Buying 2nd hand without a broker

bumblefish

bumblefish

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What are the pitfalls of buying a second hand yacht that is being sold privately? And can any one recommend a marine surveyor in Southampton, I am sure there are many but does anyone have any personal recommendations?

<hr width=100% size=1><A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.bumblefish.net>Bumblefish</A>
 
I've just brought a yacht in Southampton privately. No pitfalls as far as I am aware. Paid a 10% deposit before the survey and the balance on completion ... No Problems. As it is a fairly new boat I had a 'hull only' survey done by Peter Stapley based at Bursledon on 023 8040 7407 who provided a friendly and timely service

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Also just done the same thing myself - put a couple of thousand down and paid the rest by Bankers draft once survey and paperwork was complete.

You'll need to be confident the private seller actually owns the boat and doesn't have an outstanding mortgage or anything. Plenty of old paperwork / bills etc with the right names on and the previous bill of sale pretty much ensures the correct ownership.

If anything dealing direct with the owner was easier than going through a broker for us - the owner was there during the survey to answer the surveyors questions and also fixed a couple of minor things during the survey. We also got a very comprehensive sea trial for over 2 hours.

We used Stuart Roy for our survey - it was very comprehensive and really well presented - got an email just after the survey, a picture illustrated pdf file in the email the next evening and a hard copy with a cd full of pictures a day or so later. His website is <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.yacht-designer.co.uk>here</A>


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The RYA do a good booklet on this, called 'Buying a Second-hand Yacht'. I think the catalogue number is G21, it's only a few quid and worth every penny. I would hope that if you follow what it says you shouldn't go too far wrong.


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The RYA also have some standard downloadable sale contracts which we found very useful when selling our last boat privately.

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A friend recently bought a boat using the RYA contracts and found them equally useful. Like all contracts, they there primarily there to cover the bases and to fix things when one of the parties' views of the deal doesn't co-incide with reality: cash flow problems, bad survey results and the like. If all is above board and the condition of the boat is as it appears, then no problems should arise.

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I recently bought a boat without the help of a broker, it really wasnt as difficult as I had thought it was going to be. Sight of the bill of sale will give you previous owners names and with a bit of investigation you can find their numbers and give the a call, I found they were only too pleaseto help. I agreed a £1K deposit subject to survey with the vendor, then balance on satisfactory survey. Although I feel the survey was expensive, with haul out etc.., it was worth its every penny, spotted stress cracks and start of osmosis, wear on outdrives and it meant I could go back to the vendor with a much reduced offer. It saved me around 20% of the asking price.
I used David Hopkins on 02380 453256 he was very helpful and I would def recommend him.

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A lot of boats are sold privately without Brokers - particularly on the cheaper end of the market.

Taken carefully and sensibly - using common sense and an oredered approach ..... it is actually a painless exercise - with the added advantage of often price favourability ..... as Brokers fees don't cut into sellers margin.

ALL my boats have been bought without aid or use of brokers and I have not fallen foul of ownership / oustanding credits etc.

My way of checking is to ask for bills or other that show the boat has been in the sellers hands for a period, I like to see at its normal location .... Yacht Club etc. where it has resided in its ownership etc. Final I ask that Seller sign and date a full responsibility letter should any debts be oustanding etc. What legal redress that has - I don't know - but its gets the seller aware that YOU want a clear boat and he feels liable.

RYA forms .... never used them and don't feel the need ....

So I am lucky, I am careful in my deals, I feel confident enough to look after the deal ........ maybe I'll have a fall someday !!

Honestly ...... ask plenty questions .... last survey copy, marina / Yacht club bills / repair bills etc. etc. anything to support his ownership claim etc.

Finally - I have never paid deposit before survey and never will - I don't trust anyone with my dosh like that ..... Its agreed that I have boat checked after my inspection - and as you can appreciate - I am not allowed to survey my own boat !!! - then haggle out the findings with the seller. I don't like his final price - why risk losing your deposit ??



<hr width=100% size=1>Cheers Nigel ..... <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.geocities.com/solentlifeuk/>http://www.geocities.com/solentlifeuk/</A>
 
I bought my boat privately and we used the RYA contract. All perfectly straight forward. Deposit, survey, a bit of negotiation around the survey and then it was all done and dusted. We got to know the vendor reasonably well and he was far more helpful than if it had all been at arms length through a broker. After the sale was complete he kept finding bits and pieces at home which he would send on to me. He even remembered a spinnaker pole which I hadn't expected!

I don't think that a broker adds anything to a sale (except to the price!). You can't rely on anything they say, and they certainly won't accept responsibility for anything. I'm sure there are good ones around. I've just not come across them.

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I have done it both ways, with and without a broker. Other than as a means of advertising boats, I really can not see what use they are. I once tried to sell through a yard based broker. It was such a disaster that I nearly ended up suing him, there was so much damage to the boat from mishandling. Nor did he sell my boat, a 20 foot trailer sailer. It was in his yard for a year. I cancelled the deal, took it home and sold it for the full asking price 3 weeks later!

Never used brokers since. IMHO they are worse than Estate Agents.

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2nd hand / new

2nd hand boats ...... why use broker unless boat is outside the weekender type ..., and high value ..... then possibly so-called protections if any can be good. Lower market value boats like mine circa 10K etc. are to be honest not broker material and better prices found private.

BUt New boats need dealers and that is basically 'broker' sort of ..... then its daft to try and go direct route unless you really know what you are doing.

So small to medium boats ..... why ? Bigger and high value jobs ..... Mmmm lot of money to go and trust a guy privately !!


<hr width=100% size=1>Cheers Nigel ..... <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.geocities.com/solentlifeuk/>http://www.geocities.com/solentlifeuk/</A>
 
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