Bottle/Rigging Screws or Turnbuckles

BobE

BobE

Well-Known Member
Joined
15 Jan 2002
Messages
599
Location
Hampshire (West)
Visit site
Just about to renew my 1 x 19 standing rigging..
My adjusters (see Heading) and toggles, as far as I can see, look fine to me..
What should I really be looking look for?
Or should they be automatically replaced at the same time?
The screws add about £125 to the £630 Rig cost ( inc Vat @15%)

Cheers Bob E....
 
i personally would not change the bottle screws if they look in good condition. Unless your planning to cross oceans or race a lot where the loading could be much higher than cruising. you need to look very carefully in good light and with a eye Lupe / magnifying glass for cracks. also make sure the clevis pins are not worn / damaged. you could find some one to do dye penetrative testing on them probably not cost more than £50 if you were in any doubt. Search for NDT specialists in your area on the net.
 
Agree with Alex only you could do the dye pen test yourself even cheaper as it is not rocket science.
Find a local engineering supplies firm and ask for a dye penatrant kit (3 spray cans, cleaner, red dye, developer)
Clean your turnbuckles yourself as clean as possible and free from dirt.
Spray turnbuckle with the 'cleaner' spray can, and allow to dry.
Spray turnbuckle with 'Red dye' spray can, and allow to dry.
Spray turnbuckle with 'White Developer' spray can, and allow to dry.
Inspect turnbuckle carefully as any cracks will show as 'red' lines through the top white developer.
If any cracks found dump turnbuckle!
Hope this helps
Regards
Mike
 
I'm sorry, but have to throw in an ounce of disagreement. I have two thoughts on this ....

The first is insurance driven - ask your insurers who will probably come up with what seems to be the standard evry 10 years renewal, and ask them what they think. I suspect, but stand to be corrected, that they will say they should be renewed.

The second is that my understanding is that stainless steel , when it fails, does so suddenly. A visible crack could of course imply imminent failure, however, due to its nature, the lack of any visible crack (or as detected by NDT or otherwise) does not mean that the item in question may not fail anyway.

For peace of mind, I would definitely replace the rigging screws/turnbuckles/bottle screws at the same time as the wire. £125 over 10 years sounds cheap for peace of mind.
 
Thanks
I'll be considering but any savings are worth it but, of course, only if I'm sure the screws are OK..
Can no longer do a couple of hours Overtime to recoupe the expense!!!

BTW seem to recollect that there was some talk of Bronze turnbuckles being better than S/S anyone know??
I cannot find it in a forum search..

Cheers Bob E....
 
<<< The second is that my understanding is that stainless steel , when it fails, does so suddenly. A visible crack could of course imply imminent failure, however, due to its nature, the lack of any visible crack (or as detected by NDT or otherwise) does not mean that the item in question may not fail anyway. >>

Sorry, this is a yachtie myth. Stainless steel does not fail without warning, does not have a lower fatigue limit than other steels and is perfectly reliable. Every critical piece of steel in an LNG plant is made from austenitic stainless steel. Every gas turbine/jet engine compressor section is made from ferritic stainless steel. Almost all instrument, hydraulic and special purpose tubing on offshore platforms, refineries, chemical works is made from austenitic stainless steel. Not the mark of an unreliable material, I think you will agree?
 
[ QUOTE ]
£125 over 10 years sounds cheap for peace of mind.

[/ QUOTE ] Ah! but what you haven't put into the equation is that Bob might not have the ten years left in him!
/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
If you think that the s/s bottle screws might fail, why stop there? The U bolts on the deck should also be considered /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

I think that two standards should be applied:
- Those that race
- Those that cruse and don't put out in a F6
For racers maybe you are right.
 
Being able to retain the bottle screws would sugggest you are terminating the shrouds with thimble eyes. Many suggest that for 1/19 wire this is not the best solution as it distorts and thus weakens the wire. Rool swaged terminations are considered safer.

Personally I would look for sensible professional advice rather than forum opinion, after all no one here but you will pick up the tab for your mast coming down, especially if your insurers don't pay up because you reused some of the kit.

At the end of the day it is your money, your mast and your boat, so your choice
 
I was told, when I replaced my standing rigging a few years back, that the SS Bottlescrews could be more difficult to adjust as the SS thread to thread joint would bind. Where as a SS thread to Bronze thread is less likely to. I don't know if its true or not. I have certainly seen SS faces (between nuts and washers) where there has been evidence of abrasion I wouldn't have expected (tears and scratches) which makes me think the explanation carries some weight.

Jeff.
 
How old are the bottlescrews? Were they changed last time the rigging was renewed?

If not, or you do not know, I would change them and make sure you get the decent quality ones.
 
[ QUOTE ]
The U bolts on the deck should also be considered

[/ QUOTE ] Not only considered but removed and inspected for signs of crevice corrosion where they pass though the deck!

AND not only U bolts but the fastenings for other critical fittings.

Make sure when replacing/renewing that they are fully sealed so that no crevice exits for water to creep into.
 
Yes, that's one of the disadvantages of stainless steel fastenings. It's called galling, the tendency for adjacent stainless parts under load to weld themselves together. EP lubricants, like molybdenum disulphide, can help to prevent it. I had to scrap a babystay about fopur years ago when the bottle screw became impossible to move. Bronze doesn't suffer this problem.
 
You said it Nigel how true
The only reason I'm changing what seems to me fine, is that the insurers want a survey and all the riggers say you have to change the standing stuff every 10 years ( the surveyor is of like mind) I guess the rig is circa 97 or 8
I'm aiming for the Scillies this year, setting off planned for 2 July.. Anyone like to sail in loose (Don't take that the wrong way) company??
Cheers Bob E...
 
At the end of the day it is your choice, can any one say whether your bottle screws will definitely last another season, I suspect not. I would suggest the chance of failure will be less if they are replaced. The reason insurers have the 10 year 'rule' is clearly that it costs them more if boats keep older rigging. Now if the risk to them (bearing in mind this to them is just money) is unacceptable, perhaps you need to think about the risk to yourself, bearing in mind this may cover more than just money.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page

Top