Capo Nord Italy - Local info?

[solar]

Great place and nice Marinas BUT...
I was able to sit on top of sand bars in the inner laguna with only 1.65m keel at the center of the marked paths.
Once it even happened at the entrance coming in from the open sea.
What am I doing wrong?
Should I limit exit/enter the Laguna ONLY at HW?
Thanks.

 

[RichardS]

Great place and nice Marinas BUT...
I was able to sit on top of sand bars in the inner laguna with only 1.65m keel at the center of the marked paths.
Once it even happened at the entrance coming in from the open sea.
What am I doing wrong?
Should I limit exit/enter the Laguna ONLY at HW?
Thanks.

I don't know about Capo Nord but certainly I could not enter the Marano Lagoon at low tide coming in from the open sea right in the middle of the entrance, and I only draw 1m ... we ran into the mud about 1/2 mile out so I'm sceptical as to whether we could even have got in at high tide.

When we decided to follow the piles which follow the coastline close to the beach from a mile to the West, we were able to sail right in no problem .... but we had to keep quite close to the piles as if you start to go further offshore the depth starts to drop.

It's really strange than the offshore route into the main entrance is shallow but the route so close to the beach that you could hit the sunbathers with a stone is deep! I've never seen anything like it.

The Venice lagoon Lido entrance is more conventional .... aim for the middle of the entrance from offshore for the deep water. Perhaps it's dredged that way for the cruise ships.

Richard

 

[Metabarca]

That's odd: the Porto Buso entrance should be reasonably deep as it's used by shipping. I've only been a couple of times and went in from about a mile offshore without a problem. But this was 5-6 years ago. I draw 1.8 m. The Lignano entrance may be different, of course.

 

[solar]

I'm talking about the Punto Faro entrance and the marked inner water ways that leads to the 3 Marinas.
Can't see no indication on any marine map or app that the aria is for HW traffic only? strange no?

 

[RichardS]

I'm talking about the Punto Faro entrance and the marked inner water ways that leads to the 3 Marinas.
Can't see no indication on any marine map or app that the aria is for HW traffic only? strange no?

Yes .... I'm also talking about the Punta Faro entrance. i think that's the same as the Lignano one. It sounds as if the Porto Buso entrance is the deep one.

When you say that you hit the sandbars coming in from the open sea, do you mean directly into the entrance from the open sea on a NW heading. If so you will hit the sand.

If you mean that you followed the piles on a NE course with the piles just on your Port side then it must be that the channel is too shallow for you at LW.

As for what happens inside the lagoon once you head off westwards to the marinas, I can't help as we anchored just north of the Punta Faro entrance. However, the channel we followed for 1/2 mile northwards before dropping anchor had a good 3 metres depth even at LW but I don't know whether it gets shallower and shallower as you proceed Westwards. I would be surprised, but then my whole visit to the lagoons was surprising as none of it was quite as I expected.

This photo is taken from our anchorage looking westwards towards the setting sun over the Capo Nord Marina:

and this one show the deep channel coming in. That's Punta Faro Marina in the background. If you go further out to sea than this you run aground! :ambivalence:

Richard

Edit .... looking back at my photos from last month has reminded me of another phenomenon which left me totally confused. However, I'll start a new thread for this question.

 

[solar]

Thank you RichardS.
Think I had some 'beginners luck' when first entered the Punto Faro entrance a few weeks ago at the middle coming from Koper. My ETA was at HW time...
Now returning from Venice yesterday I arrived at LW and after sitting on a sand bar at the middle entrance I turned to follow the NE piles and just got by the depth near them.
The depth at the inner ways to my Marina was also very shallow in many places.
Maybe the rainless and very hot/dry Aug have something to do with the shallow waters at the Punto Faro entrance and inside the Laguna?
As said it's strange that the maps/apps give no warnings about it.
Will ask some local talent Skippers about how to plan my future trips here.
The damage is only to my pride so far...
You live - you learn.

 

[BrianH]

The Lignano channel is deepest some 5 to 10 m NE of the channel mark posts then between the port entrance mark and starboard light tower.

Never try to enter without keeping offshore until the outer channel marker then follow the posts. Also, do not try to enter in strong southerly gales but make for Porto Buso and anchor in the lagoon until it blows over.

All from experience of 35 years of berthing in Aprilia Marittima.

Edit.
By "follow the posts", that should be qualified by ... until shortly before the entrance where a sand spit has formed in the channel and where a red buoy marks the end of it, which should be kept to port on entering.

The Lignano channel follows a common principle of placing only one set of markers without the complementary starboard line but nevertheless, the channel is just as necessary for navigation as if both were present and should be strictly used .

 

[BrianH]

Great place and nice Marinas BUT...
I was able to sit on top of sand bars in the inner laguna with only 1.65m keel at the center of the marked paths.
Once it even happened at the entrance coming in from the open sea.
What am I doing wrong?
Should I limit exit/enter the Laguna ONLY at HW
Thanks.

Realise I did not answer your question. Unless you have a deep draught there is no reason to limit your access from Capo Nord to the sea at any tidal state. The only critical section is the newly dredged section on the curve from the straight after the marina entrance. There is always in excess of 2m if you keep to the center of the channels. I cannot understand your problem if you observe the channel marks.

 

[solar]

Many thanks Barnac1e.
Will use your good advises.
My draught is 1.65m only.
That's why I was so amazed to find myself at dawn siting on top a small sand bar half way from my marina to the Lignano exit.
I was at the center of the inner channel when it happened. Boat was at a speed of 4-5 Kns. A bit alarming even if it was only soft sand...
Maybe just my bad luck?

 

[BrianH]

Many thanks Barnac1e.
Will use your good advises.
My draught is 1.65m only.
That's why I was so amazed to find myself at dawn siting on top a small sand bar half way from my marina to the Lignano exit.
I was at the center of the inner channel when it happened. Boat was at a speed of 4-5 Kns. A bit alarming even if it was only soft sand...
Maybe just my bad luck?

Hi solar,
I would really like to analyse this further with you, perhaps with coordinates and chart, because it really should not happen. However, i'm cruising the Black Sea Danube delta (another's boat) with only a tablet and flakey internet, so it will have to wait.

I will be back on board Curlew (Darsena, 24/447) in two weeks if you will be aboard.

Best, Brian.

 

[solar]

Hi solar,
I would really like to analyse this further with you, perhaps with coordinates and chart, because it really should not happen. However, i'm cruising the Black Sea Danube delta (another's boat) with only a tablet and flakey internet, so it will have to wait.

I will be back on board Curlew (Darsena, 24/447) in two weeks if you will be aboard.

Best, Brian.

Hi Brian,
On my next exit from the lagoon I'll try to write down the coordinates of the spoken spot.
I'm leaving here on 8/9 if you'r back by then and want to talk/meet just send me a PM.
Enjoy your cruising.

 

[solar]

Hi Brian,
Sent you a PM with the asked info.

 

[BrianH]

Hi Brian,
Sent you a PM with the asked info.

Thanks, received. I'm at home but leave for Italy tomorrow so will take this up when aboard with some detailed charts.

At first glance using GE, your first grounding position was about 1.5nm into the marina channel from the marina entrance, shortly before the junction to the Bevezzana channel. I normally would expect 3m there ... I wonder what the tidal state was at that time, not that should be a problem at that point if in the centre of the channel.

The second event was very close to the sand bar that has formed a short distance from the Lignano entrance into the channel - I am sure you are aware of that and kept away from the channel posts and kept the red marker buoy well south of your course ...?

The first case we can take up with the Circolo Nautico office, the second is a Lignano port responsibility, if the sand bar has extended.

I shall make enquiries of my contacts if these shallow areas are already known as soon as I get organised on Monday.

The problem with the channel from the marina to the Bevezzana junction is that it is indeed shallow and needs regular dredging, which was last done November 2015. But to not disturb the channel marking posts they dredge only in the middle and ensure 2m at LWS. However, the wash from the larger power boats (there are some >20m ones in the three marina complex), often disregard the speed limit and lift the sediment that then slides down the dredged slope and settles in the centre, soon reducing the depth. If I am passed by one of those I lose my depth display as the signal cannot penetrate the suspended particles stirred up by the wash.

The local authorities take the access situation seriously as they are aware how much revenue the three marina complex generates and the local workforce dependent on a functioning leisure industry. The channel has to be navigable to sustain the Hanse sales and the deeper-keeled yachts that are berthed there.

Best,
Brian.

 

[BrianH]

Hi solar.
I'm replying here rather than by PM on the possibility that others may have judged the Aprilia Marittima three marina complex (Darsena, Punta Gabbiani and Capo Nord) was too shallow for access to consider from previous posts.

Today I departed the entrance and made careful and continuous note of all depths until well out to sea past the outer Lignano channel post. I must first mention my long-keeler draws only 1.2m so I never have a problem - in fact it is ideal for the area of lagoons and their channels.

It was 10:00 with the tide at half flood at 0.7m. The Canale di Pertagada (from the marina) was consistently between 2.5-3m for its 0.5nm length as was the new section that bears NE as an extension to Canale Coron, then in the Canale de' Lustri for 3nm until meeting Canale dei Pantani (from Bevezzana). This is the section, from the marina entrance to this junction, that was dredged late last year at enormous expense by a company from Venice with suction dredgers that I remember working night and day pumping through large pipes from the channel and depositing the silt on the flats to the NW of the channel. It was towards the end of that section that I believe you briefly grounded.

At this junction there was a noticeable hump from 4m to 2.5m (the advantage of a fish-finder - to see the bottom graph on the display), which immediately dropped to 3.5m. and continued to deepen all the way along the Canale de' Lustri to where it joins the main Canale di Marano and then to the Lignano entrance where there was 7m depth. From there it rapidly shallowed from the port-hand light and it was clearly best to keep in the section between center-channel and the three-legged, starboard-hand light tower before bearing to starboard to follow the channel posts.

No longer is there the red buoy where the channel posts kink from ca. 150° to ca. 170° so the assumption is the sand bar has been dredged since my last passage there in early July and near where you went aground. However, I didn't want to prove it and kept well north of the channel posts - I think from closely watching the depths both leaving and returning a few hours later, a consistent 3m depth can be assured by keeping about 30m to the north of the channel posts along their entire length.

As for your grounding in Canale de' Lustri, the contact in Circolo Nautico was unable to explain, other than you were too close to the marker 'bricola' - he stressed the extensive dredging less than a year ago and the rigid controls made to subsequently check the work, which my own observations today can confirm. However, I did keep absolutely to the center of the channel at all times.

Hope this helps.

Brian.