fireball
Well-Known Member
fastidious ... like I said!
Coppercoat Epoxy Nightmare
- Thread starter homer
- Start date
hrchivers
Well-Known Member
I had coppercoat on a previous boat and was very pleased with the outcome . Sometime soon I have to strip all the old anti-foul of my current boat anyway... So, 'easy route to good recommendation', please?
Is anyone prepared to name 'pros' where they were pleased with the outcome?
Sans Bateau
Well-Known Member
You will find that Elessar of this parish has applied CopperCoat to some forum members boats. He still posts here without any more abuse than anyone else gets, so I recon he is worth a try.
homer
Well-Known Member
A little further info. The epoxy undercoats and the Coppercoat were all applied "wet on wet" and all well within the time window specified. (And, as mentioned, the other 6 coats were fine.) Whilst being an amateur, this is the third boat that I have epoxied (and I am fastidious about such things) and I have had no problems at all with the others.
However, my original enquiry was to see if anyone else has used Coppercoat's own brand epoxy on GRP and it seems not - but thanks for the interest and commiserations!
However, my original enquiry was to see if anyone else has used Coppercoat's own brand epoxy on GRP and it seems not - but thanks for the interest and commiserations!
fireball
Well-Known Member
He did mine just under a year ago - happy with the results so far - I haven't come out the water since ... - ultimate test will be after the first wash off and first full season submersed .. but she has a clean waterline so far - which is not normal for my boat!
Sans Bateau
Well-Known Member
If you mean ME100, then yes, I believe ME100 is the epoxy which is supplied by them. Wet on wet is the application process. We applied two coats of ME100 on a Sat, then 4 coats of CopperCoat on the Sunday. Collapsed knackered on the Monday!
[70521]
Well-Known Member
Just a post so I can follow this thread.
Dazedkipper
Well-Known Member
I had mine applied by an East Coast 'specalist' and most fell off after 3 months afloat!
He then told me to '***** off, I'm not interested, sort it out yourself' when I tried to get it corrected.
Thankfully the parent company on the South coast have taken over the job and have assured me it will be re-applied correctly when the weather is suitable.
fireball
Well-Known Member
Dazedkipper
Well-Known Member
I thought I had but obviously I was mistaken.
Twister_Ken
Well-Known Member
Mine was done by Desty in Hamble Point. So far, so good (two years and counting).
fireball
Well-Known Member
yup - it's a bum when that happens ..
not all Pro's are equal ... as I found out when we had an insurance claim following a lightning strike (side strike - not main bolt) ..
The quality of the work was fine, but the diagnosis was terrible - even to the point of having to ring the guy with part numbers from RS so he could solder a replacement LED to the switch panel ... and even then he failed to check the stern light ...
You'd think if someone handed you a boat that had been struck by lightning you could manage to test all the systems to see if they work properly ... it's hardly rocket science!
Staying on Marine Electricians (I work with computers so it's pretty close to my territory) - we had a bit of kit checked out by a different chap prior to purchase - U/S was the response ... need a nice replacement ... we changed the fuse ...
Honestly - I would not trust an (unknown/unrecommended) marine electrician to troubleshoot anything ... I doubt they could check if the battery was connected properly ...
Anyway - back to the coppercoat - we saw the work done on our boat at various stages - it all looked good and the guys doing it were taking good care ... my only area of concern is the keel - because it rusts from the inside out ... but that's not something anyone can rectify cheaply ...
Sans Bateau
Well-Known Member
Dont get to fussy, owning a Bav you should be thankful you have a keel!
RobbieW
Well-Known Member
ME100
I also have 2 coats of ME100 under about 5 coats of CopperCoat. We left the ME100 24hrs longer than recommended (the forecast finally said showers for the second day we had planned) took advice from Aquarius who advised light abrading before the copper.
Done in 2009, it was agressively powerwashed 2 days ago after having been afloat since done (though scrubbed a couple of times). None of the GRP area is showing adhesion problems but I was aware the skeg shoe, which is bronze, adhesion was poor (thats now primed and tri-luxed). I used ExBow Marine (Southampton) as my pro-consultant but did much of the donkey work myself as well as half the rolling.
I also have 2 coats of ME100 under about 5 coats of CopperCoat. We left the ME100 24hrs longer than recommended (the forecast finally said showers for the second day we had planned) took advice from Aquarius who advised light abrading before the copper.
Done in 2009, it was agressively powerwashed 2 days ago after having been afloat since done (though scrubbed a couple of times). None of the GRP area is showing adhesion problems but I was aware the skeg shoe, which is bronze, adhesion was poor (thats now primed and tri-luxed). I used ExBow Marine (Southampton) as my pro-consultant but did much of the donkey work myself as well as half the rolling.
Dazedkipper
Well-Known Member
I'm not going to name and shame publically as the parent company have been supportive and are making the correct noises to resolve the situation.
The problem has been the local guy (not sure if a franchise or what) so if anyone is considering this work on the East Coast PM me for details.
The problem has been the local guy (not sure if a franchise or what) so if anyone is considering this work on the East Coast PM me for details.
macd
Well-Known Member
Yes, I have, both ME100 and (on top of that) the solvent-based primer. Absolutely first class results with both (mind you, they were applied in Greece). A Coppercoat bod recommended leaving the primer at least five days to dry/cure before applying anything on top...whilst if I recall correctly the spec sheet suggested 48 hours was enough. Hence my earlier question.
tcm
...
I self-applied the coppercoat in 2008, 50ft catamaran, bare hull ,no epoxy just applied the gear, 5 coats, extra lardy thick at waterline. All still fine, some small scratches, nothing serious.
I think that amongst the "secrets" is the ambient temperature/humidity when applying/drying. I was in er Lanazarote, september, which i think will be ideal conditions, or at least, likely loads better than uk spring frinstance
There is a video of a team of people doing the job, and that seems quite a hot place, maybe not in UK?
Aside from nice rewarding laziness, I can't see the point of using a so-called "pro" cos it is so utterly low tech/skill AND.... the so-called pro's don't have the wherewithall to "sort it out" if it goes wrong? Not really, they don't. But yeah, you reduce the chance of total cockup since they did it a few times or praps many time and it was all fine. But there again... they likely did it a few other times and it hmmm wasn't all that great? The experience and knowledge is empirical, tho. It's not like (say) making anodes where you get this material, do this to it, then install like this and it'll definitely be an anode.
From pure cost basis, they can't really g'tee the work with unlimited lift/resand/reapply backup as part of the price. And neither an/do coppercoat. Nice people, knowledgeable and helpful but there isn't enuf data/experience to give an exact and bomb-solid range of humidity conditions for ambient air, boat surface, moisture readings, sanding disc roughness. They know that the surface must be clean and dry, the ambient air warm and dry. But there isn't enuf data to know that (say) 18degrees C at application and not less than 16degrees for the next 24 hours, cos it's just nt possible to fix all the other variables and try painting the same boat in lots of temperature conditions.
Praps just hire in experience/pro advice as you go along? OR
In the UK i would probably try apply the stuff with boat under cover, after the boat has been there a couple of days at least, and in hot weather - the very time you would really prefer to be out sailing. Windy no problem, slightly dusty not an issue.
You bosh it on, it might (definitely) dribble, you leave it to dry for some days, you lift+shift, you try scuff the surface with scotch pad, scrape the bigger dribbles with a draw-scraper, then into the water OR praps better next year/liftout when utterly hard as nails and sandal you sand it.
In my exp the gear "goes off" fast enough that it requires one person to be mixing up new batches all the time.
I used pro help in getting to a sanded surface. I used a roller on a stick to apply the stuff, lots of thin coats, quite fast.
Again, i think the ambient air conditions are more critical than is being admitted/realised, affecting the surface condition of the boat, and the gear itself during application, and the drying conditions, and nobody totally says how, except it often works, and sometimes doesn't.
Where bits fell off, was that in shade during application?
I think that amongst the "secrets" is the ambient temperature/humidity when applying/drying. I was in er Lanazarote, september, which i think will be ideal conditions, or at least, likely loads better than uk spring frinstance
There is a video of a team of people doing the job, and that seems quite a hot place, maybe not in UK?
Aside from nice rewarding laziness, I can't see the point of using a so-called "pro" cos it is so utterly low tech/skill AND.... the so-called pro's don't have the wherewithall to "sort it out" if it goes wrong? Not really, they don't. But yeah, you reduce the chance of total cockup since they did it a few times or praps many time and it was all fine. But there again... they likely did it a few other times and it hmmm wasn't all that great? The experience and knowledge is empirical, tho. It's not like (say) making anodes where you get this material, do this to it, then install like this and it'll definitely be an anode.
From pure cost basis, they can't really g'tee the work with unlimited lift/resand/reapply backup as part of the price. And neither an/do coppercoat. Nice people, knowledgeable and helpful but there isn't enuf data/experience to give an exact and bomb-solid range of humidity conditions for ambient air, boat surface, moisture readings, sanding disc roughness. They know that the surface must be clean and dry, the ambient air warm and dry. But there isn't enuf data to know that (say) 18degrees C at application and not less than 16degrees for the next 24 hours, cos it's just nt possible to fix all the other variables and try painting the same boat in lots of temperature conditions.
Praps just hire in experience/pro advice as you go along? OR
In the UK i would probably try apply the stuff with boat under cover, after the boat has been there a couple of days at least, and in hot weather - the very time you would really prefer to be out sailing. Windy no problem, slightly dusty not an issue.
You bosh it on, it might (definitely) dribble, you leave it to dry for some days, you lift+shift, you try scuff the surface with scotch pad, scrape the bigger dribbles with a draw-scraper, then into the water OR praps better next year/liftout when utterly hard as nails and sandal you sand it.
In my exp the gear "goes off" fast enough that it requires one person to be mixing up new batches all the time.
I used pro help in getting to a sanded surface. I used a roller on a stick to apply the stuff, lots of thin coats, quite fast.
Again, i think the ambient air conditions are more critical than is being admitted/realised, affecting the surface condition of the boat, and the gear itself during application, and the drying conditions, and nobody totally says how, except it often works, and sometimes doesn't.
Where bits fell off, was that in shade during application?
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