Buying a Bowman 40

[Fairliedog]

We are Buying A bowman 40. Or at least we think we are pending survey next week. Wondering if there are any owners current or past that had any advice or things to look out for regarding this particular boat?
Thanks.

 

[14K478]

I have met the very capable and pleasant chap who has the one in Fox’s in Ipswich. He has done and had done quite a lot on her, including peeling and drying and epoxying, but I don’t recall him mentioning any structural issues. Sorry if this is a bit vague.

 

[Fairliedog]

I should have included its the later Chuck Paine design and its located in the US.

 

[14K478]

I should have included its the later Chuck Paine design and its located in the US.

Ask Chuck.

He's on Facebook and happy to chat.

 

[Goldie]

We are Buying A bowman 40. Or at least we think we are pending survey next week. Wondering if there are any owners current or past that had any advice or things to look out for regarding this particular boat?
Thanks.

Great choice! I’m not aware of any particular problems with the boat as a class, but as these boats are ‘maturing‘ now, any of the non class specific items - electronics, engine etc. - should be examined as carefully as for any other boat. If fitted with teak decks, take a particular look at these!!!! If fitted with the Perkins Prima 50 engine, some owners are finding spare parts increasingly scarce - specifically, the marinisation bits where the engine differs from its road going cousins. The masts on the first few boats were keel stepped, but most were deck stepped. The aft cabins on the later boats offer a much bigger bunk, but very few of the boats are identical as most original owners had some input into the build. There were 57 built in total (we own No 50) before production switched to the 42 which internally, is essentially the same boat.

if your purchase goes ahead, then you may be interested to know that there is an active Bowman 40/42 WhatsApp owners group with some very experienced sailors and practical owners from the 30-odd boats represented. You’ll need a few more posts (maybe about 6 or so?) before you can use the Private Messaging option on this forum, but when you can, feel free to drop me a line and I’ll put you in touch with the group co-ordinator should you so wish.

You may not wish to disclose which boat you’re hoping to buy but if buying through the Red Ensign brokerage in Falmouth U.K. (although probably not if the boat you’re looking at is the States) a couple of the brokers there know the Bowmans well and one of them used to own a ‘40’ - only changing to buy a bigger Bowman. Even if not buying through them, it maybe worth calling to see if they’re aware of any recurring issues as I think they deal with more Bowmans than anyone.

Incidentally, there’s a Bowman 40 in the current ARC Plus and despite being one of the smaller boats, they’re very well up in the fleet.

Good luck with your survey!

Edit: I’ve just looked online and found one for sale in Maryland. If you’re looking at that one, no teak decks so that’s a bonus.

 

[Minchsailor]

I can't think of a good reason for NOT buying a Bowman 40!.

 

[Fairliedog]

Great choice! I’m not aware of any particular problems with the boat as a class, but as these boats are ‘maturing‘ now, any of the non class specific items - electronics, engine etc. - should be examined as carefully as for any other boat. If fitted with teak decks, take a particular look at these!!!! If fitted with the Perkins Prima 50 engine, some owners are finding spare parts increasingly scarce - specifically, the marinisation bits where the engine differs from its road going cousins. The masts on the first few boats were keel stepped, but most were deck stepped. The aft cabins on the later boats offer a much bigger bunk, but very few of the boats are identical as most original owners had some input into the build. There were 57 built in total before production switched to the 42 which internally, is essentially the same boat.

if your purchase goes ahead, then you may be interested to know that there is an active Bowman 40/42 WhatsApp owners group with some very experienced sailors and practical owners from the 30-odd boats represented. You’ll need a few more posts before you can use the Private Messaging option on this forum, but when you can, feel free to drop me a line and I’ll put you in touch with the group co-ordinator should you so wish.

You may not wish to disclose which boat you’re hoping to buy but if buying through the Red Ensign brokerage in Falmouth U.K. (although probably not if the boat you’re looking at is the States) a couple of the brokers there know the Bowmans well and one of them used to own a ‘40’ - only changing to buy a bigger Bowman. Even if not buying through them, it maybe worth calling to see if they’re aware of any recurring issues as I think they deal with more Bowmans than anyone.

Incidentally, there’s a Bowman 40 in the current ARC Plus and despite being one of the smaller boats, they’re very well up in the fleet.

Good luck with your survey!

Edit: I’ve just looked online and found one for sale in Maryland. If you’re looking at that one, no teak decks so that’s a bonus.

Thank you for the information and the thoughtful reply! If we end up with the boat I would certainly like to join the WhatsApp group thanks. Also YES to no teak decks. When I was growing up my parents had a ketch rigged Choy Lee with wooden masts and teak decks. Sanding and varnishing those masts and keeping up with the teak deck was an invaluable life lesson they handed to me.

 

[Goldie]

You’ll find Red Ensign brokerage at Home | Well worth giving them a call . Probably Simon or Ross would be best.

 

[Bajansailor]

If you are on Facebook, you should apply to join the Chuck Paine Yacht Designs Fan Club -
Bei Facebook anmelden

I don't know why the above link is not in English - but it is genuine, and it works.

You will have to answer a couple of questions to prove that you are genuine, but once you are 'in' there is a lot of info about Rival Bowman 40's on there - just do a search, and see what comes up.

By the way, I seem to remember that the going price for a second hand Rival Bowman 40 20+ years ago was around GBP 200k.....

 

[Fairliedog]

If you are on Facebook, you should apply to join the Chuck Paine Yacht Designs Fan Club -
Bei Facebook anmelden

I don't know why the above link is not in English - but it is genuine, and it works.

You will have to answer a couple of questions to prove that you are genuine, but once you are 'in' there is a lot of info about Rival Bowman 40's on there - just do a search, and see what comes up.

By the way, I seem to remember that the going price for a second hand Rival Bowman 40 20+ years ago was around GBP 200k.....

I am on his Page thanks. Chuck lives just up the coast a piece from us.

 

[Poecheng]

I assume you have seen this ?

 

[doug748]

I see Mervyn Wheatley got to the Azores in 8 days in this years AZAB beating a number of ostensibly faster boats and despite being singlehanded - and nearer 80 years of age than 70.
Lovely comfortable boats. Good luck with the survey.

 

[Fairliedog]

I assume you have seen this ?

I have thank you. Part of what started me down this road.

 

[doris]

By the way, I seem to remember that the going price for a second hand Rival Bowman 40 20+ years ago was around GBP 200k.....

Err, 25 years ago I tried to buy Bellamanda, a Bowman 40, but we disagreed on price. My max was £125k, the seller who was chairman of the Bowman assn. wanted £140K. The price has pretty much flat lined ever since.

 

[Bajansailor]

Err, 25 years ago I tried to buy Bellamanda, a Bowman 40, but we disagreed on price. My max was £125k, the seller who was chairman of the Bowman assn. wanted £140K. The price has pretty much flat lined ever since.

Oh dear, it must have been 30+ years ago then (time flies by too fast) - and I suppose that everybody will invariably ask a lot more than they expect to get.....

I hate to think what the cost of a new Bowman 40 would be today.

 

[Goldie]

I hate to think what the cost of a new Bowman 40 would be today.

I have the original owner’s paperwork for ours (launched Apr 1996) and applying an on line inflation tool to the price then (£250,000 including some options) the current equivalent price comes out at £491,000. However, I suspect reality would be far higher.

Makes a good Bowman 40, well maintained and updated, seem like a bargain at todays values .

 

[Fr J Hackett]

I have the original owner’s paperwork for ours (launched Apr 1996) and applying an on line inflation tool to the price then (£250,000 including some options) the current equivalent price comes out at £491,000. However, I suspect reality would be far higher.

Makes a good Bowman 40, well maintained and updated, seem like a bargain at todays values .

Looking at those available I suspect that you would end up spending the thick end of £25,000 over the purchase price to get them to an individuals liking, more perhaps if they were with teak decks. And I like them they are my sort of boat and Chuck Paine is my sort of designer. In fact I think you could end up with a figure very much like the original purchase price if you went to town.

 

[Goldie]

Looking at those available I suspect that you would end up spending the thick end of £25,000 over the purchase price to get them to an individuals liking, more perhaps if they were with teak decks. And I like them they are my sort of boat and Chuck Paine is my sort of designer. In fact I think you could end up with a figure very much like the original purchase price if you went to town.

True; like any boat the sky’s the limit on spending if you can afford it but even at £250k total expenditure, you’d have a ‘good as new’ boat for a fraction of the cost of a new equivalent - if you could find one! What does a Rustler 42 (bigger, but nearest similar/equivalent that comes to mind) cost these days? £800-£900k? Just guessing, won’t be buying!

Edit: Or selling!

 

[14K478]

First picture is the rudder of a Bowman 57 (a Holman and Pye design).

Second picture is the rudder of a Nicholson 55 (a Ray Wall design).

The two boats are practically the same size and the same age.

The Bowman is an older boat than the 40; she isn’t a Chuck Paine design and neither rudder has fallen off yet. But there is quite a difference in approach.

 

[Goldie]

We are Buying A bowman 40. Or at least we think we are pending survey next week.

How did the survey go? Are you going ahead?