Build or finish your own yacht?

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Ex-SolentBoy

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As times become tougher financially I wonder if there might be a move to more self or self-assisted boat building.

Lots of sailors dream of having a boat specified to their own requirements, but paying a boat builder to do that is not cheap.

Some years ago my friends at Rustler bought the Bowman brand. Since then there has been very little demand for those models as new-builds despite them being desirable designs.

I was wondering whether they would be better off offering to mold the Bowman hull and coachroof, perhaps fit the bulkheads and tanks and then sell them on for home or local yard completion. By far the most expensive part of boat building is labour cost, and if you have the time, interest and expertise, you could end up with a great boat at a reduced cost.

Good idea? Bad idea?
 
In the current market, no. Hence the lack of people doing it. Sadlers were one of the better ones, now bust. And that was in better times.
If you read the threads about buying rough old boats and doing them up. Everybody agrees that it much more expensive than getting a good example of the same model.
On top, second had values for home completed boats tend to be lower too.

Seajet was trying the idea of small production of his beloved Anderson 21. The estimated cost would buy one a good 2nd hand boat in the 30ft range.
 
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I believe that a home build yacht would be probably better built (by a competant person) than one off a production line built by cheap labour.
But it would inevitably be more expensive, because an individual doesn't have the power to negotiate a discount on one of this, and one of those via mail order.
I would dearly like to build an S&S 34 from scratch, just how I want it.
 
aitchem said:
I believe that a home build yacht would be probably better built (by a competant person) than one off a production line built by cheap labour.
But it would inevitably be more expensive, because an individual doesn't have the power to negotiate a discount on one of this, and one of those via mail order.
I would dearly like to build an S&S 34 from scratch, just how I want it.
Click to expand...

the old rule of thumb
1/3 hull purchase
1/3 fitting-out,rig engine, sails
1/3 saving over the retail price of the completed boat

I helped an owner fit-out an SS 34 ( Red Rag )way back in 75/76 it took us about 15 months part time. she was last heard of in Canada & Caribbean
 
Well as you know Rustler used to sell ( prob still do) the R36 as partkit and sold quite a few.
The great thing about a boat that has had such a long production run though ( like the above) is that the positioning and detailing and proportion of everything is, imo , well, impeccable.
It is very difficult indeed to get it right for what would essentially be a one off, each time. Unless the builder were to provide some very good drawing indeed_ do such exist I wonder?
Having wrote that, I used to work with a chap who fitted out quite a few Co32s in a barn and (again IMO) they were as good as the Rogers fitted ones.
Not sure how the Euro directives now affect fit out values and resale after(5 is it?) years.
One suggestion for Rustlers might be to drag the old boys out of retirement and offer a 'Pay em direct" service to anyone contemplating organising their own Bowman.
 
Blueboatman said:
Well as you know Rustler used to sell ( prob still do) the R36 as partkit and sold quite a few.
The great thing about a boat that has had such a long production run though ( like the above) is that the positioning and detailing and proportion of everything is, imo , well, impeccable.
It is very difficult indeed to get it right for what would essentially be a one off, each time. Unless the builder were to provide some very good drawing indeed_ do such exist I wonder?
Having wrote that, I used to work with a chap who fitted out quite a few Co32s in a barn and (again IMO) they were as good as the Rogers fitted ones.
Not sure how the Euro directives now affect fit out values and resale after(5 is it?) years.
One suggestion for Rustlers might be to drag the old boys out of retirement and offer a 'Pay em direct" service to anyone contemplating organising their own Bowman.
Click to expand...

Yes, I recall the home built Rustlers. Quality varied considerably as you can imagine. Rustler will no longer sell a Rustler hull for owner finish as they have decided (correctly in my view) that they want to control that brand.

Bowman is different though. There are still some ex-Bowman employees around and they love to get involved. I do know of one that was built by them around the time of the Rustler acquisition and it is stunning.
 
I think the reason we won't see many people building their own is the same reason we don't see many people making their own furniture or clothing anymore. Rather than a lack of skill, knowledge or time, I think it simply comes down to the fact that there isn't a saving in doing so. In the "good old days" materials were cheap and finished items were expensive. These days, finished items are cheap (if not such high quality) and materials are extortionate (in part because of low demand).
You can argue that you'd end up with better quality but I just don't think the majority of people are bothered enough for that to change anything. Everyone would like the quality, of course, but not at the cost of money, time or effort.
 
I turned down the offer of a ride to the Caribbean on a Bowman 42, it was a very lovely and 'sorted' boat..( But I wanted to go on my own, as ya do).

Had a cuppa on a Bowman40 this year, ex R36 owner, which refreshed my memories. Its a great layout in and out.

The theory was you bought the hull and a rig, plonked an engine in and some tools and sailed away to the land of teak forests, dollar beach bars and dusky mulatto maidens. Ah, that would be the hiccup right there:)
 
There may well be savings over a yard built boat of the same design - however the reason such boats are not now made is because they are just too expensive, so even with a 10 or 20% "saving", they would still be too expensive.

Even leaving aside the practicalities of managing (and doing) a project of this size, the time it takes and the hassle of getting a CE mark if you want it to be saleable, there is just so much choice on the market that if you want to go cruising rather than boat building you can do it more quickly and cheaply buying an existing boat.

The heyday of the kit building activity was when the only secondhand boats were mainly old, worn out, old fashioned designs - and very few of them compared with the potential demand. GRP hulls up to around 30 foot provided a good basis for DIY projects - reasonable to complete in a year or two and with a whole industry to support you for materials and components.

Those days have gone forever - although there is a 1970s Trident Voyager kit for sale near us - never been touched since it left the factory. However, even at the giveaway price for kit completed cost is likely to be between 2 and 3 times the market value of a good used one.
 
I was quite surprised when I learned that Cherry Ripe was fitted out by her first owner, who bought the hull and deck mouldings from Rival and fitted her out himself. The differences are quite subtle and I'm sure it must have beeen considerably cheaper as well as being a thoroughly enjoyable project.
 
I think times have changed too much, RCD rears its ugly head, in todays society I doubt it's acceptable to boat build in the garden and the type of people who own Bowmans are unlikely to want a DIY version.
 
Origami boats steel or aluminium

Most build it yourself sailboats here are now built using

the origami

process

A steel or aluminium hull is welded together flat

then using a come a long is pulled into shape and the deck welded on.

Often to decrease the chance of engine flooding the diesel exhaust is raw hot exhaust is up then vented under water at the transom.

Airtight and main hatch is aluminium and gasketed all around.

Perhaps Google Breng Swain for an photos.....

or Yahoo group origami steel boats
 
If you can afford the time to spend 1.5 years or more working full time on fitting out a boat then you can afford to buy one off the shelf.

If you want to do it over a period of 5 years, as some have done then it's a labour of sheer love, let alone lunacy and you can write off the extra value you put in in terms of time and extra material quality.

Add to this that 'homebuilt' kills value because insurance companies don't give a to$$ if you are Noah himself in terms of carpentry skills. The same with potential buyers who will respond with the traditional sucking of breath through the teeth in response to even the most craftsman finished vessel.

As has been said already, todays market has killed the self build industry except for a very dedicated core few.

We are doomed to a continuous erosion of everything different or personalised. Everything is becoming standardised, factory produced and throw away and woe betide the poor individual who wants to do their own thing!
 
Re-building

Re-build is another option but time/money and skills need to be on your side!
My before and After pics enclosed.
 
Buying a boat

A said second hand is cheapest quickest with or without refurbishment.
Some people of course want to build a boat. Here again as said the best option is to buy hull and mouldings of a recognised and desirable type. Around here I think the fact that it was self finished is not a great concern regarding price compared to actual condition and boat type. I feel sure your friend would sell parts to any finished degree in exchange for cash. Certainly self finish was common in the boat building heyday here 30 years ago. Those boats are still being bought and sold.
The least cost effective with poorest resale value is self built from own or obscure design. We don't however have the EU directives to be concerned about. olewill
 
Here is a good example of a self built boat.

It's ferrocement and even the hull was "home" built.
Just about every bit that it is possible to make oneself is home made. Sails as well!

Building started mid 1980s I think and it was launched several years ago. The owner is still working on it but it has I think left the jetty for one short trip down the harbour and back.

Gregsboat2reduced.jpg
 
SolentBoy said:
I was wondering whether they would be better off offering to mold the Bowman hull and coachroof, perhaps fit the bulkheads and tanks and then sell them on for home or local yard completion. By far the most expensive part of boat building is labour cost, and if you have the time, interest and expertise, you could end up with a great boat at a reduced cost.

Good idea? Bad idea?
Click to expand...
Are you also looking at what was called the 'sailaway'. able to be sailed but needed finishing below ?
 
Are you also looking at what was called the 'sailaway'. able to be sailed but needed finishing below ?
Click to expand...

agree with your point ,but i m afraid that i can do well in that job !:D
maybe should learn more !

g.gif
 
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