Collision between Barge & Coxed Quad at Kingston

Ramage

Ramage

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We received this e-mail from Rebellion's rowing club:

"On Sunday John witnessed what could have been a disaster on the river resulting in 4 Kingston juniors being nearly killed.

All was in order from the coaching and safety point of view - there were 2 coxed quads heading downstream close together with the coach in a launch following close by.

They were passing under Kingston Bridge ,using the Surrey arch, when a very large barge pulled out from the Surrey bank and hit the first quad head on.

The bows got sucked under and he thought the whole quad was going under. The barge was one of the very large ones with a high front and there was no look out on the bow - just a guy in the high room on the top who couldn't possibly have seen the quad.

*Luckily all was well and they got the kids out but it could have been a death case!"
 
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Ramage said:
We received this e-mail from Rebellion's rowing club:

"On Sunday John witnessed what could have been a disaster on the river resulting in 4 Kingston juniors being nearly killed.

All was in order from the coaching and safety point of view - there were 2 coxed quads heading downstream close together with the coach in a launch following close by.

They were passing under Kingston Bridge ,using the Surrey arch, when a very large barge pulled out from the Surrey bank and hit the first quad head on.

The bows got sucked under and he thought the whole quad was going under. The barge was one of the very large ones with a high front and there was no look out on the bow - just a guy in the high room on the top who couldn't possibly have seen the quad.

*Luckily all was well and they got the kids out but it could have been a death case!"
Click to expand...

Good job no one was injured!

i witnessed the helsman of a hotel barge remonstrating with the crew of a river cruiser a month or two ago.

the dutch barge hotel boat was going round a bend in the river,a bit too briskly,and a collision was narrowly avoided by the quick reactions of the cruiser skipper.

the helmsman of the hotel boat did not allow for the blind spot that his vessel surely has.

i have seen some larger barges on the thames with cameras installed on their bows,perhaps impaired vision should be taken into account when these large boats are inspected for BSS?
 
cereal tiller said:
Good job no one was injured!

i witnessed the helsman of a hotel barge remonstrating with the crew of a river cruiser a month or two ago.

the dutch barge hotel boat was going round a bend in the river,a bit too briskly,and a collision was narrowly avoided by the quick reactions of the cruiser skipper.

the helmsman of the hotel boat did not allow for the blind spot that his vessel surely has.

i have seen some larger barges on the thames with cameras installed on their bows,perhaps impaired vision should be taken into account when these large boats are inspected for BSS?
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Wasn't the African Queen was it?
 
I'm very glad nobody was hurt or killed but....

What would have been the speed of the barge which had just left it's mooring?

And although, if coxed, one of the the rowers was looking in the direction they were going, what was the rowers speed?

If you were moored up to the Surrey bank with a large slow craft, and there were several fast rowing boats coming downstream, how would you leave safely? Even if he had a lookout, at the relative speeds what could the helmsman have done?

No criticism of the rowers or the barge's helmsman, isn't this a case of different uses/types of craft which have to equally be aware of each other, particularly blind spots either side of bridges, and be a bit more cautious?
 
They were coxed quads ( 4 scullers and a cox) according to the e-mail. That means two coxes looking forwards as well as the coach on the coaching craft.

Rather more people looking where they were going than was the case with the barge, which apparently blundered out into the fairway....

Unfortunately, just like bicycles vs tipper trucks, it does not help to be in the right.... luckily this time there were no fatalities.

How do you leave safely? Wait for the other craft to pass!
 
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Paul

Just for a moment imagine you are on the barge; even if you have a lookout on the front, there is a blind spot because you are near the bridge. You have to let go and move away at some stage from your mooring, you do so and some fast robo's are crashing into you before you know it.

I'm involved with the local canoe club; here in Henley we've been doing manoeuvres close to Henley Bridge and a rower has come through the bridge and crashed into a kayaker and capsized him. Lesson learnt by us, but I think it pays to be wary and not go too fast through bridges and be aware there may be dangers lurking.
 
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Ramage said:
All was in order from the coaching and safety point of view - there were 2 coxed quads heading downstream close together with the coach in a launch following close by.
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I am not a rower but am I not right in thinking that in a coxed four the cox is at the stern of the boat and, although facing forward, his view is restricted by the rowers themselves?

Note "FOLLOWING" - so the coach was behind the rowers ? In that case he would not be seeing any hazards, such as the barge, below i.e. on the other side, of the bridge? Would it not have been better for the coach to have been ahead of the rowers in this situation?

Am I right in thinking the barge must have left the John Lewis or Passenger Berth moorings ?
 
Hi guys,
Some added information:
They were very inexperienced juniors with junior coxes.
These junior coxes can barely see to steer, and usually have about a 30-60 degree blind spot dead ahead of them due to their height, positioning etc, that in experienced crews is combatted by the bowman looking over his shoulder.

However even if these guys were looking around well, there isn't much chance of them noticing the actions of a boat moored just past the bridge, considering their first priority is to get both crews through the bridge. Admittedly the coach should have seen something, but then again sometimes things happen so quickly you can't do anything.
I doubt the vision of the canal boat was impaired through the bridge, the arches are quite big and the river is fairly straight for about 500m on the other side, but again, maybe they were just unlucky.

Personally I feel very sorry for the rowers, who may or may not row again after this, and I feel sorry for the barge driver, because it must have been a shock for them too. Although they were in the wrong for not looking out enough in this instance, it could just as easily have been a quad pulling out of their club and into oncoming.

Lets all just chalk it up to experience eh?
 
Not wishing to take sides,

or invoke an argument.

I've been in similar situations at Kingston in the past. Moored at the coal wharf or John Lewis, I've scanned the River ahead and not seen / missed rowers coming downstream. The Management casts off forward and then the rowers are seen. Too late to get a line ashore, so I had to proceed - taking a different Arch. No issues as it was only me slightly inconvenienced. Merely pointing out that it's a difficult location.

My solution is to give a clear sound signal. If nothing else (assuming the usual argument about boaters not knowing what signals mean) others are warned that something is happening.

SWMBO hates me blasting - says it destroys the peace of the River, rather that, than having a collision.


If there's any doubt about being unsighted, give a signal.

The coaching boat should do the same - so often they just look at you; if you're lucky, they may Shepherd the crew(s) away, but it's invariably not clear what action (if any) they might take.

IME Kingston based commercial vessels are bad at signalling their intentions when manoeuvring.
 
No one is suggesting that this is a 'Kingston Based Commercial Vessel' ( i think we know who you are referring to ) ...

This was a barge apparently ...

Was the lifeboat called , as we have had a couple of upriver shouts in the last few days.

Has the incident been reported to the EA at Shepperton ?

Agree with your signalling , it's a shame you have to make a noise , but if in doubt , then signal ( it also covers you in the event of an accident ) i'd rather have a noise for a second than a crash.
 
teddington_lock said:
No one is suggesting that this is a 'Kingston Based Commercial Vessel' ( i think we know who you are referring to ) ...
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Oh dear; my bad composition. My reference was intended to be an aside as to current practice in that reach and not implying the barge was local. I've noticed that trip boats "down your end" tend not to give signals as a matter of course.

Upstream where it is more civilised :) :) they are a bit better...
 
Ummm ...

We don't really hear a lot of signals at the lock as they tend to come straight in , on the occasions when they swing to port as they exit the lock ( if they have a wedding drop off at the Wharf for example ) they always signal.
 
TrueBlue said:
Oh dear; my bad composition. My reference was intended to be an aside as to current practice in that reach and not implying the barge was local. I've noticed that trip boats "down your end" tend not to give signals as a matter of course.

Upstream where it is more civilised :) :) they are a bit better...
Click to expand...

I completely disagree. I have always found turks to be very courteous and safe in their business always giving sound signals etc.
 
Don't col' regs apply on the Thames as on the sea?

e.g.
Surely if a mobo of any type approaches a blind corner or pulls out where viz from the mobos bridge is way back near the stern, then the skipper of that mobo has the responsibility of a) putting a look-out at the bow where there is a communications system set up and b) sounding the 'ships siren/horn' to alert those in close proximity around the blind corner or bridge?

In the instance of the coxed quad hitting the barge... I'd have thought this was as serious a misjudgement by someone as it can get. I would have thought it should at least be dealt with extremely seriously by the barge company and by the safety officer at the Rowing Club/School.

Very sad for those youngsters involved who from what you say may be just 12-15yrs of age.
 
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