Cleaning / Lubing Mast Sail Track

[ColourfulOwl]

Raising my main sail is extremely tricky at the moment and there is quite a lot of pressure on the main halyard when doing so. I've also noticed when dropping the sail, it only goes about 2/3 of the way down, leaving 1/3 of the sail up. I've already checked all the deck hardware to make sure everything runs smoothly, and it does.

The next thing I want to do to rule it out is to clean / grease up the Sail Track, but I don't have the time to be able to pull the mast down to do so. Anyone got any tips or tricks for getting the sail track lubed up with the mast up? Any recommendations on what type of lube to use? My sail track is the slug type.

 

[Tranona]

There are various Teflon spray lubricants available, but better to clean the track first. One way is to attach a rope to the main halyard and wrap some cloth round the first foot or so then haul it up to clean the inside of the slot. Then spray the slugs. The problem of slow dropping is though inherent in the design, and although you can reduce it by cleaning and spraying there are better systems available but as ever expensive. Some people use a light downhaul line from the headboard to bring down that last third.

Suggest you post your general "boat" questions like your more recent ones on the PBO section of the forum as that gets far more traffic and you will get a wider range of responses.

 

[Yngmar]

They don't normally need lubrication, but they do definitely need cleaning. Our genoa wouldn't go up after a winter in Sicily with lots of fine red Sahara dust flying around. I got a piece of nice old fluffy rope that fit snugly into the groove, attached some whipping twine loops on both ends and pulled it up and down the foil a few times while being sprinkled from a water hose that I tied to the top swivel. After that, the sail went up very easily, with no lubricants (the water had dried).

Also check the turning block at the top isn't worn or got a wonky axle. Then it'll turn fine without load but bind up under pressure.

 

[wonkywinch]

Very similar recent thread .. Mainsail doesn't come down easily

 

[ColourfulOwl]

They don't normally need lubrication, but they do definitely need cleaning. Our genoa wouldn't go up after a winter in Sicily with lots of fine red Sahara dust flying around. I got a piece of nice old fluffy rope that fit snugly into the groove, attached some whipping twine loops on both ends and pulled it up and down the foil a few times while being sprinkled from a water hose that I tied to the top swivel. After that, the sail went up very easily, with no lubricants (the water had dried).

Also check the turning block at the top isn't worn or got a wonky axle. Then it'll turn fine without load but bind up under pressure.

Unfortunately I can't get up the mast to look at the lines/blocks at the top of the mast. I did ask for a rigging specialists to have come have a look but they haven't had chance to get to the boat yet.

Is there anyway of being able to see if this is the case at deck level without getting up there? Looking at how the line twists / sits?

When I first bought the boat raising the main was not smooth, but was no where near as sticky as it is now. There's so much friction the line 'pangs' on the winch when the sail is about 2/3 of the way up.

 

[wonkywinch]

Is there anyway of being able to see if this is the case at deck level without getting up there? Looking at how the line twists / sits?

When I first bought the boat raising the main was not smooth, but was no where near as sticky as it is now. There's so much friction the line 'pangs' on the winch when the sail is about 2/3 of the way up.

As I suggested on the other thread, use your binos to see if halyard crossed with topping lift.

You should be able to raise by hand, I would be very nervous using a winch in this situation other than to take up slack and pinch the luff tight once the main was raised.

 

[ctva]

Best track is a clean track with no lubricant. Lube attracts and can retein dirt which inturn makes the whole thing 'sticky'.

 

[Yngmar]

Is there anyway of being able to see if this is the case at deck level without getting up there? Looking at how the line twists / sits?

If you've got both ends of the halyard you can test if it lifts a load (e.g. bosuns chair with person) without involving the sail track. If it doesn't do that smoothly, your problem isn't the track but somewhere else, likely a worn sheave or axle. We had this on our outhaul, which ran fine with a light load, but bound up under load due to the sheave having worn oval on the center hole. The problem wasn't visible until removing it for inspection.

 

[wingcommander]

Fleetwood seagulls are renowned for sticky droppings . Its the diet of fish and Fisherman's throat lozengers.
They will happily sit atop your mast and deploy right down the mast track.

 

[Martin_J]

How about another suggestion...

The sheave at the top could have seized, maybe due to the central hole elongating and now preventing it turning.

Try putting a spare rope through a spare pulley/block and hoisting that pulley to the top with the original halyard....

Then use this spare/temporary rope through the now external pulley, as a halyard for the main.

If the main is now easy to hoist then you've found your answer (albeit not as easy to replace the sheave as putting PTFE spray on the slides).

 

[Martin_J]

My second suggestion..

Have you replaced any of the luff sliders (slugs) recently and if so are you sure they are the correct ones for the track?

Check this second suggestion in my reply within this other thread..

Mainsail slide lubrication.

 

[srm]

My topping lifts were always the same spec as the main halyard, including a shackle that would fit the headboard. never needed that spare main halyard but nice to have.
If your topping lift is up to the job try raising the main with it to indicate if the main halyard is the problem. However, I suggest cleaning the mast groove first as the more likely cause.
I would go up the mast at the start of every season taking a spray cleaner/lube with me (WD40 or suchlike). Spray all the head sheaves and the groove on the way down while checking the rig. Its one of the many fun things to enjoy as a boat owner.

 

[Martin_J]

Although, trying the topping lift, you might also find that is stiff and has a worn sheave at the masthead.

For all you know, a previous owner might have found the halyard stiff and already moved over to using the 'other' masthead sheave.

Hence my suggestion of an externally hoisted pulley block just for test.

 

[srm]

Although, trying the topping lift, you might also find that is stiff and has a worn sheave at the masthead.

For all you know, a previous owner might have found the halyard stiff and already moved over to using the 'other' masthead sheave.

Hence my suggestion of an externally hoisted pulley block just for test.

Yes, you could be right and the pulley its a very good idea. (I used to hoist a 4 part tackle to get myself up the mast singlehanded).
I just prefer starting with the simplest test then moving on to more complex ones if necessary.

 

[Martin_J]

Indeed... Although I'd say that a lot of boats have an old halyard in a locker and it only takes two minutes to attach a spare spinnaker sheet block to the 'live' main halyard and hoist the old halyard, pre-fed through the block to the top.

 

[ColourfulOwl]

Sorry to bring up an old thread again. I've not long since gotten back from taking the boat out for a sail and the main sail has been incredibly difficult to raise. I was only able to pull it up by hand by maybe the first 3rd, neither of the 2 reef points weren't even out of the bag. I'm not exactly the strongest of people, but I'm built like a brick sh*thouse and can put a lot of weight in pulling the halyard I was also only able to really winch the sail to the second (last) reef point. The winch was constantly making pinging noises due to the tension in place, so I just called it a day at that reef point. The main sheet was released so the boom could swing, nose into the wind, topping lift was raised to help try and relieve some tension and the reef lines where both clear to free run.

• I checked to see if the main / topping lift was twisted. It is not.
• I sprayed the mast track with some PTFE spray. This has improved the sails ability to drop on it's own substantially, but has not impacted the ability to raise the sail.
• I tried pulling the halyard through without the sail in play, it seems to move quick freely with little to minimal friction.
• When raising the main I purposely open the clutch on the halyard. I took a measurement and it appears my current main halyard is 12mm thick. When I've looked online Mauripro recommends a 10mm thick main haylard. I'm wondering if the one that is current in place is over sized. I believe the clutches are the same spec as Spinlock XAS, which should support 6-12mm. I have however noticed that the clutches sometimes pop open when pulling the thicker 12mm lines through them (main halyard and mainsheet lines are both 12mm, everything else is 10mm or below).
• I'm unfortunately not able to get to the top of the mast to inspect the masthead sheave myself. It also doesn't help that because I'm based in Fleetwood, they're isn't really much access to a rigger, I was quoted over £800 to have a basic rig inspection done, half of which was travel cost.
• The deck level blocks are new and spin freely.

When I purchased the boat the previous owner used to raise the main by going to the mast and pull the halyard from there. He said he found it easier and less strenuous, but I'm wondering if that's also because he had the same issue. I personally solo sail so usually try and avoid going forward unless necessary.

Is there anything else that anyone can think of?

When i'm next at the boat I think I'm going to try raising the main using the topping lift. The topping lift is much thinner then the current main halyard, only being maybe 8mm in thickness at most. But I'm hoping it might shed some lift on whether the issue is track related, or line related.

 

[Tranona]

12mm is thick for a halyard - but you don't say what the boat is. Have you followed the suggestion in post#8 to isolate whether the problem is with the halyard or the track/slides?

 

[Martin_J]

Or try my suggestion in #10..

Hoist a spare pulley/block, pre-fed with a spare rope, to the masthead...

And then use that new rope as the halyard, thus totally removing the masthead sheave and existing halyard from the equation.

 

[ColourfulOwl]

12mm is thick for a halyard - but you don't say what the boat is. Have you followed the suggestion in post#8 to isolate whether the problem is with the halyard or the track/slides?

Sorry, It's a Beneteau Oceanis 361 with a traditional main sail and stack pack.

#8 is a good point actually. I've only been able to test pulling it through either with the sail attached, or with no weigh on the end of it. In the later case it seemed to come through quite easily.

Or try my suggestion in #10..

Hoist a spare pulley/block, pre-fed with a spare rope, to the masthead...

And then use that new rope as the halyard, thus totally removing the masthead sheave and existing halyard from the equation.

Unfortunately I don't have any spare pulleys at the moment. When I'm next at the boat I'm going to try raising the main with the topping lift to see if that also binds up. I might ask one of the boat neighbours if they have something I can borrow to do your idea

 

[Martin_J]

The trouble with just swapping to the topping lift is that the masthead sheaves will likely be the same age and you never know if a previous owner might already have worn out one sheave and has already swapped the functions of halyard with topping lift.

If it does work better then great!