Changing the forestay.

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Heckler

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i am changing my forestay whilst the mast is down. The furler has always seemed a bit loose. I could take it up on the backstays (Beneteau 381) but the mast has quite a bend in it already and am lothe to do so. I had thought of putting a turn buckle inside the Facnor reefer but I dont think there is enough room. so, question, do the stays stretch? If i make the new one exactly the same length as the new one will it stretch and make the mast bend worse?
Stu
 
I've rerigged my mast during the last two years, by dropping the schrouds and forestay off at the rigger ( ...saves some money...). He made all items 1 cm short (31 ft., but rather tall mast). The new wire unwinds a bit under traction, so lenghtening the stays.
 
skipper_stu said:
i am changing my forestay whilst the mast is down. The furler has always seemed a bit loose. I could take it up on the backstays (Beneteau 381) but the mast has quite a bend in it already and am lothe to do so. I had thought of putting a turn buckle inside the Facnor reefer but I dont think there is enough room. so, question, do the stays stretch? If i make the new one exactly the same length as the new one will it stretch and make the mast bend worse?
Stu
Click to expand...
Wire have a little initial stretch a good rigger will take this into account when making a new stay.

Mast manufacturers have numbers for the maximum allowable bend for a mast section.

Don't know about your model of Facnor roller system, but I have a FD 230 with a turnbuckle inside.
The lower terminal on the stay is a threaded terminal that screw directly into the top end of the turnbuckle body.
Check documentation here: http://www.facnor.com/uk/technical_support/technical_brochures/headsail_furlers/default.asp
Fix the top of the stainless steel link plates (fig. R), found in the «Facnor turnbuckle kit», to the drum
with the screws provided (fig. S). Lightly grease both
threads before fixing.
Then, fix the bottom of the plates to the turnbuckle
with the pin (fig. T), being careful to correctly position
the nylon bushes (fig. U).
Click to expand...

You might find that the old stay have been damaged in some way (a halyard wrap can elongate the wire) and thus explain the problem.
Do you know how much the forestay is over length?
 
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I had a very early Facnor and to change the stay required the sections to have all the joints un pop rivited. I would be surprised if there is no adjustment somewhere but if not then yes, talk to a good rigger about how you are going to do it and understand how it all goes back together before you start taking it to bits. if you have scope to insert an extra toggle at the bottom then I would do so, in the future you can take it out as the stay stretches, just a coarse form of adjuster.

Yoda
 
knuterikt said:
Wire have a little initial stretch a good rigger will take this into account when making a new stay.

Mast manufacturers have numbers for the maximum allowable bend for a mast section.

Don't know about your model of Facnor roller system, but I have a FD 230 with a turnbuckle inside.
The lower terminal on the stay is a threaded terminal that screw directly into the top end of the turnbuckle body.
Check documentation here.


You might find that the old stay have been damaged in some way (a halyard wrap can elongate the wire) and thus explain the problem.
Do you know how much the forestay is over length?
Click to expand...
I think its an SD facnor, i dont know its overlength, just guessing. Bottom line, the concensus so far appears to be that it needs to be made slightly shorter. The question was, do stays stretch, if so, no good making the new one the same length!
I cant find a definitive beneteau length. Ive measured the old one, it is 14.26m
Stu
 
yoda said:
I had a very early Facnor and to change the stay required the sections to have all the joints un pop rivited. I would be surprised if there is no adjustment somewhere but if not then yes, talk to a good rigger about how you are going to do it and understand how it all goes back together before you start taking it to bits. if you have scope to insert an extra toggle at the bottom then I would do so, in the future you can take it out as the stay stretches, just a coarse form of adjuster.

Yoda
Click to expand...
I took it apart today, got all the screws out that hold the joiners in, except for one. I managed to drill that one out. The one issue I have is that the plastic split bearings wont slide out of the joiners, I had to cut the stay to get it apart, brought the joiners, with the bearings in home and will figure out how to press them out.
Stu
 
skipper_stu said:
I took it apart today, got all the screws out that hold the joiners in, except for one. I managed to drill that one out. The one issue I have is that the plastic split bearings wont slide out of the joiners, I had to cut the stay to get it apart, brought the joiners, with the bearings in home and will figure out how to press them out.
Stu
Click to expand...
I think the bearings is a twist fit onto the joiner's
 
skipper_stu said:
I think its an SD facnor, i dont know its overlength, just guessing. Bottom line, the concensus so far appears to be that it needs to be made slightly shorter. The question was, do stays stretch, if so, no good making the new one the same length!
I cant find a definitive beneteau length. Ive measured the old one, it is 14.26m
Stu
Click to expand...
Hi I noticed that my link to the documentation was missing in the first post..
Here it is: http://www.facnor.com/uk/technical_support/technical_brochures/headsail_furlers/default.asp

I'm almost certain that the SD models can have an internal turnbuckle, that would solve the problem.

Look at this PDF http://www.facnor.com/uk/technical_...headsail_furlers/fichiers/ls_terminaisons.pdf
 
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knuterikt said:
Hi I noticed that my link to the documentation was missing in the first post..
Here it is: http://www.facnor.com/uk/technical_support/technical_brochures/headsail_furlers/default.asp

I'm almost certain that the SD models can have an internal turnbuckle, that would solve the problem.

Look at this PDF http://www.facnor.com/uk/technical_...headsail_furlers/fichiers/ls_terminaisons.pdf
Click to expand...
Thanks for the info, I was aware of the turnbuckle option. It isnt on mine, I think there is room BUT am not certain, so Question again, does the new stay stretch?
Stu
 
skipper_stu said:
i am changing my forestay whilst the mast is down. The furler has always seemed a bit loose. I could take it up on the backstays (Beneteau 381) but the mast has quite a bend in it already and am lothe to do so. I had thought of putting a turn buckle inside the Facnor reefer but I dont think there is enough room. so, question, do the stays stretch? If i make the new one exactly the same length as the new one will it stretch and make the mast bend worse?
Stu
Click to expand...

Beneteau 361 with facnor sd165 and link plates. Last time I replaced the forestay I did put a turn buckle. It fits just fine. I could send you some pictures if you want. Just send me a pm with your email because I don't know how to load them here.
 
cmedsailor said:
Beneteau 361 with facnor sd165 and link plates. Last time I replaced the forestay I did put a turn buckle. It fits just fine. I could send you some pictures if you want. Just send me a pm with your email because I don't know how to load them here.
Click to expand...

PM sent
Stu
 
cmedsailor said:
Beneteau 361 with facnor sd165 and link plates. Last time I replaced the forestay I did put a turn buckle. It fits just fine. I could send you some pictures if you want. Just send me a pm with your email because I don't know how to load them here.
Click to expand...

Just in the process of doing the same on by Bene 36cc. Local rigger replaced the forestay (previously a fixed length with swaged eye on each end). He cut the wire, threaded it out of the foil leaving a mousing line. Re-threaded the new wire and swaged it in-situ. I now have a turnbuckle which partly fits inside the SD furler.

BTW, I replaced the link plates on my SD furler as the old ones had twisted. The new ones are much more substantial than the old ones, so I think that the original link plates were found to be too weak. During this whole job, I also stripped down the furler and swivel, replaced all ball bearings and oil seals. Hopefully the final setup will be much smoother-running than it was at the end of the season.
 
dje67 said:
Just in the process of doing the same on by Bene 36cc. Local rigger replaced the forestay (previously a fixed length with swaged eye on each end). He cut the wire, threaded it out of the foil leaving a mousing line. Re-threaded the new wire and swaged it in-situ. I now have a turnbuckle which partly fits inside the SD furler.

BTW, I replaced the link plates on my SD furler as the old ones had twisted. The new ones are much more substantial than the old ones, so I think that the original link plates were found to be too weak. During this whole job, I also stripped down the furler and swivel, replaced all ball bearings and oil seals. Hopefully the final setup will be much smoother-running than it was at the end of the season.
Click to expand...
Just had some pix off cmedsailor, looks straight froward, I have a turn buckle and I could do the same as you instead of hammering out the bearings.
Question are people confident in Norseman type fittings?
Stu
 
skipper_stu said:
Just had some pix off cmedsailor, looks straight froward, I have a turn buckle and I could do the same as you instead of hammering out the bearings.
Question are people confident in Norseman type fittings?
Stu
Click to expand...
People use Norseman fittings all the time, no personal experience though.

But why cant you use the Facnor solution?
I know that there are some headstay diameter / furler model combinations where this can't be used.

The way it's made on my furler there is a threaded terminal like this attached to the lower end of the stay.
The threaded terminal can pass through the bearings inside the foil for dismantling.
152365.jpg
 
knuterikt said:
People use Norseman fittings all the time, no personal experience though.

But why cant you use the Facnor solution?
I know that there are some headstay diameter / furler model combinations where this can't be used.

The way it's made on my furler there is a threaded terminal like this attached to the lower end of the stay.
The threaded terminal can pass through the bearings inside the foil for dismantling.
152365.jpg
Click to expand...
That's the way I am going to go. I had a turnbuckle but according to the original Facnor drawing I looked at, the bearing for the first foil was in the end of the drum and there wasn't enough room. Now that I have taken it all apart the bearing is actually in the telescoping foil, far enough and moveable so that the swage part of the threaded bit could go up the tele foil
Stu
 
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