Boats with centrally mounted anchor chain lockers

[Ric]

Several expedition yachts like Garcia Adventure 45 or Boreal yachts have their anchor lockers mounted amidships with the chain running through an aluminium tube to the bow. Clearly this has the advantage of removing weight from the bow, particularly given the large amount of chain these sort of yachts are likely to carry.

Has anybody had a chance to see this system in action? How does the anchor locker drain? Into the bilge?

 

[jwilson]

Sometimes into the bilge, or the locker can have it's own sump and pump. I've seen this on lots of yachts ranging from wooden classics through little Italian GRP (Comet) 24-footers to steel and alloy long-distance boats. In every way except when draining to the bilge it's an excellent idea. The more chain you have the less you want it up at the bow.

 

[vyv_cox]

A system like this needs a long fall to the anchor locker to avoid chain piling. I had a boat with a tube from the deck into the locker, which in that case was immediately below the deck. There was no lid on deck. It always needed someone below to distribute the chain around the locker

 

[prv]

A system like this needs a long fall to the anchor locker to avoid chain piling.

Indeed, but it's a lot easier to arrange that fall when the locker is in the bottom of the deepest part of the hull, rather than tucked up under the tip of the foredeck AWB style to leave room for the foot of the forepeak berth underneath.

Pete

 

[noelex]

It generally works very well. It is more needed on boats like the Garcia and Boreal because the unballasted swing keel demands other weight be placed as low as possible.

The drawbacks are that a pump is needed to empty out the water and with mud weed etc this harsh environment for any pump. Secondly mud etc tends to accumulate more (it does not get washed out because the locker floor is below the water line) and any associated smell is in the central part of the boat. In practice these problems are only minor. The Garcia has large hatch in forward head to enable access to the chain locker.

For a non lifting keel boat I think the ideal is to bring the chain further back, but keeping the chain locker above the waterline.

The forward section can becomes a bow storage area for fenders etc. This keeps the bow area lighter, introduces a collision bulkhead 1.5-2 m behind the bow and allows for wider forward berth. Unfortunately this idea is only applicable on reasonably large yachts.

As an alternative the chain can be led along the side decks to a locker above the waterline say around the rear of the V berth. The weight is placed on one side, but is compensated by adding heavier structures on the opposite side during the design of the boat. Many of the Dashew designs use one or both of these ideas.

Good anchoring gear is essential on cruising boat. Chain is heavy and it is a pity more boats don't incorporate some of the ideas.

The chain locker on the Garcia Exploration 45:

 

[Ric]

It generally works very well. It is more needed on boats like the Garcia and Boreal because the unballasted swing keel demands other weight be placed as low as possible.

The drawbacks are that a pump is needed to empty out the water and with mud weed etc this harsh environment for any pump. Secondly mud etc tends to accumulate more (it does not get washed out because the locker floor is below the water line) and any associated smell is in the central part of the boat. In practice these problems are only minor. The Garcia has large hatch in forward head to enable access to the chain locker.

For a non lifting keel boat I think the ideal is to bring the chain further back, but keeping the chain locker above the waterline.

The forward section can becomes a bow storage area for fenders etc. This keeps the bow area lighter, introduces a collision bulkhead 1.5-2 m behind the bow and allows for wider forward berth. Unfortunately this idea is only applicable on reasonably large yachts.

As an alternative the chain can be led along the side decks to a locker above the waterline say around the rear of the V berth. The weight is placed on one side, but is compensated by adding heavier structures on the opposite side during the design of the boat. Many of the Dashew designs use one or both of these ideas.

Good anchoring gear is essential on cruising boat. Chain is heavy and it is a pity more boats don't incorporate some of the ideas.

The chain locker on the Garcia Exploration 45:

I did wonder about all the mud and weed that will end up in the chain locker. I would think it a good idea to install a good anchor-washing system at the bow, maybe getting it up to double also as a deck wash pump.

What diameter tube does the Garcia use? Does it protrude into the fore-cabin headroom?

 

[Resolution]

Are chain and rope the only materials that could be used? I have sometimes wondered if, after a short length of chain to help set the anchor, one could not then have some sort of wire being wound onto one of these spools driven by an electric motor. The sort that superyachts have for control of the running rigging. Of course the Swedes do it very successfully from behind with their ankoralina tape spools.

 

[noelex]

I am not sure of the tube diameter and I don't think I have a photo.

The headroom is not restricted because the aluminium construction means there are already reasonably deep stringers below the 4mm aluminium deck. 75mm of insulation is added between the stringers on the deck (and hull above the waterline) to produce great thermal and acoustic isolation. The tube is just incorporated into the structure like a another stringer.

This is a photo I took of the central anchor winch on the Garcia Exploration. This was an unfinished yacht hence the mess and lack of covers on tne under deck lines.

 

[noelex]

Are chain and rope the only materials that could be used? I have sometimes wondered if, after a short length of chain to help set the anchor, one could not then have some sort of wire being wound onto one of these spools driven by an electric motor.

Wire is sometimes used on commercial boats but it more difficult to handle and for the same strength there are not great weight savings.

Hi tensile G7 chain is an option that typically allows the chain size to be reduced by one step over the more typical G3 or G4, but there is still a lot of weight especially when you carry 100m + which is desirable for some of the worlds deeper anchorages. People focus on anchor weight because that is the part you can see, but for a cruising boat using all chain the rode weight is more significant.

Dyneema is possible option that seems to have been used very little. It has virtually no weight or corrosion. With some simple adaptation it could made slightly sinking. It is reasonably UV resistant. It has better abrasion resistance than other lines, but it still more vulnerable to chafe than chain. You also need to transition between the rope and chain during retrieval. So chain, and ideally lots of it, remains king for cruising.

 

[prv]

Are chain and rope the only materials that could be used? I have sometimes wondered if, after a short length of chain to help set the anchor, one could not then have some sort of wire being wound onto one of these spools driven by an electric motor.

One of Uffa Fox's books from the 1930s describes exactly this, I think it was on Landfall. The winch drum was below decks in the focsle and covered by a table.

Made sense back then when a rope rode would have been hemp, so much larger than the same strength wire and subject to rot. Nowadays I don't think there would be any advantage to using wire over dyneema or some other appropriate high-tech fibre. I would still choose chain for a cruising boat.

Pete

 

[noelex]

This is the alternative approach on a Bestevaer yacht. The chain locker is mounted above the waterline so it drains normally, but a long way back from the bow.

You can just see the anchor locker drain holes in this photo a good couple of metres behind the bow.

 

[noelex]

This is what it looks like from the inside on the Bestevaer. You can see part of the chain locker in the bottom left of my photo, much further back than is normal.

 

[Boo2]

Several expedition yachts like Garcia Adventure 45 or Boreal yachts have their anchor lockers mounted amidships with the chain running through an aluminium tube to the bow. Clearly this has the advantage of removing weight from the bow, particularly given the large amount of chain these sort of yachts are likely to carry.

Has anybody had a chance to see this system in action? How does the anchor locker drain? Into the bilge?

Hi Ric,

I have converted my boat to a system like that but I don't use a tube between the bow and amidships locker, the chain runs on the deck from bow to windlass, turning via a side deck roller. The chain locker is converted from a hanging locker amidships opposite the heads. There's some "before" pix on my thread here : http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?350619-Chain-locker-question&highlight=chain but unfortunately I don't have any "after" pix to hand. I may try to post some after the weekend if I can get up to the boat, will add them to my original thread if so.

Drainage is via a hose through into the locker under the forepeak berth but it doesn't drain there: a manual diaphragm bilge pump is mounted in said locker which is connected to a hose allowing pump out into a bucket or through the deck hatch overboard.

The fall is quite good being around 3 feet or so and the windlass is fitted on the side deck directly above the chain locker so should give no problems. It's convenient for access to the windlass electronics too.

As to how well it works in operation, that's still to be seen. I'm hopeful it will be OK...

Boo2

 

[dovekie]

Like Boo2, we have this system, which we installed on a 38ft GRP 1970s boat. We've used it 15 seasons or so now, and are delighted. The chain simply runs back across the foredeck, to the manual windlass, which is sited over an ex-hanging locker, where I strengthened the deck. We have 60 m of chain. It stows and deploys without ever jamming, touch-wood. The fall inside the locker is about 5 feet. The locker is lined with a waterproof bag of heavy butyl rubber (pondliner) with a drain at the low point which I pump out each season. Generally 2-3 litres in there, we anchor most of the time so I guess we get 100ml of water in the locker each time. We are careful to clean the chain as it comes aboard.

Good things
The weight is much further aft and much lower
We get more wrap of the chain round the gypsy
Never have to worry about the stowing
Could have more chain if I could afford it

Bad things
Having to clean muddy chain as it come in, or else clean mud out of the locker lining
Can't see the anchor/chain direction from the windlass
Lost a hanging locker
Could have more chain if I could afford it!

Several expedition yachts like Garcia Adventure 45 or Boreal yachts have their anchor lockers mounted amidships with the chain running through an aluminium tube to the bow. Clearly this has the advantage of removing weight from the bow, particularly given the large amount of chain these sort of yachts are likely to carry.

Has anybody had a chance to see this system in action? How does the anchor locker drain? Into the bilge?

 

[Dockhead]

Don't forget the Sundeer and various other Dashew designs, which also have this feature. The Sundeer has also the windlass located near the mast base. Fantastic feature; amazing so few yachts have this. I'm just about to amputate 40 metres of my chain in order to get some weight out of the bows :banghead:

 

[reeac]

I can see the merits in reducing weight in the bows in terms of reduced moment of inertia for pitching motions in heavy seas but how big an effect is this in practice ? I've always thought that the traditional slanting stem must give added buoyancy when the bows plunge into a wave when compared with current vertical stem lines (apart from looking so much more graceful).