Cruising in the Med

Hey Lemain,

Have you read Robert Hughes' 'Barcelona'?

You should get in touch with him. I feel sure he would value your impressive depth of knowledge born of your obvious total immersion in Spain.

How long were you there for again?
 
No, I haven't read him. Should I? What point are you making?

Barcelona is Catalan and the people have a very different culture to the Andalucians, who have Moorish roots. Spain has very different 'regional' cultures -- of course many would say that the are 'national' rather than 'regional'. The same is, of course, true of many European states especially those that were united more recently. The Civil War is still living memory for some and only one generation behind them, in any case.
 
Well SpiceIslander1 look what you got from your simple question.

In general I agree with Lemain ie you have to at least try to understand the culture you are entering. For such a small area as the Mediterranian each culture seems to be significantly different.
Its all too easy to work from stereotypes of the different races and to be fair, the only stereotypes which I have found to be reliable are British and German. Whoops am I in trouble!!!!!
Anyway the best approach to Med cruising is to make firm plans and stay flexible! You will meet wonderful, helpful people along the way which will help to balance out the occasional "difficult" experience.
 
'Hmmmm...well it's nothing to do with 'respect and courtesy', it is a cultural thing. I'm talking about the mainland, not the Islands which are totally different.'

Don't think I mentioned Islands at all in my post
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We heard similar horror stories of how officious and unwelcoming the Portugese were. To such an extent we were prepared to skip Portugal altogether. How totally wrong we would have been. Yes paper filling took it's time but the people were delightful.
One thing we have learned over the past 13 years is to make up your own mind & don't always believe another persons generalizations.
 
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We heard similar horror stories of how officious and unwelcoming the Portugese were.

[/ QUOTE ]No, the Spanish along that coast and not at all officious and they are very welcoming. Delightful people and we are seriously thinking of living there, to integrate into their society.

It's just that they don't view the 'wild camping' or anchoring thing in the way that the ordinary northern European, French or Brit does. As long as you understand where they are coming from you won't have a problem...on the other hand there are only a handful of useful anchorages along the whole coast; it isn't a place to cruise in the summer. Best get to the Islands or France -- or over to Corsica and Sardinia if you want lazy days at anchor slipping over the back into the sea every few hours.

If anyone wants to do that coast they would be best advised to budget on marinas all the way then consider any nights at anchor as a bonus otherwise it will be very hard to see the hinterland.
 
Sorry Lemain
We seem to be at crossed purposes here. The 'similarity' was one of 'personal interpretations' not that the Spanish & Portugese are officious.

Likewise, we definately don't have a problem /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

However - I DO agree with your closing paragraph..

Hope you're both well.
 
We are spending our third winter in Porto Vecchio, south east Corsica, cruising localy and as far as the northern half of Sardinia and love it. Plenty of prety safe anchorages around, reasonable winter fees in Corsica, and we hear a lot cheaper in some sardinian harbours but summers very expensive on both islands and very busy.
We arrived from the french inland waterways, coasting along the south coast and then along the italian coast onto Elba and then to Corsica. We liked the french coast but had a rather bad experience of Italy untill we got to elba. Corsica is gorgeous both at sea and inland and Porto Vecchio is a very safe harbour.
 
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Hope you're both well.

[/ QUOTE ]More or less, thanks /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif Though S. still has shoulder trouble...yet other little op in in the UK in a fortnight. Let's hope they can sort it this time or I'll buy a book and DIM. Are you all well? It's much cooler here in Rome than Spain -- but it has made nice change.
 
Thanks to all who have posted many useful comments. It would appear that I need to be prepared to use marinas along the Spanish coast until I arrive in France, apart from cruising the Balearics.

Does anyone recommend any anchorages along the Spanish Mediterranean coast or places to avoid, and also marinas that dont charge the earth in the summer season?

With regards to cruising down the Atantic coasts of Spain and Portugal we had a great season in 2008 and although some of the official procedures booking in were tedious, we found the people very friendly in the many ports we visited.

As we are currently in Faro we intend spending a fair time cruising in Spain/Portugal this Spring before we enter the Med.

Another issue I would welcome advice on is obtaining accurate weather forecasts when one is at anchor and not in a marina. I have been using Navtex which has been good, but do not have internet access unless I can obtain a wifi connection somewhere.

Is it possible to receive decent forecasts on the vhf when we enter the Med?
 
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Does anyone recommend any anchorages along the Spanish Mediterranean coast or places to avoid, and also marinas that dont charge the earth in the summer season?

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Motril port for a free overnight -- anchor in the port just off a little beach. Not a fun place, though. There are several bays along the coast up to Cabo de Gata but they are usually very rolly. Depends on your tolerance to rolling.... OK for a free overnight if you have lee cloths! If you are in passage mode rather than cruising seeing the hinterland, then my preference is Gib to Almerimar non-stop. Almerimar is about the least expensive marina in the Med and is very well-run. You can stock up in the excellent Mercadona supermarket (walking distance, world-class). There are English-speaking technical services and a very competent English-owned chandlery who has fair prices. Almerimar is one of the safest places to leave you boat if you have to break your passage as the staff patrol constantly in bad weather. It is cheap and easy to get to Almeria airport for Easy Jets and Monarch back to the UK so ideal for crew change.

We then do Almerimar to Cartagena. You can anchor both sides of Cabo de Gata if you need to with excellent protection from winds from the WNW to ENE but any southerly and you will be rolling there. There is nowhere to land at Cabo de Gata other than to walk the dog. National Park territory, very, very beautiful and superb photo-ops.

Just round from Cabo de Gata you can anchor with the fishing boats off San Jose. Charming little tourist trap, so tastefully done you don't know it's a trap /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif The harbour is too small for all but the smallest yachts.

Cartagena is a must visit place. The marinas (two of them, use the east one which is cheaper and safer) are in easy walking distance of the busy town. Lots of Roman stuff. Julius and Brutus sowed their oats here in around 65BC.

You can't anchor in the main bay outside Cartagena due to an oil terminal and a naval base. There is an anchorage that I checked out (but did not anchor in) a few nm to the west but quite honestly, the marinas are not too expensive and it's nice to go into town. I can give you the details on the anchorage if you want it but will need to look it up in the log.

Now it depends how fast you want to travel....we like to spend a week in the Mar Menor. You need to read the pilot to get in. Thomas Maestrae (?sp) is a tip so go straight past and into the Mar Menor itself and anchor off an island. Our favorite spot is right down at the southern point in a little bay just by the most SE marina. You'll see evidence of the locals using it for beach fires and bathing. Tender past the marina and very slowly up to the beach. Small supermarkets within five minutes, buses. VERY sheltered in Mar Menor -- a year round anchorage. Try not to go aground....it is very shallow in places so keep your eye on the plotter at all times.

Mar Menor to Isola Tabarca. Anchor off Tabarca in fine weather only. The holding is atrocious. Really heavy grass that nothing will penetrate. Even 10kts of wind will make you drag. It is do-able with care with an offshore breeze if you have a decent outboard and keep an eye on the yacht.

Altea -- lovely little yacht club marina. For a real treat, hire a car or taxi down to Benidorm and visit the Benidorm Palace for their cabaret. It's a real treat....not quite the Lido but a surprisingly good imitation. €50 per head for the posh nosh and show, but worth every penny.

Morayra -- very rolly anchorage but safe. Or go into the marina. For the odd night it's best to go alongside the harbour wall. Great fish restaurants but otherwise not the most interesting place.

Morayra - Formenterra. I won't go into details about the Islands as all that information is in the pilots and straightforward. If you are trying to head east go through the gap rather than clockwise about. We did it at midnight and it was very busy with fishing boats....a bit tiring from a pilotage point of view. Best done in daylight. The anchorages off Formenterra are very easy to approach and we have done that at night.

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Another issue I would welcome advice on is obtaining accurate weather forecasts when one is at anchor and not in a marina. I have been using Navtex which has been good, but do not have internet access unless I can obtain a wifi connection somewhere.

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Have you looked into 3G/GPRS? In Spain it is very cheap and easy using Yoigo. You can buy the sim cards in The Phone House in Spain. I think it works in Portugal as well? That is your best bet, quite honestly. Or take your laptop ashore and hunt for some WiFi.

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Is it possible to receive decent forecasts on the vhf when we enter the Med?

[/ QUOTE ]Yes, weather forecasts are issued every couple of hours....listen on Ch16. Quite a few are in English in the season but you only have to learn a few words of Spanish, French and Italian to understand those. If you like, you can always call the MRCC who will give you the forecast in English at any time.
 
Lemain you are a star - thanks very much for some excellent information that I am sure will be of use to me this coming season when we reach the Med. If I think of anything else I need to know I'll contact you if thats OK. I'll follow up the Yoigo SIM card link, but I assume I can't purchase one until I reach Spain. I haven't looked at their coverage in detail but assume it is good all the way along the southern coastline of Spain and the Balearics.
 
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Lemain you are a star - thanks very much for some excellent information that I am sure will be of use to me this coming season when we reach the Med. If I think of anything else I need to know I'll contact you if thats OK. I'll follow up the Yoigo SIM card link, but I assume I can't purchase one until I reach Spain. I haven't looked at their coverage in detail but assume it is good all the way along the southern coastline of Spain and the Balearics.

[/ QUOTE ]It's a pleasure. I think that Yoigo is available in Portugal, but not sure. In which case you could get a sim on the way down. It's certainly the way to go these days. However, beware France. Non-contract (i.e. PAYG) phone, 3G/GPRS services are horribly expensive and expire after only a few hours. Something like 30 to 100 times the price of UK, Spain or Italy. Forget it. This is often discussed in other forums and as far as I know there is no light at the end of the tunnel. We piggy-backed a bit in France, used Orange WiFi (expensive but good where available) but mainly used the SSB radio and sailmail to stay in touch. France is the most primitive country in the EU for travellers, for mobile Internet.
 
Just to follow up - we whizzed a bit up the Spanish east coast and cannot really comment except to endorse Cartagena and also Barcelona. We did anchor in a few places but found them very full of small boats, so needing long chain to be in deep water and often rolly. So we marina'd it, but did enjoy seeing inland.

The French south coast east of marseille is a very different matter. We wintered (out of the water) at Port Napoleon, and then spent last summer sailing very slowly to Menton and are now based in Toulon. We spent a week in Nice marina (to see Leonard Cohen and joan Baez live at the jazz Festival) for €30.80 per night for an 11.95m yacht, and otherwise spent very little time tied up. It was in fact a very cheap few months because we stayed away from lots of the usual temptation. Lots of very lovely anchorages, somewhere to scuttle to if a sudden wind change required an up-and-offksi, and easy getting ashore. We filled up our water jerry cans regularly, used barely one-third of our deisel all summer, never got charged for dinghy parking ... Yes anchorages can get very full, on a Saturday in August, but arrive before 1100 or between 1600 and 1900 and you will find a space.

There aren't many cruisers there - scared off by expected high prices and talk of crowding, so it can be a wee bit less friendly from that point of view. We really it enjoyed it, though. Next year we plan to head south down western Italy, but do not regret our gentle Riviera summer at all.
 
Abigail, thanks for the info. By the way what was the cost of over wintering at Port Napoleon if you don't mind me asking and for what length of time?
 
Gawd - can't remember the costs, and in case they upped the rates a bit this year. The details might be on line at port-napoleon.com or they are good about answering emails.

The other place to look is Navy Service, which is the other dry dock at Port St Louis. It is generally much cheaper, but undoubtedly much more basic. I can't off-hand remember their address but if you google navy service st louis you should find them. Their crane was giving a bit of grief which is why we decided on PN.

We took a year's contract in the end because it was bound to be at least 6 months and 6.5 months was about the tipping point. (We made a big trip to NZ during that time). We ended up actually nearer 8 months with no additional finance worries so it was definitely worth it,
 
Would echo what Lemain describes in his post about anchorages. My experience of Med Spain is only of the Costas del Sol and Blanca. On the whole I didn't want to linger much in the former, but for the most part managed to find anchorages nonetheless. The Costa Blanca is worth spending more time on. It has plenty of anchorages, and magnificent coastal scenery (even, dare I say it, around blighted Benidorm, which looks more like Chicago than a holiday resort from the water).

From Gib to Sardina via the Balearics I spent just three nights in marinas -- and two of those only because Cartagena was too interesting to miss and gives no option but to take a pontoon berth. It's well worth browsing through the Med Spain pilot books in advance. I found them pretty accurate as regards anchoring. And, as other posters have noted, many of the locals leave you to them at night.
 
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