Catamarans

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Hurleyburly

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Why are they said to have an 'awkward' motion at sea ?

Do they roll downwind like a monohull ?

Can't see why everyone doesn't have one (apart from price).

It had a trial sail on an Aventura 28 a couple of years ago at SBS and we had 10kns thru the water in 12kns true - with 7 people on board. Wow - I was blown away.

The boat is, however, still for sale at the same price 2 years later.
 
Some people 'believe' that they have an awkward motion at sea because they sit differently in the water and are not weighed down by heavy bits of lead etc.

The problem arises in certain wave patterns because the wave motion can raise one hull whilst the other hull is not being lifted.So you can have a side to side type motion as well as a fore and aft motion that you would normally expect on a monohull.

However I believe the bigger the vessel , the less this occurs.

As for downwind, they don't roll at all. You have a much wider stable base and you can rig a cruising chute to run dead downwind, no roll at all.


I'm sure you will see there are a lot of biases against cats but there are some very
good positives as well.

No doubt Talbot , Snowleopard and Stingo will talk about those too.
 
I liken the sensation to freewheeling down a heavily rutted track as the juddering goes rapidly from one hull to the other. Of course you can smooth this right out by slowing down to top monohull speeds.

I certainly prefer the feel to rolling and corkscrewing.

Why doesn't everyone have a catamaran? Well, I would certainly go for a catamaran for ocean crossings and cruising away from marinas as the lack of rolling when sailing downwind and when anchored in open bays is beyond value. I also prefer the big cockpit and living room style.

However for South Coast and Atlantic Coast sailing I'd always go for a monohull as I spend most nights in marinas and and a lot of time beating.
 
They still charge 1 1/2 times the price in a marina, presumably, but otherwise I think you're probably right.

When I was looking for a fun boat last year I looked at 24 and 26 feet trimarans and catamarans but the marina charges and lack of cabin amenities compared to a monhull put me off, but it was a close run thing and I'm not totally convinced I made the right decision. Still, there's always the next boat...
 
The real difference is that a cat sits on the water, whereas a mono sits in it. Thus the reaction to waves is very different. Whether you like the difference in motion, is a personal decision. It certainly tends not to be quite so violent, and downwind sailing is a joy rather than a total nightmare. I suspect some early monohull sailors called it awkward, because the movement was different to what they expected, and that description just keeps on being used.

I cant answer why she has not sold as I dont know that particular boat, but some cats sell well and some dont, and thiis has more to do with preconceived ideas than actual problems with a boat.
 
Looked at the Dragonfly at the same SBS, but at over 100 grand the accomodation was absolutely dismal. I'm sure it goes like a fighter jet, but when you can get a used 38' Catana for the same amount it pales into insignificance.

Hooked on this idea of speed tho - channel croosing in 6 hours anyone ?
 
Catana

Now you're talking about good boats.

Looked round a 40 footer at Emsworth a few months back. A very nice boat indeed.
 
Re: Catana

Yep, I've looked over the 471 - carbon fibre mast, saloon which could have seated 16 people, a true bathroom in the owner's hull and build quality better than an Oyster.

Shame that at today's Euro x rate it'd be about £700K.
 
Re: Catana

I think the one I looked at was a Catana 401 and was up for £170 K +vat.

A few years old mind but in very good nick.
 
[ QUOTE ]
What's a Seacat ?

I've never heard of those.

[/ QUOTE ]The fast ferries - Dover/Calais & Portsmouth Cherbourg.

The last time I went on one, it dumped all the whisky off the shelves in the "duty free" shop. Walking across the bar was an adventure even without a drink and I doubt it was more than F6. Nasty things, but 2 1/2 hours to Cherbourg instead of 5 makes it worth while
 
Re: It\'s a funny old world

Cats make sense to nearly everyone who tries them.

Sure in some sea conditions they're a bit different in the motion department but then no two mono's are consistant either. You can use all sorts of hard sums to prove their stability, seakeeping and cruiseability. You can back up your calculations with any amount of published accounts by successful cat sailors. You can marvel at the accommodation, thrill at the acceleration and outright speed. You can sail bluewater and then enter harbour, at journeys end, on little more than a heavy dew. Then pull into a drying anchorage and remain comfortably on the level. You can anchor in areas subjected to wash so terrible it rolls mono's on their beam ends and observe the goings on from your stable platform. You can hoist chutes and kites without poles or dramas, carry a decent sized tender ready to go, fall out with the crew without having to live in the same corridor as them and don't get me started on manouvering under power. It's a delight.

OK, how the boat feels on the helm and under press of sail is a little remote. If you want to keep it in a marina it'll cost you a premium. So there is a bit of a downside, but it's not much of one.

Of course, having balanced all the facts, noted the inescapable logic and actually liked the thing, you'll buy a mono. Just like I and nearly everyone else does.
 
Re: It\'s a funny old world

Motion is different, but down wind especially preferable to many, my missus frequently feels queasy on her folks Konsort, but has yet (fortunately for me) to do so on our Strider, which is a good deal smaller but a lot quicker than the Konsort.
 
Just sold my cat and am going back to a mono after 7 years. Partly it was because a cat isnt really suitable for the sort of weekend, short trip sailing I am likely to do, though I wouldnt hesitate to chose one if I were going blue water for long voyages.

To me the issues are:

1/ much more difficult to single hand in and out of port even with 2 engines.
2/ Aggro over unreasonable extra mooring charges. It really p**es me off to be asked for 50% more than the mobo next door who has a similar beam.
3/ Contrary to your impression, not very rewarding to sail. I liken it to driving a motorhome compared to a sportscar (the mono). On autoohelm 90% of the time.
4/ All but the very best cats are motorsailers to windward in a chop. Mind you, many lightweight mono's are as well.
5/ Dont underestimate the extra work involved in maintenance particularly if you are a bit boat - proud.
6/ You are everyone's favourite rafting up target. I got very fed up of being a floating pontoon.

In favour of the cat are its ride (way better than an old narrow wallowing mono), the room, the vis from inside, the less tiring sailing (do you enjoy 24 hrs at 25 degrees of heel?), the safer deckwork, and the unsinkability.
 
A cat whether power or sail, has a very high GM so behaves like a very light monohull that is very heavily and deeply ballasted (ie "jerky") but that modified, in comparison to such a monohull, by its beam.

Not noticeable really in smoothish waters but I would not like to do ocean crossings in one, except for, perhaps, a benign tradewind drift - but in any event I prefer to fly /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif.

My experience is mostly with power cats and at displacement speeds they have a well founded reputation of being "sick makers" as others have said. Once up on the plane they are fine, especially if foil assisted. I have been on builder's trials on power cats where a good number of those on board start heaving over the stern or carrying buckets during those parts of the trials while at displacement speeds if the sea is a bit rough, that due to the type of motion. If the sea is rough during anchoring trials they are gotten over with as quickly as possible due to the motion. A sailing cat's motion is, of course, modified somewhat by the sail forces in comparison but the underlying is the same.

I do like cats very much, especially power ones, but they are not puuurrrfect and in many cases a monohull is better (and that is probably why there are so many monohulls around).

John
 
[ QUOTE ]
A cat ... has a very high GM so behaves like a very light monohull...

[/ QUOTE ]In the UK, GM is the acronym for "Genetically Modified". So are you insinuating that a cat is a GM monohull?
 
Didn't we go through this a few evenings ago and you admitted that you sail a dog?
 
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