Craning in

ghostlymoron

ghostlymoron

Well-Known Member
Joined
9 Apr 2005
Messages
9,889
Location
Shropshire
Visit site
Earlier this season I helped my pal launch his boat. Several boats were craned in on the same tide and I was told that 'for insurance reasons' the boat's owner had to be on board when it was lifted and until it was then in the water. I helped rig the slings but did not stay on board to be swung in. I have worked a long time in the construction industry where it is rightly forbidden to ride with a load during a lift for safety reasons (ie it is an unnecessary risk). Does anyone else share my concerns over this practice?
 
The marinas where I have had my boat lifted in/out have always said, "staff only on board during lifting, owner stands and watches." Ditto fixing slings - yard staff job, not owner. I think that this is almost certainly due to insurance and liability requirements. On balance, and much as I would be happy to help, I'm inclined to leave them to it and not have any arguments about liability should anything happen.
 
It has long been my understanding that unless there is a compelling reason , then a lift should not have a passenger! HSE is not a matter of absolutes, but an uneccessary risk such as lifting a man with no purpose would go heavily against the operator should anything go wrong.

Rob.
 
No benefit to this at all...if a person is on deck then they can't do anything else to help. If it's a case of being ready to drive the boat out of the slings when afloat or do a quick check for leaks, they can easilly climb aboard from another vessel surely.
 
I always got lifted out with Kindred Spirit. The layout of the yard's lifting dock means you really need somebody on board to guide the boat into position and keep it there, and sometimes to help the slings into position underneath. I suppose it would be possible to get off once the slings had taken a little weight and the boat was securely in position, but you'd have an awkward climb up the side of the dock and around the slings and their side poles, so really it's safer to stay put in the middle of the deck until the boat is over dry land and someone can put a ladder against it.

We didn't usually get lifted in with the boat, but I think I may have been once; can't really remember why.

EDIT: To be clear, this was on a travelift, so the boat was never more than a couple of feet above the ground (more than that above water, but that's a softer landing). I was quite happy riding this; I'd have been less keen on the major crane lifts over fences and car parks that some clubs do.

Pete
 
Last edited:
ghostlymoron said:
Earlier this season I helped my pal launch his boat. Several boats were craned in on the same tide and I was told that 'for insurance reasons' the boat's owner had to be on board when it was lifted and until it was then in the water. I helped rig the slings but did not stay on board to be swung in. I have worked a long time in the construction industry where it is rightly forbidden to ride with a load during a lift for safety reasons (ie it is an unnecessary risk). Does anyone else share my concerns over this practice?
Click to expand...
It is the yards job, their insurance if they cock it up. Why add manslaughter on top of that?
 
Surely it depends on the arrangement on the water. At Holyhead, you need to be on the boat as it is lifted in (and out) as once lowered into the water there is no way of getting onto the boat unless you use another boat/dinghy. At Liverpool, there is a small dock with a pontoon that the boat is lowered next to and then you go down to a ladder to the pontoon where you safely get aboard. Much prefer the latter but the ride down to the water at Holyhead for our first ever launch was quite exciting!
 
None of thse cranes will be certified for 'man riding'. Any incident with people onboard a boat on such lifts is a direct breach of the LOLER requirements! Tag lines mean there is no need for anyone to be onboard, imagining that you can stop a strop from slipping means you should wear your underpants on the outside. Like much of these activities it would appear that the wires have got crossed!
 
I am gobsmacked at the idea of anyone riding in a boat while it's being lifted, and I find it almost impossible to believe that insurers would allow it, far less require it. Was this a club or a professional operation?
 
Jaguar 25 said:
Surely it depends on the arrangement on the water. At Holyhead, you need to be on the boat as it is lifted in (and out) as once lowered into the water there is no way of getting onto the boat unless you use another boat/dinghy. At Liverpool, there is a small dock with a pontoon that the boat is lowered next to and then you go down to a ladder to the pontoon where you safely get aboard. Much prefer the latter but the ride down to the water at Holyhead for our first ever launch was quite exciting!
Click to expand...

This is exactly how it should be done if there isn't a pontoon/dock handy....you use another boat. Crane driver is allowed to take up tension on strops and move vessel to wall etc with you aboard but not to lift with you aboard. As Pete54 quite correctly says the cranes are not (not 'might not be') certified for man lifting - for that you need a purpose built man rider cage. Same applies to any lifting equipment regardless of type.
 
prv said:
So, what, give up sailing and use the boat as a static caravan?
Click to expand...

No, find a way to do the job safely. If that means doing it somewhere else, do it somewhere else. If that means getting different equipment, get different equipment.

A coroner is not going to be impressed with "Yeah, it was obviously unsafe, but what else were we to do?"

This all reminds me a bit of the ordure heaped on the head of the bloke who sued his club after he was seriously hurt in a lifting accident. Amateurs don't get a free pass on safety management.
 
JumbleDuck said:
No, find a way to do the job safely.
Click to expand...

But your trite saying started with "if there is no way to do a job safely". So by definition it's impossible to find a way. Perhaps you didn't really mean it?

For what it's worth, if I was in charge of things in a commercial environment (or an organised amateur one like a club lift-in), I wouldn't let someone ride on a non-man-rated lift. The bureaucratic hazards are not worth it. But in this case I'm the customer, and the method is not my responsibility. The physical hazards of being lifted a few feet by a travelift are well within my personal tolerance of risk, so if the operator wants to do it that way then it's fine by me.

Pete
 
My experience has been that yards are very keen for you to be aboard before the slings are removed. You check that there are no leaks ( Did I close that seacock etc) and effectively take responsibility for the boat from them. I can see insurers wanting the insurer on board then.
 
prv said:
But your trite saying started with "if there is no way to do a job safely". So by definition it's impossible to find a way. Perhaps you didn't really mean it?
Click to expand...

I did mean it. If there really is no way to do something to an acceptable standard of safety, don't do that thing. Do something else instead. However, in most cases there really is a safe way of proceeding, and minds get concentrated wonderfully when the alternative is not doing it at all.
 
pcatterall said:
My experience has been that yards are very keen for you to be aboard before the slings are removed. You check that there are no leaks ( Did I close that seacock etc) and effectively take responsibility for the boat from them. I can see insurers wanting the insurer on board then.
Click to expand...

That's how the yard I use works. I help them fit the slings, but emphatically only as labour under the direction of yard staff. Then everybody gets off and the boat is carried across the yard and lowered into the water. At that point I get on again and confirm to the staff that I have checked every sea cock and then they remove the slings.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page

Top