Dodecanese and migrants

[NornaBiron]

Do you have any evidence that these "refugees" were being persecuted in Turkey?

ATB,

John G

No, none. I have the same resources as the vast majority of people, the media. However, I have met lots of refugees, I have been instrumental in rescuing refugees from the water, I have seen many hundreds of refugees waiting to have their papers processed before being allowed to move on. The result of this is that I am not so detached from the situation and see the refugees as people, not just a problem.

For some reason many thousands of these people are deeming it safer to cross to Greece, knowing that many are drowning in the process, rather than stay in Turkey.

I sincerely hope that none are setting off tonight, it is freezing outside and blowing a gale here in Pethi, Symi. The weather is worse north of us. I will be very surprised if there are not reports of further casualties over the next few days.

 

[sailaboutvic]

Do you have any evidence that these "refugees" were being persecuted in Turkey?

ATB,

John G

What type of evidence are you looking for?

 

[OldBawley]

Just to lighten up the topic I have a small anecdote concerning migrants.

We ware anchored in Pedi bay on Symi island.
My son and his girlfriend ware visiting us and since we only have one ( big ) bed, they slept in a small tent on the beach.
One morning a big group of people ware descending the hill on the North side of Pedi bay.
Migrants, put a shore at Aya marina at the entrance of Pedi bay.
The poor people ware in a terrible state. I saw some of them limping, and they ware all covered in red dust.
My son, just woken up was using the water hose of the taverna in the North west corner of the bay and some of the migrant men begged my son for water.
The group then left, walking to Symi town.
The owner of the small shipyard came over to my son and asked “ Kurds ? “ on which my shocked and apparently not totally woken son answered “ No, no, Belgium. “ ( He lives in Belgium. )
The old man just shook his head, made a “Tss tss “ noise and walked away.
So all rumours that Belgians are migrating are bollocks.

 

[macd]

Do you have any evidence that these "refugees" were being persecuted in Turkey?

What has that to do with anything? Do you know of a UN convention which obliges neighbouring states, and only neighbouring states, to accept refugees? Turkey (and Lebanon, Jordan) have far more refugees than it can possibly cope with. The actual numbers of refugees in Turkey are often guesstimates, but range from perhaps 1.5 to well over 2 million. As of June last year UNHCR knew of over 1.9 million and rising. This is a serious global problem demanding serious thought and effort. Would that it were merely about the "ambience" of holiday beaches.

 

[houldsworth]

you all seem to be getting heavily into politics.

OldBawley had interesting tale, above.

Knowing Pedi well this factual tale interests me and as I hope to move up to Lesvos this year how bad do you think it will be up there?

ps. I don't read the Daily Mail!

 

[Wife of Lofticus]

Many of the Syrian refugees we talked to, whilst on Lesvos for the month of August, had spent 2-3 years in the refugee camps in Turkey. Unable to work (legally) and with their lives on hold, they were waiting to return to their homes. When this option became increasingly impossible they took the decision to travel to Europe. The young people and families we met were desperate to work and get their lives back on track. They only have one small rucksack of possessions and hope for the future. I can never imagine anyone making the decision to cross to the Greek islands lightly. They know the risks but still they come... We don't have the answers to the macro issues this crisis has raised, but we do know that if it were our sons we would encourage them to travel and try to find a life. One final point of note, try as hard as we could we could only find one young man who named the UK as his chosen destination. Not quite how the media portray it here...
From a different angle we left our boat in Mytilene marina on Lesvos for July and lived on it there for the month of August. We didn't have any issues arising from the huge number of migrants on the island.
It would appear things may be organised differently this year from the announcement of a NATO task force yesterday - talk of returning migrants to Turkey and more attempts to break up the trafficking rings. I guess only time will show how effective this is. In the short term more refugees may be tempted to risk even more dangerous crossings in the winter weather to avoid the implementation of this task force. Desperate times and desperately sad for all involved.

 

[catmandoo]

Many of the Syrian refugees we talked to, whilst on Lesvos for the month of August, had spent 2-3 years in the refugee camps in Turkey. Unable to work (legally) and with their lives on hold, they were waiting to return to their homes. When this option became increasingly impossible they took the decision to travel to Europe. The young people and families we met were desperate to work and get their lives back on track. They only have one small rucksack of possessions and hope for the future. I can never imagine anyone making the decision to cross to the Greek islands lightly. They know the risks but still they come... We don't have the answers to the macro issues this crisis has raised, but we do know that if it were our sons we would encourage them to travel and try to find a life. One final point of note, try as hard as we could we could only find one young man who named the UK as his chosen destination. Not quite how the media portray it here...
From a different angle we left our boat in Mytilene marina on Lesvos for July and lived on it there for the month of August. We didn't have any issues arising from the huge number of migrants on the island.
It would appear things may be organised differently this year from the announcement of a NATO task force yesterday - talk of returning migrants to Turkey and more attempts to break up the trafficking rings. I guess only time will show how effective this is. In the short term more refugees may be tempted to risk even more dangerous crossings in the winter weather to avoid the implementation of this task force. Desperate times and desperately sad for all involved.

Well they now have refuge processing centres and camps on Kos Leros Samos and Lesbos . How long do you think these will last while governments procrastinate?

Certainlyisland life won't be the same . Already tear gassing protestors on Kos

 

[NornaBiron]

No processing site on Kos yet, still being fought over and referendum tomorrow about it.

 

[Resolution]

I was asked yesterday:
If Syrian refugees have enough money to pay the traffickers ?? $1,000 a head to get from Turkey to Greece, why don't the refugees instead apply for refuge at any EU consulate in Turkey, and then bus train or fly direct to that country?

Any one know the real status?

 

[BrianH]

I was asked yesterday:
If Syrian refugees have enough money to pay the traffickers ?? $1,000 a head to get from Turkey to Greece, why don't the refugees instead apply for refuge at any EU consulate in Turkey, and then bus train or fly direct to that country?

Any one know the real status?

Application for asylum in any country can only be applied for within that country's borders. A consulate is merely an office within another country's border to deal with nationals of the representative country and not, as an embassy is, considered part of that representative country. Embassies are usually well-guarded and unlikely to allow a migrant access. Even so, embassies of most countries are instructed that they may not process asylum applications.

An initial asylum application results only in an asylum claim and should be be accompanied by documentary evidence such as a passport that most of the present waves of migrants do not have. This then puts the prospective applicant into an unofficial limbo that lasts for some days until granted as an official application. Embassies are just not equipped for such processing.

A very highly-publicised exception was when Julian Assange applied for political asylum at the Ecuadorian embassy in London. However, speculation was that due to his revelations in WikiLeaks concerning damning cables from the US Ambassador in Ecuador, the country had made a prior offer of asylum to him as a solution to his imminent deportation to Sweden.

 

[Resolution]

Thanks Barnac1e!