Container vessel abandoned mid atlantic.

[lenseman]

UPDATE:

The fire onboard has fully taken in Hold 4 and now Hold 5.

This information comes directly from the fire-fighting team from the Tug "Fairmount Expedition" who were onboard but had to withdraw due to the second large explosion which I mentioned earlier at 1840.

 

[maxi77]

I suppose the tanker Ohio being dragged into Malta with warships tied each side to keep her afloat being a rather good example, but there was a war and a siege going on then, people might not fancy doing the same sort of things right now !

I suspect that she is perhaps not yet as far gone as the Ohio, infact I wonder quite why the crew abandoned ship so early. Condemming the hull on the basis of one photo is perhaps hasty. I suspect that it may even be possible to salve both halves if she does break up. Mind you I suspect the hull may not be quite as bad as suggested, after all most of the hull has had pretty good boundary cooling.

 

[halcyon]

I suppose the tanker Ohio being dragged into Malta with warships tied each side to keep her afloat being a rather good example, but there was a war and a siege going on then, people might not fancy doing the same sort of things right now !

Remember reading a book on the Ohio, if it's the same ship. The bow got blown off by a torpedo, left on her own, they turn round and headed for Malta stern first. Came under attack a number of time, and took a lot of damage.

Brian

 

[Seajet]

UPDATE:

The fire onboard has fully taken in Hold 4 and now Hold 5.

This information comes directly from the fire-fighting team from the Tug "Fairmount Expedition" who were onboard but had to withdraw due to the second large explosion which I mentioned earlier at 1840.

Am I right in thinking the fire/s will have to be out before closing the coast ( hoping she gets that far ), or surely no port will accept her ?

A Test Pilot I knew recounted how he had a fire warning in his Harrier, and requested an emergency landing at a nearby Italian airbase; he was refused, " you goa crasha somewhere else " !

 

[Kukri]

Am I right in thinking the fire/s will have to be out before closing the coast ( hoping she gets that far ), or surely no port will accept her ?

A Test Pilot I knew recounted how he had a fire warning in his Harrier, and requested an emergency landing at a nearby Italian airbase; he was refused, " you goa crasha somewhere else " !

Nice big subject. The UK has a system for dealing with this - a very good one - in which an expert salvage man has the final say - see link here:

http://www.dft.gov.uk/mca/mcga-environmental/mcga-dops_cp_sosrep_role.htm

but other European countries are much more backward.

Years ago I had to arrange to scuttle a perfectly good tanker (apart from, well, quite a lot of damage, really - but she was still floating) because no port would take her.

 

[Seajet]

Minn,

thanks for that.

I imagine scuttling a tanker generates much wailing and gnashing of teeth wherever one does it, environment wise...

 

[Kukri]

She was in ballast (very bad engine room explosion) and we were more relaxed about oil in the sea in those days.

 

[lenseman]

. . . . . infact I wonder quite why the crew abandoned ship so early. . . . . . .

That is what a very large number of people in the industry are asking and keep asking?

They, the Master or crew, just might know what the ship is really carrying!

The American and Russian satellites will probably have already done a spectral scan of the fire to work out the composition of the cargo or part of the cargo.

There was also the fact that they had just lost a crew member in the explosion and any problem with language would not help.

I also suspect the either sent the Mayday on VHF or MF in the panic, hence the Mayday Relay from other ship(s) in the area and finally they has two fare paying passengers who could not be asked or even expected to fight the fire.

The member of the ships company who was killed in the initial explosion was one of the officers.

UPDATE 2335Z

The tug "Carlo Magno" has departed Rotterdam at 0200Z to the scene via Falmouth and is currently (2346Z) steaming at 12.5 knots 12nm SE of Ventnor IoW.

 

[lenseman]

DIARY STATEMENT FROM THE OWNERS:

MSC FLAMINIA
Buxtehude, July 17 2012

The firefighting tugboat FAIRMOUNT EXPEDITION reached our MSC FLAMINIA today at 11.00 am. She arrived after our MS HANJIN OTTAWA had already reached the site of the incident in the early morning hours. Fire fighting operations were commenced immediately.

In addition to the fire fighting measures, HANJIN OTTAWA’s second engineer was transferred to the tugboat. He will remain at the site to support the salvage team with his technical expertise and to accompany the ship’s transport back to Europe. Our second engineer is tasked with reactivating the fire fighting systems on board MSC FLAMINIA to support the operations. With this action, the search for our still missing crewmember should resume as soon as possible. Meanwhile, HANJIN OTTAWA has continued her original voyage to the Suez Canal.

While continuing the fire fighting operations, the salvage captain is expected to give an initial assessment of the situation and condition of MSC FLAMINIA.

Referring to the pictures transmitted by HANJIN OTTAWA, the damage to the ship and its cargo cannot ultimately be estimated. It becomes clear, however, that neither superstructure, engine room, the stern section nor the forecastle of the ship are directly affected by the fire or the explosion.

last pictures MSC FLAMINIA


**********

Buxtehude, July 17, 2012

Thanks to the good medical care provided by Portuguese hospitals, we are relieved to report that our seafarers, which were injured during the incident onboard MSC FLAMINIA, are recovering well. Our heavily injured crewmember, who was transferred to a specialty hospital for burn wounds on Monday, made the transport well. The two crewmembers who are still being treated on the Azores will most probably be released at the end of this week to be repatriated.

On behalf of all employees, the management board of NSB would like to express again its condolences and its grief. “This tragedy onboard MSC FLAMINIA has deeply afflicted me. Our thoughts are with the families of the deceased and the missing sailor as well as with the recued and their families. We are in constant and close contact with the relatives of all our crewmembers and passengers”, said Helmut Ponath, CEO of Reederei NSB.

The crewmembers that were rescued by DS CROWN are still on their way to Falmouth/UK. They are expected to arrive in the night between Wednesday and Thursday.

Our MS HANJIN OTTAWA has arrived on the site of the incident this morning. So far, the scale of the damage of MSC FLAMINIA could not be assessed due to the still prevalent darkness. MS HANJIN OTTAWA awaits the arrival of the tugboats FAIRMOUNT EXPEDITION and ANGLIAN SOVEREIGN and monitors the situation from a safe distance.

We will inform at this place as soon as new information becomes available. For further technical details about MSC FLAMINIA please scroll down.

**********

Buxtehude, July 16, 2012

After the incident onboard MSC FLAMINIA on July 14, 2012, three injured seafarers were transferred to MSC STELLA and subsequently taken off by helicopter and flown to a hospital on the Azores. The latest report on their condition states that two are in stable condition and have been transferred to a general ward. The third man, however, has been transferred to a speciality hospital in mainland Portugal.

The remaining 18 crew members, together with two passengers, are onboard the oil tanker DS CROWN which is expected to arrive at the UK port of Falmouth during the evening of Wednesday, July 18. They will then be repatriated, to rejoin their families.

SMIT Salvage of Rotterdam, one of the world’s leading marine salvors, is responding to the MSC FLAMINIA. Two large firefighting tugs have been despatched. The first, FAIRMOUNT EXPEDITION, will arrive in the area during the early evening of tomorrow, Tuesday, July 17. The second, ANGLIAN SOVEREIGN, will leave Inverness, Scotland, today (Monday, July 16) and is expected to arrive during late Thursday or early Friday. Additionally, a second ship of NSB’s fleet has deviated to approach the site of the incident to support the salvage operations. Until the arrival of the salvage vessels, the cause of the incident and the condition of MSC FLAMINIA remains unresolved.

NSB is grateful for the efficient emergency response coordination provided by Falmouth Coastguard and the assistance provided by vessels which diverted to attend MSC FLAMINIA.

Further technical details about MSC FLAMINIA please scroll down.

**********

Buxtehude, July 15, 2012

We regret to inform the public that one of our rescued seafarers of MSC FLAMINIA has passed away as a result of his wounds. A second seafarer is still missing.

Three injured crewmembers of MSC FLAMINIA were transferred already on July 14 to the vessel MSC STELLA which then proceeded to the Azores. An oncoming helicopter took over the injured personnel and flew them to a hospital on the Azores. One of the three injured persons remains in emergency care.

The remaining crewmembers are onboard the oil tanker DS CROWN and are on their way to Falmouth/UK.

An emergency team of Reederei NSB remains in close contact with the rescued crew as well as with their relatives.

Two fire-fighting tugboats are currently on their way to MSC FLAMINIA. At this moment, the cause of the fire is completely unresolved. NSB’s emergency team is working together with all involved authorities to investigate the incident.

Currently, we do not have any new findings about the condition of the MSC FLAMINIA. An estimate of damages will only be possible after the arrival of the fire-fighting tugboats on scene on late Tuesday evening.

The priority of the emergency team of NSB at this moment is to care for best medical treatment for our injured crewmembers and for a safe return of the remaining personnel to their home countries.

**********

Buxtehude, July 14, 2012

On July 14, 2012, a fire broke out onboard MSC Flaminia’s cargo hatch no. 4. The ship was crossing the Atlantic Ocean on its way from America to Europe. While the crew was attempting to extinguish the fire, an explosion occurred.
The crew of MSC Flaminia is comprised of 23 men (five Germans, three Poles and 15 Philippine employees) and two passengers.
Nearby DS Crown was able to rescue 22 crew as well as the two passengers and has accommodated all persons.
One crew member is missing. Four crew members are injured, the rest of the crew as well as the passengers are unharmed.

Reederei NSB has immediately installed an emergency team and is in contact with the captain of DS Crown and MSC Flaminia, the UK Coast Guard, MRCC UK as well as Medico Cuxhaven.

MSC Stella, which is two hours apart, is on its way to the scene of the emergency. It will take over the injured seafarers.
We will share new information as soon as it is available at this place.

 

[Deleted member 36384]

..... paragraph 10.2.5 says that a BA compressor is not mandatory, which bears out my own experience on a panamax container ship and a car carrier, neither of which had a compressor. Frankly that says it all about the IMO, the ship owners' poodle. .....

Many drilling rigs have the same level of firefighting capability - enough to get someone out of the accommodation. I queried this once with contracts and their reply was clear: run away is the least risky policy. They would rather be left with a burnt out wreck than a partially damaged asset, the former being cheeper to replace. I would add that the rigs also have automatic and remote activated firefighting equipment, but human intervention is not required.

 

[z1ppy]

without wanting to sound sick and with greatest respect to the crew and their families, this is turning into a really interesting thread with some very accurate and technical information!

Minn's comments about undeclared dangerous goods highlights the issues with containerised cargo. in my field of shipping there must be absolute claritity in what is being carried in containers and complete and open declaration of the nature of the hazard. In the most part, this means that liner carriers such as MSC will run a mile before even considering letting our cargoes close to their ships but the irony is, our cargoes are MUCH MUCH safer than those carried that they are not told about!

Its worth mentioning that things you would not consider dangerous are in fact hazardous in terms of shipping, the obvious things would be paints, glues or liquid animal vaccines but prehaps less obvious things like hay, laptops and accessories and ping pong balls can all be classified as Hazardous cargoes.

MSC themselves have very strict policy on carriage of DG cargo and i am sure the salvage teams will have cargo manifest showing what declared DG cargo is stowed where.

Unfortunatly as refered to before "wideboy forwarders" find it all to easy to declare the product as something not restricted to avoid what is usually a very minimal DG surcharge on the freight amount.

Some of the stuff we have seen coming in is frankly worrying at best!

Worrying that the fire has taken hold 4 and 5 now. sounds like this is getting worse before it gets better.

 

[lenseman]

Apropos one of my earlier threads, the Master and crew could never know if they are carrying clandestine munitions to a third world country?

An explosion is an explosion and it would scare the bejesus out of me if I was fire-fighting on deck. [I did my Fire-fighting training at HMS Phoenix, Portsmouth, now Port Solent].

Out of a ships company of 23, the First Officer was killed and one missing plus four seriously injured (one of which has since died on passage Horta), that leaves just four officers plus you also have two passengers (possibly wives of crew) which had to be 'looked after'. Then there is the language difficulty with the remaining crew, it doesn't leave many options other than Abandon Ship?

Anyway, you are down below safe manning levels for normal running, notwithstanding the fire risk.

 

[z1ppy]

Apropos one of my earlier threads, the Master and crew could never know if they are carrying clandestine munitions to a third world country?

not sure if that was a question but In this instance with containersied cargo its quite possible. if someone wanted to declare munitions as scrap metal or car parts and all paperwork supported the same, unless cargo was inspected by customs, containers would not be opened and contents checked. unfortunatly, given the number of containers floating around the world, its simply not possible to physically check all of them!

I am not for one second suggesting this is the case and MSC like other liner carriers have a no explosives policy which should be applied universally across their booking offices.

 

[Mariner69]

It is worth recalling that due to the large number of containers shipped and the lifting on and off at various ports on the way the ship often does not have a clue as to what is inside the containers at any one time.

When things go wrong, such as a creamy white liquid dripping down from the top tiers of dry containers in the hold, four tiers up, to pour into the bilges and set solid; thus preventing any pumping it takes time for the owners to find that the cargo was in this case cocoa butterfat. It could have been anything! It still took a long time, at great cost, to fix alongside in Southampton.

There are many dubious practises in shipping from misdeclared containers, overweight containers (it said 20 tonnes, a crane with lifting capacity of 35 tonnes couldn't lift the box. The ship sailed without it and capsized in the next port at the start of discharging), bribery common place in some parts of the world to pass surveys and other respects.

The crews do a good job and are not that well paid for their knowledge and expertise. Oh well......

 

[Seajet]

This seems a glaring loophole in counter-terrorism ideas, I can't believe it's that simple ! ( obviously is...) there are very sensitive sniffer gizmo's which can detect the presence of the tiniest bit of explosives, BAe make one such system called Condor.

One would have thought that containers had to pass something like this, people shouldn't be allowed to send sealed containers, " don't break the seal, I gift wrapped it for my auntie in Pakistan " !

 

[lenseman]

Interesting, the tug "Carlo Magno" which departed Rotterdam at 180200Z to the scene via Falmouth suddenly stopped outside Falmouth and then changed course without entering Falmouth and is now steaming at all haste towards MSC Flamania and she is currently rounding Lizard Point making 11 knots. She has obviously has been given different orders?

Possibly picked up crew or equipment via the pilot to save time entering the Fal.

 

[penfold]

Many drilling rigs have the same level of firefighting capability - enough to get someone out of the accommodation. I queried this once with contracts and their reply was clear: run away is the least risky policy. They would rather be left with a burnt out wreck than a partially damaged asset, the former being cheeper to replace. I would add that the rigs also have automatic and remote activated firefighting equipment, but human intervention is not required.

While I agree with what you say, mariners should only be tackling small fires and running away from big ones, even small fires may need more than an hour's BA time(3 bottles notionally give you 1.5hrs, but that's not what happens when your amateur firefighters are unfit and/or excited, and it's difficult to fight fire without getting excited unless you're on heavy doses of betablockers) so the absence of a compressor seems unnecessarily cheeseparing.

 

[jonnybuoy]

Interesting that the mayday was relayed. No clue on this subject but if the master does not make a mayday call does that prevent a salvage vessel from claiming salvage by getting a line on board?

 

[Kukri]

No, it makes no difference at all.

And please forget the old hokum about "first line on board".

I'm afraid both of these notions are folklore, not law.

The questions that the judge or arbitrator will consider are simply these:

1. Was the ship and / or her cargo in danger, and, if so, how much dangerwere they in, objectively?

2. How meritorious were the salvage services?

3. What is the value of the property salved?

 

[Kukri]

While I agree with what you say, mariners should only be tackling small fires and running away from big ones, even small fires may need more than an hour's BA time(3 bottles notionally give you 1.5hrs, but that's not what happens when your amateur firefighters are unfit and/or excited, and it's difficult to fight fire without getting excited unless you're on heavy doses of betablockers) so the absence of a compressor seems unnecessarily cheeseparing.

Agree entirely.