Burnham to Chichester

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ricky_s

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Hi all,

I am buying a lovely Merry Fisher 925 and plan to bring her from her current home in Burnham yacht harbour round to Chichester over the Easter weekend.

I plan to break up the journey over two to three days depending on the weather and I am looking for some guidance on what others would do, especially with regards to the Thames estuary.

Cruising speed is between 15-18 knots.

This is my fourth boat so don't need to be told about life jackets etc:)
 
Burnham to Ramsgate, Ramsgate to Eastbourne or Brighton and then on to Chichester.

Thames Estaury wise, after Whittaker at the end of the Crouch, personally, i'd cross the Sunk and then through Knob channel or Fishermans Gat... this would mean timing it right to have enough water over Sunk.... also be aware of underwater obstructions on Sunk... others will know better their current state as it isn't my normal stomping ground.... the safe option is Maplin and then Princes channel.

Once through here, its pretty straightfoward... Gull channel inside Goodwin and bob's your uncle.

I'd also suggest you treat yourself to 'crossing the Thames estuary' by Roger Gasper, often seen around this forum.... its a superb book.
 
Phoenix is correct although I personally wouldn't be using the Knob channel.

To go from the Outer Crouch (Whitaker Channel) you have to cross or go round the Sunk Sand and the Long Sand. To go round is longer (obviously) but at your boat speed more an issue of fuel costs I would have thought.

The most direct route to the North Foreland (ignoring the bravura options) is to take the well marked Whitaker Channel, head just north of the Barrow Sands before turning to run pretty much due south to the Barrow Deep and the Barrow No 6. There ahead of you is a swatchway over the South West Sunk (a personally favourite - why I don't know). Cross over the swatchway into the Black Deep and shape off across the Black Deep for the Inner Fisherman. Turn and pass through the well buoyed Fisherman's Gat (note there are a new buoy and some minor moves from this Monday - see my Notices to Mariners service) and on exiting head for the East Margate intending to leave it to starboard. From there down to the North Foreland and Ramsgate if you want to make that your first port of call (all tide and not difficult to enter).

That is approximately :D 32.47nm from the Sunken Buxey at the start of the Whitaker Channel.

Issues:

1. Crouch buoyage is dead simple since the July 2011 'upgrade'. You make encounter shipping anywhere from the Wallesea Wharf up the Outer Crouch/Whitaker Channel bringing or returning from spoil runs from the London Crossrail project - plus the odd bone or two I suppose (that should get Time Team puzzling in AD 4000 - what is a London Black Death victim doing in the mud in Wallesea?! I digress). You will be expected to makee no wash pass the works at the Wallesea Wharf. :eek: See my web site for a pdf download of the Outer Crouch buoyage and check the Notices to Mariners pages (temporary section for warnings re works in this area).

2. Going round the north east corner of the East Barrow Sands beware that there is a shallow finger extending out and a wreck. Generally it is not much of an issue and at 15 knots of little consequence to timing to give yourself room.

3. South West Sunk - there is a downloadable PDF chartlet of the swatchway as at last year (May/June) on my web site. This is an area of change. At the least you will want to come off the plane here and trundle for the mile or so across the sands. I guess you have exposed shafts/props and the sand here is PDH (pretty damn hard). I suspect if I say to have a read at http://www.eastcoastsailing.co.uk/ECS03-low.pdf (Page 22) that will put you off! I have not been able to survey that swatchway this year (others may be able to contribute) and the alternative is, instead of turning south down the side of the East Barrow Sands, to head generally towards the Barrow No 2 and cross at the Little Sunk. This area has been pretty constant. You go between the unmarked wreckage of the Little Sunk beacon and a couple of wrecks but there is ample, ample space (yachts cross diagonally here all the time plus all the Wind Farm crew boats). Last year I found not less than 3.3m at chart datum. Pick your own crossing point rather than following a wind farm boat unless you are close as I think they go quite close to the old wrecks (knowing precisely where they are).

4. If you go across the Little Sunk, head across the Black Deep and go through Foulger's Gat. There is a small thing here called the London Array Wind Farm!:D The nav buoys to Foulger's have been removed for the construction phase and have not yet and may never be replaced. But there is an avenue left for us to use. Download my image of the wind farm to see the pylon numbers to guide you. Most work on the Farm at the moment is cable burying and commissioning. Call up the Mary Ann 1 guard boat for the latest guidance of any craft to avoid. They should not warn you off and will probably be very helpful.

5. For added confidence when you are in the Barrow Deep, have a listen to Channel 69. London VTS broadcast height of tides at 4 points in the estuary at 15 minutes past and 15 minutes to the hour. It's a professional pretty clipped transmission just giving four names and four numbers. The numbers are the current height of tide over chart datum. The names will probably be Walton, Margate, Shivering Sands and Southend. Take the height for Margate and add that to the chart datum to know how much water you have at the time.

6. Expect some shipping in the Barrow Deep and the big stuff in the Black Deep. Big stuff in the Black Deep has little room for changing course so give them a satisfactory piece of room - there is plenty of room for both of you.

7. If you want to avoid crossing the Sunk Sand, having left the Whitaker Channel, turn south west into the Swin and slide down the side of Foulness and then the Maplins to the SW Barrow whence you cross the bottom end of the Barrow Deep and the Black Deep (here called the Knock John and either head along the shipping round which is the Princes Channel or take the unmarked Knob Channel in the old unmarked North Edinburgh (collect us some data if you got that way:D). In both cases join the former route by the East Margate.

8. Entering Ramsgit is straight forward; call up the Port control for permission. On entering the inner harbour, call up the marina and then find your own space. You could of course head on to Dover down the Gull Stream - I always find it's difficult to leave Dover (the weather outside somehow always looks 'ugh').

I am sure there are other things to say. I haven't said anything about tides because at an average of 15 knots this is going to take you less than 4 hours and that's assuming you will poodle past Burnham.

There - I've done myself out of another sale :) - but if you are interested I would also recommend East Coast Pilot (www.eastcoastpilot.com)

Crossing the Estuary at 15 knots? I envy you - not all the time (stick in the wood luddite) but it will be a great trip.
 
tillergirl said:
8. Entering Ramsgit is straight forward; call up the Port control for permission. On entering the inner harbour, call up the marina and then find your own space. You could of course head on to Dover down the Gull Stream - I always find it's difficult to leave Dover (the weather outside somehow always looks 'ugh').
Click to expand...

I always find Dover entrances like Lowestoft always seems to have a nasty chop regardless of wind conditions.
 
Hi Ricky s

We have done this route a few times, I would favour stopping at Dover rather than ramsgate,makes for two easy days sailing in a fast mobo,crouch to ramsgate is not that far in all but bad weather.
 
Good brief from Tillergirl. I came down from Burnham to the Solent about a year ago in a Mitchell 31. Followed much the route advised. With a cruising speed of about 12 kts made it easily to Brighton on Day 1. Useful to talk to Dover Port Control when passing the entrance. Keeps everybody happy. Make sure your charts are up to date; many of the old passages around the Thames Estuary no longer exist. Worth checking on the PLA website for NTMs and further advice before you set off; it is a busy area.
 
ricky_s said:
Looking at the forecast so for for next week
Click to expand...

Have you got heating independent of shore power or good clothing - it is going to be very cold!

Wind looks pretty settled in East to North East F3 to 5. Once round South Foreland you should get some shelter but will be on the quarter up to then - how does that affect the boat?
 
Karouise said:
Have you got heating independent of shore power or good clothing - it is going to be very cold!

Wind looks pretty settled in East to North East F3 to 5. Once round South Foreland you should get some shelter but will be on the quarter up to then - how does that affect the boat?
Click to expand...

It does have good heating so sorted there. This is a new boat to me so not sure how it will behave in this situation though it is a RCD B boat it is still going to be an "interesting" trip!
 
I'd do it in any well found 32' sailing yacht or in your new mobo, provided you know the engine is reliable, but I'd be hesitant about taking it on in a mobo with an engine I didn't know.

Tillergirl's advice is impeccable as always on crossing the estuary. While I agree that Dover is the best stopover for a 2 day trip, Ramsgit and Eastbourne serve well for a 3 day plan, even with the fiddle of locking in/out at Eastbourne. In this cold, you might fancy shorter days at sea!

Safe passage.

Peter Wright
 
Well we did the trip and it went well though we did get some big seas.

First day we went to Ramsgate and then today to Chichester with a brief fuel stop in Brighton.
 
tillergirl said:
Phoenix is correct although I personally wouldn't be using the Knob channel.

To go from the Outer Crouch (Whitaker Channel) you have to cross or go round the Sunk Sand and the Long Sand. To go round is longer (obviously) but at your boat speed more an issue of fuel costs I would have thought.

The most direct route to the North Foreland (ignoring the bravura options) is to take the well marked Whitaker Channel, head just north of the Barrow Sands before turning to run pretty much due south to the Barrow Deep and the Barrow No 6. There ahead of you is a swatchway over the South West Sunk (a personally favourite - why I don't know). Cross over the swatchway into the Black Deep and shape off across the Black Deep for the Inner Fisherman. Turn and pass through the well buoyed Fisherman's Gat (note there are a new buoy and some minor moves from this Monday - see my Notices to Mariners service) and on exiting head for the East Margate intending to leave it to starboard. From there down to the North Foreland and Ramsgate if you want to make that your first port of call (all tide and not difficult to enter).

That is approximately :D 32.47nm from the Sunken Buxey at the start of the Whitaker Channel.

Issues:

1. Crouch buoyage is dead simple since the July 2011 'upgrade'. You make encounter shipping anywhere from the Wallesea Wharf up the Outer Crouch/Whitaker Channel bringing or returning from spoil runs from the London Crossrail project - plus the odd bone or two I suppose (that should get Time Team puzzling in AD 4000 - what is a London Black Death victim doing in the mud in Wallesea?! I digress). You will be expected to makee no wash pass the works at the Wallesea Wharf. :eek: See my web site for a pdf download of the Outer Crouch buoyage and check the Notices to Mariners pages (temporary section for warnings re works in this area).

2. Going round the north east corner of the East Barrow Sands beware that there is a shallow finger extending out and a wreck. Generally it is not much of an issue and at 15 knots of little consequence to timing to give yourself room.

3. South West Sunk - there is a downloadable PDF chartlet of the swatchway as at last year (May/June) on my web site. This is an area of change. At the least you will want to come off the plane here and trundle for the mile or so across the sands. I guess you have exposed shafts/props and the sand here is PDH (pretty damn hard). I suspect if I say to have a read at http://www.eastcoastsailing.co.uk/ECS03-low.pdf (Page 22) that will put you off! I have not been able to survey that swatchway this year (others may be able to contribute) and the alternative is, instead of turning south down the side of the East Barrow Sands, to head generally towards the Barrow No 2 and cross at the Little Sunk. This area has been pretty constant. You go between the unmarked wreckage of the Little Sunk beacon and a couple of wrecks but there is ample, ample space (yachts cross diagonally here all the time plus all the Wind Farm crew boats). Last year I found not less than 3.3m at chart datum. Pick your own crossing point rather than following a wind farm boat unless you are close as I think they go quite close to the old wrecks (knowing precisely where they are).

4. If you go across the Little Sunk, head across the Black Deep and go through Foulger's Gat. There is a small thing here called the London Array Wind Farm!:D The nav buoys to Foulger's have been removed for the construction phase and have not yet and may never be replaced. But there is an avenue left for us to use. Download my image of the wind farm to see the pylon numbers to guide you. Most work on the Farm at the moment is cable burying and commissioning. Call up the Mary Ann 1 guard boat for the latest guidance of any craft to avoid. They should not warn you off and will probably be very helpful.

5. For added confidence when you are in the Barrow Deep, have a listen to Channel 69. London VTS broadcast height of tides at 4 points in the estuary at 15 minutes past and 15 minutes to the hour. It's a professional pretty clipped transmission just giving four names and four numbers. The numbers are the current height of tide over chart datum. The names will probably be Walton, Margate, Shivering Sands and Southend. Take the height for Margate and add that to the chart datum to know how much water you have at the time.

6. Expect some shipping in the Barrow Deep and the big stuff in the Black Deep. Big stuff in the Black Deep has little room for changing course so give them a satisfactory piece of room - there is plenty of room for both of you.

7. If you want to avoid crossing the Sunk Sand, having left the Whitaker Channel, turn south west into the Swin and slide down the side of Foulness and then the Maplins to the SW Barrow whence you cross the bottom end of the Barrow Deep and the Black Deep (here called the Knock John and either head along the shipping round which is the Princes Channel or take the unmarked Knob Channel in the old unmarked North Edinburgh (collect us some data if you got that way:D). In both cases join the former route by the East Margate.

8. Entering Ramsgit is straight forward; call up the Port control for permission. On entering the inner harbour, call up the marina and then find your own space. You could of course head on to Dover down the Gull Stream - I always find it's difficult to leave Dover (the weather outside somehow always looks 'ugh').

I am sure there are other things to say. I haven't said anything about tides because at an average of 15 knots this is going to take you less than 4 hours and that's assuming you will poodle past Burnham.

There - I've done myself out of another sale :) - but if you are interested I would also recommend East Coast Pilot (www.eastcoastpilot.com)

Crossing the Estuary at 15 knots? I envy you - not all the time (stick in the wood luddite) but it will be a great trip.
Click to expand...

Tillergirl, we followed your instructions to the letter and they worked out perfectly for us. The sea wasn't kind but we made it! Thanks again.
 
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