C Map - How do they get away with this con?

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Trident

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I bought a new Simrad NSS8 plotter at the weekend which comes with a C Map card in the box and a leaflet which reads:

"Your New Simrad Chartplotter comes BUNDLED with" (My capitalisation)
and then details three charts Max-N BDS - two - Americas and Rest of World its says are pre-programmed on the SD card whilst Europe has to be downloaded.

My card was blank. All the cards are blank when the retailer checked. They seemed to know and accept this and think that a free £1 Micro SD card counts as a chart bundle and that I should expect to have to pay to get the actual charts that are specifically noted as being free with my plotter and pre-programmed.

After several days of trying to get an email reply I finally called Jepessen to be told that the Max-N BDS are not free options and have to be bought and are not as their own leaflet says "pre-programmed" on the card. In what sense is this that my chart plotter comes "bundled with" these? In what sense is a blank card pre-programmed? No reply from Jepessen to this. Contact details for your legal department please? No reply yet to that either.

Has anyone else come across this? Am I right in reporting this to Trading Standards as an out and out misrepresentation ?

Meanwhile I shall now but the Navionics charts instead...
 
Are you sure that the cartography that is 'bundled' is not embedded on the Simrad and the blank card is to enable you to upgrade to a better level if required.

If not then I think your argument is with Simrad, not C Map.
 
neale said:
Are you sure that the cartography that is 'bundled' is not embedded on the Simrad and the blank card is to enable you to upgrade to a better level if required.

If not then I think your argument is with Simrad, not C Map.
Click to expand...

No, his argument is with the retailer who sold it to him. Either demand what he paid for (as stated on the leaflet) or, money back.
 
GrahamM376 said:
No, his argument is with the retailer who sold it to him. Either demand what he paid for (as stated on the leaflet) or, money back.
Click to expand...

Does this not depend on whether the contents of the leaflet form part of the contract between buyer and seller? I'm sure the OP believes that it does, but the seller may argue that it doesn't. Caveat emptor as they say...?
 
I recently purchased a 'package' consisting of a plotter and a c-map MW2 chart.

I took it down to the boat and connected power to it. Great I thought 12 satelites very quickly picked up this is good.

I then plugged in the c-map card -- A message appeared on the screen 'This chart is out of date please contact your supplier or Jeppesen to have it updated'

I tried phoning Jeppesen on their UK number and found myself speaking to someone in Italy and was told I had to send the card to Italy AT MY EXPENSE to gave the card brought up to date. I then sent an email to them asking them to give me precise details on how I could have it updated. In over two weeks I have not had a reply to my email but -- I now find myself on a Jeppesen mailing list and am getting all sorts of offers for other products from them.

I got in touch with my supplier and they are disgusted at how I have been treated. They offered me two options.

First option was for me to send the card to them and they would have it fully updated at their expense.

The second option was for them to arrange a carrier to pick up the complete package and give me a full refund. I have accepted this option and it will be collected tomorrow.

In the meantime I have a Google Nexus 10 winding it's way from Hong Kong and I will be using that with Navionics on it (I already have a Nexus 7 but want a bigger display)

I was under the illusion that if I bought a complete chart plotter package I would have a continuously updated set of charts to back up my real paper ones - But I was wrong.
 
Strathglass said:
I recently purchased a 'package' consisting of a plotter and a c-map MW2 chart.

I took it down to the boat and connected power to it. Great I thought 12 satelites very quickly picked up this is good.

I then plugged in the c-map card -- A message appeared on the screen 'This chart is out of date please contact your supplier or Jeppesen to have it updated'

I tried phoning Jeppesen on their UK number and found myself speaking to someone in Italy and was told I had to send the card to Italy AT MY EXPENSE to gave the card brought up to date. I then sent an email to them asking them to give me precise details on how I could have it updated. In over two weeks I have not had a reply to my email but -- I now find myself on a Jeppesen mailing list and am getting all sorts of offers for other products from them.

I got in touch with my supplier and they are disgusted at how I have been treated. They offered me two options.

First option was for me to send the card to them and they would have it fully updated at their expense.

The second option was for them to arrange a carrier to pick up the complete package and give me a full refund. I have accepted this option and it will be collected tomorrow.

In the meantime I have a Google Nexus 10 winding it's way from Hong Kong and I will be using that with Navionics on it (I already have a Nexus 7 but want a bigger display)

I was under the illusion that if I bought a complete chart plotter package I would have a continuously updated set of charts to back up my real paper ones - But I was wrong.
Click to expand...


Thanks for the warning. I do not understand how the card can be "out of date". It should work forever the updating is the responsibility of the user. just imagine if you were out at see and your plotter suddenly decided your time was up and you needed to update your chart and stopped working. The operation of this device is unfit for purpose.
 
Strathglass said:
I was under the illusion that if I bought a complete chart plotter package I would have a continuously updated set of charts to back up my real paper ones - But I was wrong.
Click to expand...

The idea that you would have continuously updated charts is wrong - updating of plotter charts has always been a bit of an expensive mess, albeit they have started to address the issue in the last couple of years. But you should expect to receive charts that were reasonably up to date at the time purchased, and continued to work indefinitely, so obviously what you actually got was not acceptable.

Seven Spades said:
Thanks for the warning. I do not understand how the card can be "out of date". It should work forever the updating is the responsibility of the user. just imagine if you were out at see and your plotter suddenly decided your time was up and you needed to update your chart and stopped working. The operation of this device is unfit for purpose.
Click to expand...

They've had the concept of "out of date" for many years - but the usual action is to pop up a window recommending you update, you tell it to go away, and the charts then work as before.

Pete
 
Seven Spades said:
Thanks for the warning. I do not understand how the card can be "out of date". It should work forever the updating is the responsibility of the user. just imagine if you were out at see and your plotter suddenly decided your time was up and you needed to update your chart and stopped working. The operation of this device is unfit for purpose.
Click to expand...

I was still able to display charts but it was telling me that the data on them was out of date.

I trying it out for the first time as I had just purchased it and should have had up to date charts on it. I certainly do not think the updating of charts on a new product should be the responsibility of a user.

As you say the device was not fit for purpose.

I have also not had a reply from Jeppesen to my question of how I would be able to update in the future.
 
Strathglass said:
I was still able to display charts but it was telling me that the data on them was out of date.

I trying it out for the first time as I had just purchased it and should have had up to date charts on it.
Click to expand...

It should - but the cause is more likely too long sat on the shelf at the chandler's, rather than any fault of the manufacturer or chart publisher. Do you know how long the shop had had it?

Strathglass said:
I certainly do not think the updating of charts on a new product should be the responsibility of a user.
Click to expand...

I think it reasonably can be - provided it doesn't cost anything. This solves the shelf-life problem above - let the user download updates when they buy it, so that the data is as fresh as possible.

Navionics (the plotter cards, not the phone apps) get this right nowadays. It comes with a card-reader that plugs into your computer, and you get a year's worth of free updates, counting from when you first connect it. So the machine can sit on a shelf for two years, you buy it and update it to that moment, and then in a year's time you can update it again (plus as often as you like in between). After that you do have to pay for updates, if you want them.

Pete
 
I've now ordered the Navionics package and referred the misleading leaflet to Trading Standards to look at. I've still had no reply from Jepessen to pass on contact details for their legal department but I assume when Trading Standards get in touch they will be more forthcoming and hopefully change their practices.
 
Does seem claims are being stretched, I use C-Map and have updated my cartridge twice via Jeppesen in Italy and found general queries answered slowly but when I joined club Jeppesen and posted the chip to them the whole process there and back only took a few days and would recommend it.
 
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