Caernarfon Bar

[Tzu]

Anyone care to give some guidance? .. I need to get out of Caernarfon heading south and weather seems to have settled to blustery Westerlys. Local advice has been to shake heads and mutter about death and destruction on the bar.. Anyone with local knowledge here?

 

[TSB240]

I was down at Belan on Monday but did not venture further as I was only out for the day.

It looked quite rough with some breaking swells on the outer banks but the bar route was still tenable.

The marked channel is fine with plenty of depth apart from the final three buoys where the swell can reduce your depth by at least a metre very suddenly! We came through 4 and a half hours before HW recently but only draw just over a meter and it was flat water with a north westerly.

If going south with a strong southerly/westerly I prefer to go early pushing the tide when the wind is over the tide +1 to HW going after the tide turns tends to give you a much rougher ride.

You can always stop off at Abermenai to have a look see from the big sand Dune before committing yourself at HW.

Alternatively have a look from the HM office at Viccy dock borrow Mark's Bins.

My rule of thumb is if you cant see anything of the wreck then you will have a minimum of 3 meters of water on the bar passage.

How much do you draw and how much swell do you think there might be are the two questions I would have in mind.

Use this spreadsheet for your passage planning as Bardsey could be a bit more of a challenge!

http://www.nwvyc.org.uk/Orr_Tides.html

Steve

 

[C08]

When we were based on the Menai Straits we had a number of unsettling experiences on the bar. If there is no great swell I would aim to be on the bar just before HW to avoid any wind over tide with a westerly. I would not go with more than the bottom end of 4 and just as important if there is more than 0.5m of wave height. However if there has been a few days of strong westerlies there is going to be swell. Whether the conditions are dangerous or just uncomfortable also depends on the size of boat and your experience.
We have had awful conditions on the bar with no wind but a moderate, confused swell and also a lovely sail in f5 but with wind and tide together.
The advice you have been given to be very wary is sound but if you are over cautious you will never get anywhere. Also what is important is where you are heading to as Bardsey Sound can be bad and Porth Dinnalean (never could spell it) is exposed in westerlies.
You can always go back if it does not feel right and sail another day!

 

[AngusMcDoon]

Porth Dinnalean (never could spell it) is exposed in westerlies.

Porth Dinllaen is exposed from WNW to ENE.

 

[duncan99210]

If you've really got to get away heading south and the conditions on the bar make crossing it too hairy, then you could consider going the long way round, going to the north and exiting by Puffin Island. Spend a night in Holyhead before continuing south?

 

[Tzu]

If you've really got to get away heading south and the conditions on the bar make crossing it too hairy, then you could consider going the long way round, going to the north and exiting by Puffin Island. Spend a night in Holyhead before continuing south?

Definitely considered it but the top bit of Anglesey is a bit iffy in a blowy Sw as well? And stuck in Holyhead v stuck in Caernarfon....

Was looking good for a "go for it" (with Admirals permission for it to be a bit rolly) up until decision time 5 min ago when another belt of wind and rain came through.. So I'm looking at all the options again.

Nobody said sailing would be so hard on the brain ��

 

[TSB240]

I use Windguru Llandwyn bay for a guide as to what to expect on wave heights on the Bar! I also add at least a meter and a half to my draft for safety margin.

http://www.windguru.cz/int/index.php?sc=47843

 

[Gwylan]

Over a week of peering over the wall at all sorts of bumpy water gave me a healthy respect for the bar. Crew went home, having run out of holiday, and i was left to sail home on my own.

If you have to go the idea of going the long way is not as silly as it sounds.

 

[TSB240]

The thing is the breaking waves help you as they show where the shallow bits are and the Channel can often be quite serene in comparison.

I would however be rigged to accept at least one big green rogue wave over the bow and into the cockpit at any time!

I have happily gone through a scene looking like something from Hawai 5 o 5 on the bar with the swell curving over as they break on the outer banks.

Going around the long way might mean enduring similar or even worse conditions at the Skerries or the Stacks if timed wrong!

I would draw you to an analogy that it looks worse than it actually is .

It is easy to psych yourself out just like the noise of many masts in a marina make the actual wind strength seem far fiercer than it is!

What boat?

 

[C08]

Porth Dinllaen is exposed from WNW to ENE.[/Q

I know looking at the chart westerlies should be ok in PY BUT I have been there in a westerly blow and taken quite a battering. Depending on the direction the wind has been there may still be a swell into the anchorage even if you tuck in as far as possible.

 

[geem]

In my experience it never seems as bad as I expect it to be once i get out there

 

[savageseadog]

Use this spreadsheet for your passage planning as Bardsey could be a bit more of a challenge!

Bardsey is my least favourite NW Wales race, hard to avoid.

Caernarfon Bar is generally OK HW+/- 2Hrs in anything up to F5 W/SW. It can look a bit alarming and I've been across it with surf-able waves around us with a 2.5m draft.
Steve

 

[Tzu]

Thanks all, especially Steve for the NWVYC spreadsheet which really helps with not having to do the same calculations over and over each tide.
Abandoned ship for a couple of days as was getting dangerously close to the "got to be home for an appointment" passage plan which never ends well.
Heading back after the weekend refreshed, with lawn mowed and clean clothes

 

[TSB240]

She is still all tucked up in Vicky dock! Parked up in front of you last night enjoyed a couple of beers in the Royal Welsh. Now anchored out at Abermenai . Plenty of boats going south over the bar. 10 knot sowesterly and very sunny!

Steve

 

[Tzu]

Thanks Steve. I knew she wouldn't be lonely for long. This warm spell (or day?) was nicely forecast but it's a bit too close to Mrs Tzu's appointment in the morning . Heading back tomorrow for the hopefully warm gentle breeze on Tuesday, spreadsheet of timings in hand

Rgds

 

[NickRobinson]

Definitely considered it but the top bit of Anglesey is a bit iffy in a blowy Sw as well? And stuck in Holyhead v stuck in Caernarfon....

....��

Stuck in Holyhead after stuck in Conwy (see Skerries in or out thread). Blowing a hooley at the moment, 25kts 180, gust 32.

Hopefully Dublin (DL or Howth) tomorrow, we'll see...

 

[TSB240]

Nick

Just a note of caution!

The last time I visited Holyhead Marina My wife happened to witness a lady partner being arrested/ sat upon by two police women and two police men at the top of the marina gangway as she had just stabbed her husband in the back (several times).

Not sure if it was cabin fever or he had been unfaithful!

I enjoyed this walk when last stuck in Hole-in-the-head!

http://downloads.bbc.co.uk/tv/weatherman-walking/walks/Holyhead.pdf

Really not much else there other than a good Indian!

Steve