Can anyone black start their boat?

[burgundyben]

Can anyone here do a black start? No electrical power on board from batteries or shore hook up.

Hand crank? Or wind up starter?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K0I-EHsmkME

There is this https://www.springstarter.com/

Anyone here?

 

[[2068]]

I don't think that would work with a D4-260 EDC.

 

[burgundyben]

I don't think that would work with a D4-260 EDC.

No, I suppose for a electronic controlled engine its a bit trickier.

I believe that HDML Medusa can do it, a single cylinder Gardner 1L2 can be hand cranked, I think that acts as an air compressor to fill a tank and air start the main engines.

 

[stelican]

We are on The Hamble River above the bridge. With a spring tide we can bump start.

 

[vas]

It's one of the things I'd like to be able to do: handstart the yanmar 2GM20 generator engine.
Once this is running, there rest will start the normal way or is that cheating?
No way I can think of hand cranking a 6.something lt 6cyl diesel...

V.

 

[Ladybirdgaffcutter]

..

I believe that HDML Medusa can do it, a single cylinder Gardner 1L2 can be hand cranked, I think that acts as an air compressor to fill a tank and air start the main engines.

Yes I think so as well, and it's common on older tugs and trawlers, coasters etc. Anything with air starting really.
Never heard it called 'black start' before, starting from dead-ship is what we called it.

 

[BruceK]

See how big that crank handle is? Even if it could start my engines I'd have to cut the deck up to make space

 

[Bouba]

See how big that crank handle is? Even if it could start my engines I'd have to cut the deck up to make space

Yes, I thought that but BB’s second link had smaller cranking handles

 

[Portofino]

It's one of the things I'd like to be able to do: handstart the yanmar 2GM20 generator engine.
Once this is running, there rest will start the normal way or is that cheating?
No way I can think of hand cranking a 6.something lt 6cyl diesel...

V.

I had a sailboat with the 1GM that came with a hand crank .You need to operate the decompression lever iirc to get it turning then close it .

Current geny has i think smaller single , circa 300 cc ,so in theory it’s possible to hand crank it then use the geny to recharge / power up the mains .All hypothetical and I suspect considered “cheating “

With today’s modern engines there’s two hurdles equally unjumpable
1- hand cranking a huge 12.7 L 6 fast enough.
2- juice/ volts to power up all the ECU,s solinoids , good for go senors etc .

 

[BruceK]

Yes, I thought that but BB’s second link had smaller cranking handles

So long as it comes with a 10 year old who can fit down the back to crank it, I'm sold!

Very interesting though. But I presume this would replace the starter rather than as backup?

 

[vas]

I had a sailboat with the 1GM that came with a hand crank .You need to operate the decompression lever iirc to get it turning then close it .

Current geny has i think smaller single , circa 300 cc ,so in theory it’s possible to hand crank it then use the geny to recharge / power up the mains .All hypothetical and I suspect considered “cheating “

With today’s modern engines there’s two hurdles equally unjumpable
1- hand cranking a huge 12.7 L 6 fast enough.
2- juice/ volts to power up all the ECU,s solinoids , good for go senors etc .

hm,

which reminded me that the yanmar has an solenoid for the juice, no current, no click, no diesel to the pump, no start.
OK, I'll resort to my planB: 600W solar, that will get my service batteries up to speed in a few hours...

 

[jrudge]

A friend of mine used to be a marine engineer on big boats. There was a requirement ( insurance??) that the engine no matter what the size could be started manually so loss of power was not a cause to be on the rocks.

I know him well so I am sure that it was true but have no idea if it was regulation, insurance etc.

 

[KINGFISHER 9]

If it's a flat battery problem I've got a power pack that will start anything up to an 8 litre diesel … at least that's what it says on the box! As mine's only 5.9 litres I'm hoping it'll do ….. :encouragement:

 

[Portofino]

hm,

which reminded me that the yanmar has an solenoid for the juice, no current, no click, no diesel to the pump, no start.
OK, I'll resort to my planB: 600W solar, that will get my service batteries up to speed in a few hours...

Yup the 1GM was a 1984 derivative from a paddy pump , whereby villagers had no electricity in the field so to speak .
The geny even though tiny and hand crankable is “ modern “ 2003 so stuffed with elecrotwackery like you say fuel solinoid and suspect a fuel pump + a black box / mini ECU -? so nah no power no start .

Ironically with the ( hand starter abled ) rag n stick boat you don,t actually need an engine .
In tidal places it’s a matter of timing ,using it .
I have docked sail boats just with partial sails , backing the jib etc .
It’s not pretty btw .

 

[burgundyben]

Never heard it called 'black start' before, starting from dead-ship is what we called it.

I work in powergen, its a common term for getting powerup and connecting to the grid, its common term to me! I assumed it would mean the same on a boat.

A friend of mine used to be a marine engineer on big boats. There was a requirement ( insurance??) that the engine no matter what the size could be started manually so loss of power was not a cause to be on the rocks.

I know him well so I am sure that it was true but have no idea if it was regulation, insurance etc.

I suspect on commercial vessels its a common ability, especially mission critical stuff like lifeboats etc.

 

[Dino]

I work for an electrical utility and a previous role was in the operations area. I once did a course called "The Black Start Course". It was how to black start a country after a full black out. Now that was interesting... Involved the use of standby diesel generators and hydro stations.

 

[PCUK]

If you've got some battery power to operate the electronics but not enough to turn the engine, then a spring starter will do the job.

 

[NormanS]

I used to have a boat with a Gardner 6L3. That's a six cylinder, 17 litre heavyweight. When I got her, the engine was equipped with not quite complete hand-starting, consisting of an overhead shaft with a handle at each end of the engine, and a chain drive down to the crankshaft. The handbook for the engine euphemistically stated, " The engine driver may require some assistance for this operation". You're talking about a big lump of machinery, weighing about three tons, but with individual decrompressers on each cylinder.
Although I never started it by hand, the party trick was to do a bump start.

 

[vas]

Yup the 1GM was a 1984 derivative from a paddy pump , whereby villagers had no electricity in the field so to speak .
The geny even though tiny and hand crankable is “ modern “ 2003 so stuffed with elecrotwackery like you say fuel solinoid and suspect a fuel pump + a black box / mini ECU -? so nah no power no start .

It's not that bad, only got a fuel solenoid so that you turn it off on the button.
No ECU, no el. fuel pump, lift pump is normal mechanical thing.
still not an easy way around it tbh.

 

[burgundyben]

I used to have a boat with a Gardner 6L3. That's a six cylinder, 17 litre heavyweight. When I got her, the engine was equipped with not quite complete hand-starting, consisting of an overhead shaft with a handle at each end of the engine, and a chain drive down to the crankshaft. The handbook for the engine euphemistically stated, " The engine driver may require some assistance for this operation". You're talking about a big lump of machinery, weighing about three tons, but with individual decrompressers on each cylinder.
Although I never started it by hand, the party trick was to do a bump start.

We discussed that recently on here, I believe with decompressors on each cylinder that it would be possible, just gotta get it moving!