Centaur keels

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jellylegs

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I have a slight weeping starboard keel on my centaur and I am wondering about the remedial work required. Is it a case of thickening up the stub and adding extra webs across the stub and then re bonding the keel?

Is it a job that could be tackled by a competent DIYer?

Phots of a fixed stub and also some guides of guaging how bad my stub is would be good - if that make sense....ie, is a small tbl spoon amount of water a fortnight anything to worry about at this stage?
 
jellylegs said:
I have a slight weeping starboard keel on my centaur and I am wondering about the remedial work required. Is it a case of thickening up the stub and adding extra webs across the stub and then re bonding the keel?

Is it a job that could be tackled by a competent DIYer?

Phots of a fixed stub and also some guides of guaging how bad my stub is would be good - if that make sense....ie, is a small tbl spoon amount of water a fortnight anything to worry about at this stage?
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There is lots of info in the "photos" section of the Westerly Owners Association Yahoo discussion group.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/westerly-owners/
You dont have to be a member of the WOA to access it but you do have to register as a Yahoo user.

Also worth asking for advice on the WOA forum http://www.westerly-owners.co.uk/woaforum/ Again you do not have to be a member of the WOA to use it
 
That amount of water is minute, by any standard. I am assuming that it is indeed salt water (tasted?) from a leak and not condensation. Either way it is not beyond a reasonably competent DIY person to put right.

When I had a similar leak on Cyano, my old Centaur, I merely raked out the joint between the stub and the keel. I let it dry out thoroughly while I attended to more important stuff and then I re-sealed the joint with some stiff caulking compound from a cartridge. I don't remember the exact name of the product but it was from a company called Wurth; probably equivalent to a Sika product but less expensive. I never had any problems after that. You do need a cartridge gun that is man enough to force the compound through the nozzle and into the joint.

Should you want to do the full treatment of re-bedding the keels - which I think is not necessary in your case - there are some very good photos in the Westerly Owners Group on Yahoo. There is also a wealth of information and some very knowledgeable and helpful people there.

Good luck with your Centaur. They are excellent sea boats. I parted with mine after fourteen delightful years so that I could start on another restoration project, this time a Centurion 32.
 
jellylegs,

in answer to your questions, yes and yes !

My fathers' Centaur already had moderately beefed up keels but they still seeped a little.

He beefed them up massivley with webs and lots of ( low tech ) grp.

He then used a box spanner with a tommy bar about 5' long, and there was still a very slight seep !

Another Centaur at our club had the same mod's, and he used to rear his hair out whenever she was hoisted, no matter what he did a tiny gap would open up at the keel join leading edge.

Both he and Dad are extremely capable engineers.

Our moorings are soft mud, so the worst case, but the seeps - if tiny, ie no significant pool of water collecting - mean nothing, except personal frustration.
 
Remedial work is well within the capabilities of a DIYer, I did our Centaur and Berwick. First thing to check is where the water is coming from - around keel bolts is favourite or through cracks in the stub if it's been highly stressed, less likely.

There's a donut of caulking cotton around each stud under the rectangular plate so, replacing the offending compressed one may solve the problem.
 
All helpful, and very reassuring information - thanks!

I will get on to it, and see what I can achieve - I perfected the 'art' of fibreglassing at art school!!

The interesting thing is that the leaking bolt has had the flowcoat removed from around it and there is not much of a bead of sealant - I suspect that this bolt may have been drawn out as part of a survey. It is the middle bolt of the row.

Thanks again.
 
I paid to have mine removed, cleaned up and re-seated. It cost something like £465 inc VAT in 2007 in a professional yard (Baltic Wharf, Totnes), and part of that was because they needed to replace some of the bolts completely.

They never seemed to seep whatsoever after that except I once found a pool about 6" deep in one locker, but it turned out to be weather in a certain direction caused a fast drip onto the seat from the main hatch, which went into the locker and nowhere else.

At that price, considering the effort to DIY removal and replace, definitely worth considering just paying someone to do it for you.
 
jellylegs said:
All helpful, and very reassuring information - thanks!

I will get on to it, and see what I can achieve - I perfected the 'art' of fibreglassing at art school!!

The interesting thing is that the leaking bolt has had the flowcoat removed from around it and there is not much of a bead of sealant - I suspect that this bolt may have been drawn out as part of a survey. It is the middle bolt of the row.

Thanks again.
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You should be worried about any small leeks around stainless steel fittigs and fastenings. If there is small space into which seawater can creep crevice corrosion is a likely result.

We could have lost the mast of Westerly Berwick a few year ago due to crevice corrosion of one of the shroud anchorages where it passed through the deck. A keen eyed crew member fortunately spotted a bit of threaded stainless steel with a couple of nuts on it on the cabin floor.

There are some photos of the effects of crevice corrosion on Vyv Cox's website including a badly damaged keel bolt. http://coxengineering.sharepoint.com/Pages/Crevice.aspx Your leaking keel bolt could look like that!
 
CaptainBob said:
I paid to have mine removed, cleaned up and re-seated. It cost something like £465 inc VAT in 2007 in a professional yard (Baltic Wharf, Totnes), and part of that was because they needed to replace some of the bolts completely.

They never seemed to seep whatsoever after that except I once found a pool about 6" deep in one locker, but it turned out to be weather in a certain direction caused a fast drip onto the seat from the main hatch, which went into the locker and nowhere else.

At that price, considering the effort to DIY removal and replace, definitely worth considering just paying someone to do it for you.
Click to expand...

CaptainBob,

I agree in a perfect world having this done would be great, but it doesn't reinforce the keel stubs as has proven necessary for boats kept on soft mud moorings.

BTW, my fathers' Centaur was a late model, 2187, while my chums' was an early one, so the tales of early boats having a heavier lay-up seem disproved at least in this area.

I suspect the problem of splayed keels in soft mud applies to a lot of boats, it's just that there are lots of Centaurs so it gets noticed and remarked upon.

I have always cringed at the thought of the loads on splayed keels, settling into then pulling up from soft mud twice a day...( that doesn't mean I'm a fan of vertical twin keels ! Just make a lift keeler feel smug :)).
 
I suspect that anything that a yard will charge less than a thousand for will be well within any DIYer's capabilities! I would be inclined toward a two-stage plan of action. Beach her, gouge a groove around the joint and reseal with mastic. That should at least halt anything going on for the rest of the season. Come haul-out, drop the keel for rebedding and reinforce internally whilst you have the access - might as well do them both, too.

Rob.
 
I once watched a yard "fix" a Centaurs keels.

It seems that the boat is lifted at an angle so as a keel is hanging verticaly down, then they support the keel with a big sort of jack and undo the bolts and then drop the keel enough to re bed it or whatever they need to do.

facinating stuff.
 
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