CAT C9 maintenance

[Swift28]

Had boat few years now , been doing most of the servicing work myself , starboard engine just starting to creep up in temp above other lately ,nothing bad and no alarms as of yet, have pulled exhaust water hose off and can see bottom of tubes in heat exchanger starting to gum up a bit now where water been sitting , want to take the end caps off and rod them through and then run some rydlme through complete system after, just to give them good clean up ,

Anyway trying to find out info for the C9s seems hard, not too much info out there, have the basic service mantenance manual but pretty usesless really, been reading up online as you do and now worried about the aftercoolers , am planning on stripping off , cleaning up but do they really need replacing? all i can see is various people saying CAT reccomends replacing all aftercoolers every 6 years ,

The internal core unit is an eye watering ( £6,618.66 GBP - CORE AS-AFTERCOOLER - Add To Cart x 1 ) Finning poole

Is this just them being over cautious because of what happened on CAT earlier models?

Engines done around 680hrs serial no C9B00109 & C9B00129 , anyone know much about these , good ,bad points to look out for

Im going to replace the coolant with CAT ELC , do they really take 47 Litres per engine , sounds alot thats all , again service manual left blank on this exact figure , that was from googling about

Any info on these engines and help be great , very little out there it seems , must be that sort of year / model

Cheers

 

[jfm]

Yes indeed Cat got stung by some bad intercoolers years ago and that's the root of their "6 year" rule.

Porto will be along in a while to tell us that they are rubbish

I've had 4 Cats over 12 years (not C-9) and in my last boat I did 10 seasons. I changed the intercoolers in year 9,and of course the ones that came out were perfect. Thats in the ultra salty and warm Mediterranean, where corrosion is faster than in UK. I did have BodgeFlowTM installed which must help, but in your shoes I would consider 6 years a bit too soon. BodgeFlowTM is easy to install and you might want to consider it.

My intercoolers were an eye watering price too - the job fully outsourced to Cat dealer (in expensive SofF) including a normal annual service was 45k€

Actually my (excellent) Cat dealer offered a service of just cleaning and pressure testing them - maybe you could do the same - strip them off yourself and send them out for a pressure test. Even so I would do it at 8 years not 6.

Good luck!

 

[SC35]

the job ... including a normal annual service was 45k€

Falls off chair.

My debit card was weeping as I bought £1500 worth of service parts for the VP D4's at lunchtime today.

 

[jfm]

Me too regarding falling off chair.

For some context, a normal annual servi e of C32 engines and gearboxes, with everything done, is €9k. There is a lot of parts mark up that is incredibly annoying - raw impellers €1,000 each - but that is partly reflected in lower labour charges and unless you have time to fight this battle its easier to just live with it. I like and trust my local Cat dealer very much - a great team.

The intercoolers were around €10k each and then plenty of labour, plus small crane here (a HIAB thing) because they are so heavy and the mechanics didn't want to risk breaking the passerelle. Then add VAT and you get to the €45k eek. B.O.A.T.

 

[Portofino]

Not saying they are “ rubbish “ never have done merely reporting passing on info so others can make an informed decisions.
From memory ( can’t be arse in a Boris way with the details ) but the gen concept is this …..Happy to be corrected FWIW .

Mainly the C32 - JFMs previous , CAT out sourced intercooler manufacturer .It’s design with pencil anodic protection meant in certain circumstances after shut down the water level drained down below the zinc (s) .This meant , obviously depending on use age pattern ( more leisure than every day commercial) they sat basically hanging in air . With out any seawater the electrolyte the thing corrodes.Zinc can’t protect if it’s dry and electrolytically un connected to the very thing it’s supposed to protect ,Let’s park this chemistry here .

More so if when the CAT quality control team have gone home from the 3 rd party factory in a 3rd world country, when the cats away the mice play and lower quality metals creep into the coolers .
Net results catastrophic corrosion failure = water ingestion = hydrolock = bent rods / busted engines = rebuilds or replace .Talking inside 2 yrs .Or a Sod’s law @ 25 months with a 24 m warranty.So CAT wash there hands claiming correctly the warranties expired .
Class action in the states from bost owners , CAT loose = punitive damages .So CAT review policy and manufacturers, quality assurance AND as a back stop to prevent another courtroom drama write up / recommend - word it as you will they are should have a change out life of 6 yrs ,So you can’t sue them again .They did in the new quality assurance post loosing in court it’s suggested make them out of titanium or other more noble metals in a never “let it happen again “ policy move .

Time scale ball park 2005-2012 ish .Maybe later ?

@ JFM thx for disclosing your personal experience.Thought as much and was wondering when you where selling Match 2 where you where on the CAT intercooler predicament with selling on .

Anecdotally I know of two C12 boats stranded in the Med .…..set off on the typical family cruise for the intercoolers to leak .

So what do the others do MAN MTU .
Completely different anodic protection .No pencil anodes hidden out of sight .I don’t think any 3P outsourcing of main components.More in house in Germany castings on one site under watchful eyes .But connect the block to an external transom anode vis a copper strap .You can visibly see the anodes .In theory basking in salt water is actually the best thing as the zinc protective chemistry needs salty water electrolytes to protect the bolt on coolers on the engines. Yeh I know it’s counterintuitive .

As for resale and residuals of CATs boats with this era of coolers a diligent buyer will be asking about the intercooler dates , and factoring that in to the buying process ,Bit like the rotor head of a helicopter…..it’s has life of ( insert hrs ) .

Tbh IMHO today it’s bit onerous acquiring a aged CAT boat and picking this up .Flushing as JFM has done just pushers the change out date a bit .But does not get rid of it .6 yrs is 6 yrs and needs to be in the service history at resale .

No body is holding a knife to your throat forcing you buy a particular boat .There are always alternatives and different sets of compromises.

Nothing new here I see a huge similarity with Porsche M96/M97 flat 6 .Water cooled engine introduced circa 1997 with the 996 ( 911 ) then used on the boxster up the 987.2 and 997.2 ( 911 ) circa 2009 .
A chocolate tea pot of closed deck water cooling + Intermediate shaft bearing failures.The cooling fiasco leads to bore scoring on cylinder 6 ,
From 2009 Porsche completely redesigned the flat 6 to a Mezgler styled open deck and got rid of the IMS bearing .

How ever there’s a lot of 1997- 2009 cars out there .With owners facing huge bills as you read this .
It’s doesn’t stop the enthusiasm for the marque as this CAT intercooler debacle hasn’t in boats .

Tread carefully .

 

[jfm]

Disagree most of that but no energy to play "Portofino tennis".

 

[Portofino]

@the Op
Theres plenty of chatter on this .No one except yourself can make the 6 yr “ do I or don’t I call “ .

But for the benefit those reading this not familiar with CATs 6 yr throw way intercooler policy .



Cat C32 aftercooler replacement - Engines | YachtForums: We Know Big Boats!

CAT C-12 Aftercoolers - Engines | YachtForums: We Know Big Boats!

CAT Aftercooolers — and whats Real | Page 4 - Engines | YachtForums: We Know Big Boats!

 

[Swift28]

jfm thanks for reply ,

Yeah makes sense i guess , they trying to cover their backs at our cost ,stupid , annoying and expensive as like you say the throw away part no doubt last for many more years , looks like i will have to bite the bullet and replace them , piece of mind ,

Boat is 2006 and not sure when they were last changed unfortunately, apparently mine the updated better ones but dont give me much confidence

Will fit fresh water flush while im at it , im sure will help longevity and even slow down other heat exchangers clogging up over time

Blimey falls off chair , not sure id want your bill

 

[Swift28]

@the Op
Theres plenty of chatter on this .No one except yourself can make the 6 yr “ do I or don’t I call “ .

But for the benefit those reading this not familiar with CATs 6 yr throw way intercooler policy .



Cat C32 aftercooler replacement - Engines | YachtForums: We Know Big Boats!

CAT C-12 Aftercoolers - Engines | YachtForums: We Know Big Boats!

CAT Aftercooolers — and whats Real | Page 4 - Engines | YachtForums: We Know Big Boats!

Thanks for the detailed info porto