Kurrawong_Kid
Well-Known Member
Using mobile phones whilst driving? Self employed manipulating tax allowances? I think you have a rosey eyed view of our obedience to our laws and government!
CV19 restrictions on boat on private mooring
- Thread starter sarabande
- Start date
Kurrawong_Kid
Well-Known Member
+1!
Kurrawong_Kid
Well-Known Member
Visit the “straits times” and be informed on how thoroughly the Singapore authorities have traced and isolated their 250 or so cases. There is a potted history of each case and their link to each other. When I last looked (Tuesday?) there was only one case not linked, but they were working on it. 5 million people on an Island the size of Wight. Police, medical authorities, social workers cooperating and working together. Impressive. Puts our “turf war” beaurocrats to shame.
JumbleDuck
Well-Known Member
Unfortunately it only seems to have bought them a bit of time. New cases there are growing as fast - albeit from a lower base - than anywhere else. From yesterday evening:
V1701
Well-Known Member
Whichever way you look at it the more time we can buy now the fewer lose their lives before a vaccine is developed, trialled, approved, manufactured, distributed, administered. Unfortunately some people will either just not get that or not really give a shit. A friend of mine rang me half pissed from a pub in London last night and told me he was still going to the gym, in fact went to a really good class the night before & if he gets it he'll be fine, etc, etc. I could hardly talk to him. Some people just will not comply unless they are forced to. What it'll be like in India, Africa, South America doesn't even bear thinking about. We're talking about how many intensive care beds per 100,000 we have versus Germany where they'll be talking about where to dig the next mass burial pit...
JumbleDuck
Well-Known Member
Germany has had five times as many cases as the UK and half as many deaths. We're not really in a position to sneer at them.
newtothis
Well-Known Member
Reading between the unfortunate grammar, I don't think that's what V1701 was saying.
Try:
What it'll be like in India, Africa, South America doesn't even bear thinking about. We're talking about how many intensive care beds per 100,000 we have versus Germany, whereas India, Africa, and South America will be talking about where to dig the next mass burial pit.
James_Calvert
Well-Known Member
The YC is now closed so no showers there.
V1701
Well-Known Member
Germany has had five times as many cases as the UK and half as many deaths. We're not really in a position to sneer at them.
Sorry for any confusion I wasn't having a go at anyone in any way only trying to illustrate the difference between countries such as UK & Germany where we are fortunate to have good, modern (free) health care while in other countries where the virus has yet to begin to take hold and they have poor health care. Stay safe everyone...
JumbleDuck
Well-Known Member
Good point, and I retract the word "sneer" with apologies.
V1701
Well-Known Member
laika
Well-Known Member
We're all saved.! There *is* no CV19. Apparently they went from CV11 "Visit Finland" to CV20 "Imagine your Korea"
Clipper Round the World Yacht Race - Wikipedia
Clipper Round the World Yacht Race - Wikipedia
Seven Spades
Well-Known Member
It is all to do with ventilators. Germany has 29/100,000 population, Italy has 10, we have 6.
However, there is some very big news coming. One of our companies will announce that they are going to make 1000 a week next week if the trial is a success. I am not going to say more.
Daydream believer
Well-Known Member
Easy. Just lean over the guard rail , look down on him then sneeze or cough.
Daydream believer
Well-Known Member
Korea??
My wife reckons the fat little northern dictator lobbed a bit of virus over the chinkey border & caused all this.
But then she is still waiting for a man to land on the moon
PHN
Well-Known Member
I read several non-english articles from virologists and other experts that provide better insight in corona and precautions. This post does also address several comments made in this topic by other forumites and why that comment might be wrong.
I am not an expert myself, so don't take my word for it. Use this information to google for your own facts/confirmations and make your own conclusions.
In 2002 we had the SARS epidemic which causes infections to the lower airways that could result in life threatening pneumonia. In 2012 the world saw the MERS epidemic and more recently we probably all remember the ebola outbreak in Africa.
Corona is related to SARS with the major difference that it can also thrive in the upper airways like the nose and for that reason is much more contagious. People can unknowingly (asymptotic) be carrier of corona and infect others simply by transferring drops of moisture from e.g. the nose. Also faeces of an infected person is contagious.
Lab tests were held with corona infected moisture which showed that this infected moisture was still airborne after 30 minutes. In real life outside in a park with wind it will most likely not last that long, but can at least remain airborne for several minutes, depending on local conditions. When we have e.g. joggers that blow their nose, spit on the ground or otherwise leave traces behind, the pocket of air in which this happens remains infectious for many minutes to other people after this infected person is already gone. So, having a 1 second near contact with a jogger is indeed a risk.
Presumably people do not show this behaviour in a local supermarket and hence this is not a risk in such a location, but is a risk outside. This is why it is strongly recommended not to show that behaviour anywhere at all.
Sneezing inside or outside may also cause "spray". Actually one virologist referred to a Mythbusters "the safe sneeze" episode which can be found on youtube. It clearly demonstrates that the "elbow sneeze" causes the least "spray", no infected hands and hence the least risk of infection. A distance of at least 1,5 meter (better 2 meters) is recommended to avoid the biggest risk of being in someone else's "spray zone". However, moisture left behind after sneezing when people are already gone may also cause a risk.
The infection can start from the nose. When you touch your nose and then touch an object like a door knob that object becomes infected and may infect anyone else touching that object and then touches their head/nose/... The virus may survive up to 72 hours under ideal circumstances on this object and cause infection risk for everyone touching this object during that time.
Depending on the situation and the type of object (or airborne) the virus can survive several hours to several days after the infected person is already gone.
What can we expect for the future? According to the experts corona is here to stay and will develop into a less dangerous virus over several years when a cure is found and a certain form of "group immunity" has developped among the world population.
Until then we must survive and take care that our health care system is not overloaded with more patients than it can treat.
The reason why it is not recommended/allowed (depening on the country) to go for e.g. solo sailing is not primarily about your infection risk - though you probably start and end in a marina - but to avoid overloading the already busy emergency services in case of a mishap. You also put them at risk, because when they rush out to help you they don't know if you are yes or no infected. Maybe you don't even know it yourself.
I am not an expert myself, so don't take my word for it. Use this information to google for your own facts/confirmations and make your own conclusions.
In 2002 we had the SARS epidemic which causes infections to the lower airways that could result in life threatening pneumonia. In 2012 the world saw the MERS epidemic and more recently we probably all remember the ebola outbreak in Africa.
Corona is related to SARS with the major difference that it can also thrive in the upper airways like the nose and for that reason is much more contagious. People can unknowingly (asymptotic) be carrier of corona and infect others simply by transferring drops of moisture from e.g. the nose. Also faeces of an infected person is contagious.
Lab tests were held with corona infected moisture which showed that this infected moisture was still airborne after 30 minutes. In real life outside in a park with wind it will most likely not last that long, but can at least remain airborne for several minutes, depending on local conditions. When we have e.g. joggers that blow their nose, spit on the ground or otherwise leave traces behind, the pocket of air in which this happens remains infectious for many minutes to other people after this infected person is already gone. So, having a 1 second near contact with a jogger is indeed a risk.
Presumably people do not show this behaviour in a local supermarket and hence this is not a risk in such a location, but is a risk outside. This is why it is strongly recommended not to show that behaviour anywhere at all.
Sneezing inside or outside may also cause "spray". Actually one virologist referred to a Mythbusters "the safe sneeze" episode which can be found on youtube. It clearly demonstrates that the "elbow sneeze" causes the least "spray", no infected hands and hence the least risk of infection. A distance of at least 1,5 meter (better 2 meters) is recommended to avoid the biggest risk of being in someone else's "spray zone". However, moisture left behind after sneezing when people are already gone may also cause a risk.
The infection can start from the nose. When you touch your nose and then touch an object like a door knob that object becomes infected and may infect anyone else touching that object and then touches their head/nose/... The virus may survive up to 72 hours under ideal circumstances on this object and cause infection risk for everyone touching this object during that time.
Depending on the situation and the type of object (or airborne) the virus can survive several hours to several days after the infected person is already gone.
What can we expect for the future? According to the experts corona is here to stay and will develop into a less dangerous virus over several years when a cure is found and a certain form of "group immunity" has developped among the world population.
Until then we must survive and take care that our health care system is not overloaded with more patients than it can treat.
The reason why it is not recommended/allowed (depening on the country) to go for e.g. solo sailing is not primarily about your infection risk - though you probably start and end in a marina - but to avoid overloading the already busy emergency services in case of a mishap. You also put them at risk, because when they rush out to help you they don't know if you are yes or no infected. Maybe you don't even know it yourself.
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FlyingGoose
Well-Known Member
Everything you say is right and is what is reflected in the UK and its policy and what is coming out of UK institutions,
what I do not agree IMHO is this scenario of a lifeboat or a Coastguard rescue helicopter coming out to safe some one as taking away vital emergency services , I would not think that at this stage they are needed to combat this virus,
secondly if we are allowed to go to the shops the chemists , walk the dogs even if we face restrictions like the EU we can still fall over , get hit by a car or any other accident that happens to the general public every day , so we would be taking up emergency services time, so the answer is to self isolate in a curfew , which no country outwith authoritarian societies have implemented .
The boating community is a fraction of the population that will still be allowed to move even with restrictions, there is also many marinas that will not or can not get boats in so again more reduced numbers , so let those with boats in the water and getting in the water to enjoy something of this miserable experience we are all facing.
At this moment Scotland is being invaded with camper-vans filled with the retired trying to escape the Virus many from England this is more a strain on emergency services that an experienced boater sailing his boat in Summer
PHN
Well-Known Member
@FlyingGoose: A rescue at sea is for more complicated than a stranded camper-van waiting for a repair truck. I don't want to deny anyone their sailing joy, however there is a bigger issue to be considered these days. With regards to visiting shops, walking dogs, etc those are considered necessary activities.
JumbleDuck
Well-Known Member
This is an area in which we can help by moderating our behaviour a bit - it's a good time to avoid doing things witha significant probability of requiring NHS help - not least because it might not be available. That doesn't mean sitting indoors all the time, but it's probably not a good to go rock climbing/
I'm lucky because I have a nice garden and a wrkshop full of interesting things to do (ie things I have been putting off doing for years). I have huge sympathy with people going stir crazy in flats, and don't begrudge them a bit of time outside.
James W
Well-Known Member
I was pretty blasé about this a couple of weeks ago but it started to bite this week when the marina said a lot of people had cancelled their launches this spring. I thought the boat was the perfect place to social distance the family from others, I have a mud mooring, isolated enough from anyone and they could play as they always do but avoiding contact.
However, as time goes on, the models and projections don’t look good and I’ll now be discussing a plan b with the yard.
However, as time goes on, the models and projections don’t look good and I’ll now be discussing a plan b with the yard.