taz
Well-Known Member
So if a man trips over whilst wading, his waders fill with water that will weigh in excess of 200lb he`d be able to re-gain a standing position?
Chest Waders for Launching?
- Thread starter Little Rascal
- Start date
So if a man trips over whilst wading, his waders fill with water that will weigh in excess of 200lb he`d be able to re-gain a standing position?
ProDave
Well-Known Member
I share your scepticism. Here's my thoughts.
In your trip scenario, no he wouldn't be able to stand up, because he's trying to lift a large volume of water above the river level.
But, whilst under water, the water filled waders won't cause you to sink further.
It is only when you try and pull yourself out of the water, that you will have a problem, like the example earlier where the poster was unable to pull himself up onto his boat. That's because as well as lifting his own weight out of the water, he was trying to lift all the water trapped in the waders.
So having thought about it, and read that link, I don't think waders filling while launching your boat is quite as dangerous as first suggested.
I still wouldn't do it alone though (but then I wouldn't be launching my boat alone in any case)
Last edited:
Little Rascal
Well-Known Member
You mean sort of kedge her off, Searush?
Well I could and probably will where there are no pontoons - thanks for the idea.
But it's also more about access to the trailer as she comes out, which happens in 3 plus feet of water - at the moment she's not winched on but strapped down. Also there's a 'gate' for the back of the keel that has to be dropped on to secure her.
I've got some work to do to get her more conveniently set up on the trailer but in the meantime I'm just getting wet!
Well I could and probably will where there are no pontoons - thanks for the idea.
But it's also more about access to the trailer as she comes out, which happens in 3 plus feet of water - at the moment she's not winched on but strapped down. Also there's a 'gate' for the back of the keel that has to be dropped on to secure her.
I've got some work to do to get her more conveniently set up on the trailer but in the meantime I'm just getting wet!
ProDave
Well-Known Member
That's a useful tip I'll try next time.
Recovering my boat back onto the trailer, a major problem I found was the light current was trying to push the boat sideways off the trailer, until I threw a line to a third person ashore to pull on to counter that current.
A stern anchor, off to one side a bit could achieve the same thing.
taz
Well-Known Member
I also accept the neutral buoyancy and that the water inside the wader is equvalent to the water outside, and that it should me no more difficult to swim in waders than without, if you land face up that is. What if you land face down? I think you`d find it almost impossible to right yourself. One other factor is panic and tiredness if you are in this position. Maybe the panic and tiredness would factor into a tragic outcome, but if you weren`t wearing waders would you be in this position in the first place?
JimC
Well-Known Member
I can't comment on the theory but I've been there and I can tell you it's most unpleasant. In my situation my only handhold was the pulpit rail of the boat, to keep hold of this at the full stretch of my arms meant that the top of my waders was above the water level so I was trying to support not only my own weight but the weight of water in the upper part of the waders. The theory might say that I could have let go of the boat and let body + entrapped water hopefully lie waterlogged near the surface with my mouth & nose hopefully out of the water. No way was I letting go of that rail till my strength gave out. If I had the theory would have been put to the test. Personally I think I would probably have drowned
electrosys
Well-Known Member
If anybody wants a set of bib-and-brace waders, there's a firm in Boston that will make 'em to fit. You supply the pvc wellies, and they make up the soft pvc 'troosers' and weld 'em onto the boots. Nearly all the local fisherman wear 'em - mostly in a most fetching shade of dayglo orange.
The solution to getting caught out if you should slip and they fill with water is to carry a knife - slashing the fabric will release the water. Simples.
The solution to getting caught out if you should slip and they fill with water is to carry a knife - slashing the fabric will release the water. Simples.
taz
Well-Known Member
I`m in total agreement with you and I think 90% of the commercial fishing fleet are too, as they`ve banned the wearing of waders on their ships, if I`m not mistaken. Now if waders did help, coupled with a lifevest then I`d think they`d be mandatory.
ChrisE
Well-Known Member
I`m in total agreement with you and I think 90% of the commercial fishing fleet are too, as they`ve banned the wearing of waders on their ships, if I`m not mistaken. Now if waders did help, coupled with a lifevest then I`d think they`d be mandatory.
Guys,
Re use of chesties on commercial boats. Of course this is daft. We are talking about being on the banks of the shore. I sorry that some of you have had bad experiences but had you read up on what to do if you got into difficulty?
I followed the guidance and all that happened was that I got bit wet. If you don't want to read up and follow the rules for safe usage of chest waders then don't wear them.
Your loss but don't condemn their usage without doing the background work. Thousands of salmon and trout fishermen use them and don't have problems.
I can't believe that I'm even discussing this on a boating forum, all of this discussion was done to death (not literally) in the angling press 40 years ago.
oldharry
Well-Known Member
I did.
Wading along below a jetty in about 4ft water I tripped and went headfirst, completely submerged. Mine had a lanyard round the chest, which tightened to stop water slopping down inside. It did, and although I was soaked, they did not fill to the point where I could not stand.
The danger I did find was, go in too deep I would lose my footing, as beer belly buoyancy took over!
Absolutely essential for dry trailer sailer launch/recovery, I found.
Little Rascal
Well-Known Member
ChrisE
Well-Known Member
I'm not aware of any links but if you seek out Hugh Falkus' work "Sea trout fishing" it is well described. Hugh plus others have thrown themselves into rivers to demonstrate. I believe that it is still taught by salmon fishing guides in Scotland.
As a background, there is a long sorry story about salmon anglers getting themselves into difficulties in deep fast flowing rivers such as the Tweed some being swept off and drowning. Now if you are going to take salmon fishing seriously you have to master deep wading in fast flowing rivers and know what to do if you do happen to stumble.
JKay
Well-Known Member
I've done the same loads of times in swimming pools etc the waders need to be neoprene or very thin waders and then there are no problems .The only problem's ocour when the very thick "Old fashioned boot footed waders" are used
I have done float tubing all over the world and have never had a problem with modern chest waders
Last edited:
Csail
N/A
Maybe a drysuit would be a better option.
Searush
Well-Known Member
This is a traditional Running Mooring set up (to a fixed sea bed mooring chain) I'm suggesting using an anchor as a temorary sea bed fixing point. Everyting else would be the same. It would take a little setting up, but could remain in place for you to pick-up on your return.
Another aid I have seen for boats floated on & off yard trailers is guide rods up the side of the trialer to above the Gunwhales. This allows you to pull the floating boat between the vertical(-ish) guide rods & either wait for the tide to ebb or gently pull the boat & trailer up the slipway & she has no option but to settle in the correct place on the traler.
It could be done on a road trailer, but would look a bit odd. I guess you could weld pipes in place & just drop smaller guide pipes or rods into them before launch/ recovery. These are very common on trailers for deep keel boats like the Flying Fifteen etc.
Just a few ideas, but I have to add, I have not used them in anger myself. altho I have set up a running moor for a dinghy on odd occasions to keep it afloat & still allow easy access.
Little Rascal
Well-Known Member
Hmm but at least 10 x the cost!
Hardly practical for half an hrs use every now and then.
Not that I wouldn't buy one for other reasons...
Hardly practical for half an hrs use every now and then.
Not that I wouldn't buy one for other reasons...
Neil
Well-Known Member
Where did you get the figure of 200 lb? Once upon a time, I got a lure stuck on the opposite bank. I waded across, feeling carefully with a long stick. When I was within arms reach I took an extra step, off an underwater shelf, into water up to my chin. The chesties were full! I not only walked back across the river, but climbed the bank, over the wall and walked back to the car, sloshing all the way. There was no where near 200lb of water in there.
Little Rascal
Well-Known Member
Thanks Searush. If I was launching alone with no pontoons
around that might be an option...
Yeah that's the kind of set up I've yet to get sorted.
There are a few issues with a fin keeler that I didn't come across launching lifting keelers.
1) Any heel is magnified at the bottom of the keel - if you jump on board - the keel shifts by a foot sideways!
2)The trailer is quite simple - just side supports and a prop under the stem. The stem prop always needs to touch first. With a slip with a gradient (ie all of them
) there's not enough grip there to bring the boat to the point where the keel grounds. Also standing on the foredeck isnt an option until she's fully grounded.
3) When you have (dry) access to the trailer, shes still flying 4ft up in the air - so I don't feel happy un-securing her until she's in about 3 feet of water.
4)On the average slip, the car would be 20-30ft into the water before she floats, so ropes/bars are needed - making everything less controllable. I also have to get in to chock up the wheels as I transition from tow hitch to rope etc.
5)At the point where she'll float over the trailer, everything except 2" of side support, is submerged in 4ft of water!
I have a few ideas for 'remote' guides so I can position her and 'drive away' but at the moment there's no substitute for getting in there and getting wet.
A couple of months ago I saw another Hunter drop off a tractor tow hook and head down the slipway into the water at high speed (No damage done fortunately, but there were some interesting facial expressions - especially on the boat 3ft from where she stopped.) Since then I have tended to be a bit more cautious!
around that might be an option...
Yeah that's the kind of set up I've yet to get sorted.
There are a few issues with a fin keeler that I didn't come across launching lifting keelers.
1) Any heel is magnified at the bottom of the keel - if you jump on board - the keel shifts by a foot sideways!
2)The trailer is quite simple - just side supports and a prop under the stem. The stem prop always needs to touch first. With a slip with a gradient (ie all of them
) there's not enough grip there to bring the boat to the point where the keel grounds. Also standing on the foredeck isnt an option until she's fully grounded.3) When you have (dry) access to the trailer, shes still flying 4ft up in the air - so I don't feel happy un-securing her until she's in about 3 feet of water.
4)On the average slip, the car would be 20-30ft into the water before she floats, so ropes/bars are needed - making everything less controllable. I also have to get in to chock up the wheels as I transition from tow hitch to rope etc.
5)At the point where she'll float over the trailer, everything except 2" of side support, is submerged in 4ft of water!
I have a few ideas for 'remote' guides so I can position her and 'drive away' but at the moment there's no substitute for getting in there and getting wet.
A couple of months ago I saw another Hunter drop off a tractor tow hook and head down the slipway into the water at high speed (No damage done fortunately, but there were some interesting facial expressions - especially on the boat 3ft from where she stopped.) Since then I have tended to be a bit more cautious!
ChrisE
Well-Known Member
Last edited:
Seajet
...
There's another danger with waders...
A couple of years ago I was due to go out on the mud to assist in moorings replacements.
My old drysuit had torn last time, so was obviously dangerous if it allowed water in.
So I bought a 'good' set of waders, neoprene ( need the warmth out on the mud in snow ) and good built-in 'wellies'.
The 3 of us set off across the mud pushing our dinghy full of kit; on my FIRST step into the properly soft mud just off the slipway, I went in deep on that foot - but when I tried to pull my foot out I couldn't, the waders just stretched.
I tried a couple more steps but the same happened; they were the correct size, with tight over-shoulder braces.
If I hadn't had the dinghy to fall across while my chums pulled on each leg in turn, I or at least the waders would still be there; not a hope in hell of walking across the mud, though a wet or dry suit & plimsolls is fine, if messy.
They are never going near the coast again, and I don't feel it would be right to sell them.
I see there's a cheap version drysuit going for £76.00 - my waders cost £48.00, for one failed use...
Dangerous things, they don't belong anywhere near a boat or the sea !!!
Editted to add; I wasn't planning on there being any water around for hours, but if I had managed to get water over these things I'd have been lucky indeed to get them off before drowning, it's the stretch which makes them so difficult, though full of water anyway I'm quite sure it would be Goodnight Vienna...
A couple of years ago I was due to go out on the mud to assist in moorings replacements.
My old drysuit had torn last time, so was obviously dangerous if it allowed water in.
So I bought a 'good' set of waders, neoprene ( need the warmth out on the mud in snow ) and good built-in 'wellies'.
The 3 of us set off across the mud pushing our dinghy full of kit; on my FIRST step into the properly soft mud just off the slipway, I went in deep on that foot - but when I tried to pull my foot out I couldn't, the waders just stretched.
I tried a couple more steps but the same happened; they were the correct size, with tight over-shoulder braces.
If I hadn't had the dinghy to fall across while my chums pulled on each leg in turn, I or at least the waders would still be there; not a hope in hell of walking across the mud, though a wet or dry suit & plimsolls is fine, if messy.
They are never going near the coast again, and I don't feel it would be right to sell them.
I see there's a cheap version drysuit going for £76.00 - my waders cost £48.00, for one failed use...
Dangerous things, they don't belong anywhere near a boat or the sea !!!
Editted to add; I wasn't planning on there being any water around for hours, but if I had managed to get water over these things I'd have been lucky indeed to get them off before drowning, it's the stretch which makes them so difficult, though full of water anyway I'm quite sure it would be Goodnight Vienna...
Last edited: