect.
Click to expand...

in the Mersey I just lower the full amount of anchor and chain and the push of the tide seems to set it ok every time. I don't even reverse. Perhaps I have been lucky thus far
 
Mike k said:
in the Mersey I just lower the full amount of anchor and chain and the push of the tide seems to set it ok every time. I don't even reverse. Perhaps I have been lucky thus far
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That works too if you have a current doing the pulling. My anchorages are quite tight so I do like to pay out some if there are boats behind me.
.... just incase
 
Delta + soft mud = drag. No surprise, its a plough. Try a Rocna
 
Without wanting to argue and wanting to share my experiences only, I've never had a problem with delta. It held my boat all night in the 45 gusting 55 knot August storm in Ibiza in 2015 when several boats got smashed and several around me dragged. I've never had it drag. And that's only a 50kg holding a 58 tonne boat.

I bent it last year so bought a 60kg Ultra which I also like a lot.

Btw I always drop anchor and let the chain out in a bit of an untangled line then turn off engines. I never do that thing where you run engines in reverse to "set" the anchor. I don't see the need for it. I use scope of 5 in light weather and 8 or more in a storm. Never 3.
 
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