Boat Show 2025

[Boathook]

Walking along the crouch sea wall this weekend you ciuld barely see a yacht's sails. Talking to local brokers, as im trying to sell my old boat, and they were comparing the market to Cleese's parrot.

You see it in this forum. It was oldish when i started using it in the '00s, now it is positively geriatric for the remaing users.

I'm trying to buy a cat. Slightly restricted due to the berth size I have (9.5m by 4.5m). Looked at a couple so far. One nice but hull full of osmosis and issues with stub keel to hull attachment. I know osmosis hasn't sunk a boat yet but the surveyor reckoned a good year to dry out once the copper coat (10 years old so at end of life) has been removed and then all the work to fill and fare the hull.
Another looked tired but seemed ok. A previous possible purchaser had a survey done and didn't buy. I was allowed to view the survey and have basically walked away. I told the broker that I thought it was a project boat. Majority of the jobs minor ones, but all added together meant to much work and money, even with me doing the majority of the work. I gave up with ball park costing when I approached £15K on top of the purchase price !

 

[benjenbav]

You're right. I had to Google that and there is a very significant difference if you measure the islands as well.
Great Britain:
Total Coastline:
31,368 km (19,491 miles).
Mainland Coastline:
Approximately 17,819 km (11,073 miles).
Factors:
The significant length includes the coastlines of numerous islands within Great Britain, like those of Scotland and the islands of England and Wales.
France:
Coastline:
4,853 km (3,015 miles).
Factors:
France has a much more geometrically efficient, compact mainland shape with fewer external islands, resulting in a shorter total coastline.

Not to mention that a significant proportion of France’s borders are inland.

 

[ylop]

My main point is that the uk market for yachts started it's decline around 25 ywars ago and is now dead, in my view, certainly outside the solent.

Thats a bit like saying there UK banking sector is dead certainly outside London. It is nonsensical to exclude the epi-centre of UK sailing from statements about the UK yacht market, especially on a thread about the boat show based in the Solent! It also completely ignores the fact that there are other hotspots for sailing around the UK - they just aren't evenly distributed.

Walking along the crouch sea wall this weekend you ciuld barely see a yacht's sails.

Not sure what the weather was like it the SE but for many it was probably end of season and grim weather? Personally if I lived in Essex I probably wouldn't keep a boat on the Crouch anyway - modern travel has made it much easier to go elsewhere.

You see it in this forum. It was oldish when i started using it in the '00s, now it is positively geriatric for the remaing users.

All forums are full of old duffers who don't like modern platforms! Its a self-selecting bias.
I don't buy the idea that the market has disappeared - it's evolved. It might have evolved differently from France - but actually that is not surprising go round any coastline and you'll see that fishing boats are all slightly different with features that work better in local areas there's no reason why sailing boats should be any different - a swim platform is more important in the med, a pilot house more useful in the baltic, somewhere comfortable to sleep more relevant if the boat is further from home, etc.

What does seem less likely in the current financial climate is younger people having enough spare cash to buy and maintain a boat - but younger people will spend money on experiences (have you seen what a concert ticket costs?) and ownership of assets is less important to them. I would be surprised if wandering round SIBS there wasn't evidence of alternative approaches to getting on the water which didn't exist last century.

 

[wonkywinch]

.. I would be surprised if wandering round SIBS there wasn't evidence of alternative approaches to getting on the water which didn't exist last century.

Eg, Flexisail, Pure Latitude, Trafalgar, Fairview, Solent Boat Club, Agapi, Lymington Boat Club, Shackles Ships just to name just a few of the time share operators that have popped up in the last decade or so where you can sail without the capital outlay.

I know Parker Adams are looking at further developing and updating the model with Flexisail.

 

[dunedin]

Clearly sailing participation has reduced everywhere but france still has a vibrant sailing industry with dozens of yacht types that nobody in the uk has heard of.

Walking round my marina there and it is full of new boats.

My main point is that the uk market for yachts started it's decline around 25 ywars ago and is now dead, in my view, certainly outside the solent.

Walking along the crouch sea wall this weekend you ciuld barely see a yacht's sails. Talking to local brokers, as im trying to sell my old boat, and they were comparing the market to Cleese's parrot.

You see it in this forum. It was oldish when i started using it in the '00s, now it is positively geriatric for the remaing users.

That a very personal opinion and not necessarily based on any objective facts. Rather than a “25 year” decline, most of the UK experienced a huge (and insustainable) boom in boat buying, both old and new, around Covid times. Most marinas and boat yards suddenly were full to capacity.
Of course, a few years later and the realities of boat owning, plus the boom in motor homes and a few poor summers, and a lot of people have been trying to offload these boats. Hence the reversal of the boom market of the Covid bubble.
Plenty of boats out and about on the Clyde last week. And the marina was so full there were no berths available when I relaunched.

 

[newtothis]

Not to mention that a significant proportion of France’s borders are inland.

But it also has departments in the Pacific and Caribbean, which add significantly to its sailing regions.

 

[newtothis]

What "smaller coastline"?
The UK probably has more coastline than France #, though our population is much more concentrated in one corner.

# There is of course in theory no definitive measure of coastline

Smaller coastline attractive for sailing.

 

[potentillaCO32]

That a very personal opinion and not necessarily

That a very personal opinion and not necessarily based on any objective facts. Rather than a “25 year” decline, most of the UK experienced a huge (and insustainable) boom in boat buying

It is of course a completely personal opinion based on my observations.

However, i think it would be fairly easy to do an assesment of the uk sailing industry that i believe would back up my subjective feeling.
How many uk based yacht manufacturers exist now compared to the 80s, 90s and 00s? There has been a steady decline and the numbers would be significant.

As a one time yacht importer we did look closely at boat show attendance figures of from the time of earl's court to the closure of the excel show. That showed a linear decline.

The bubble in covid was exactly that, a bubble. Ask any uk dealer how they see the market.

 

[E39mad]

However, i think it would be fairly easy to do an assesment of the uk sailing industry that i believe would back up my subjective feeling.
How many uk based yacht manufacturers exist now compared to the 80s, 90s and 00s? There has been a steady decline and the numbers would be significant.

Yes virtually no UK boat builders remaining. Can think of Oyster, Southerly, Rustler, Spirit and Swallow Yachts - probably a couple more out there.

But we have lost amongst many others: British Hunter, British Moody, Westerly, Sigma, Sadler, Vancouver, Fisher, MG Yachts, Tradewind, Trapper, Mirage, Leisure, Parker, Prout, Discovery, Seastream, Sovereign

 

[RunAgroundHard]

Last weekend, Sound of Jura, Forth off Lorn saw many yachts sailing about. I think this year has been a noticeably busy year for sailing. This of course may be a dead cat bounce as the last of the boomers and the first of the Gen Xs start to retire and spend their wealth. Despite all the gloom and doom around the young, I think the Gen Xers kids are doing just fine in the job market. Maybe it will translate to continued sailing and boat ownership.

The decline of UK manufacturing is well documented and not surprising as we transitioned to a service orientated market. Lots of decent boat builders in the EU still exist to supply UK markets.

 

[Mark-1]

Southerly

I had no idea they had started up again. Apparently Concept Yachts bought the brand in 2023 and build in Marchwood. Good news IMHO.

In general we should probably remember that a decline in yacht ownership does not correlate to a decline in yachting because more people are chartering abroad than ever before, and people are still chartering in UK waters. We're more mobile and that means we're not limited to sailing within an hour of our front door the way we perhaps were in the days of points ignition, cars that rusted and an absence of budget airlines.

 

[flaming]

I had no idea they had started up again. Apparently Concept Yachts bought the brand in 2023 and build in Marchwood. Good news IMHO.

In general we should probably remember that a decline in yacht ownership does not correlate to a decline in yachting because more people are chartering abroad than ever before, and people are still chartering in UK waters. We're more mobile and that means we're not limited to sailing within an hour of our front door the way we perhaps were in the days of points ignition, cars that rusted and an absence of budget airlines.

A decline in new yacht sales does not necessarily imply fewer people on the water either.

 

[dunedin]

Smaller coastline attractive for sailing.

Huge areas of the UK coastline are very attractive for sailing - fortunately most are a fair way away from London

 

[ylop]

How many uk based yacht manufacturers exist now compared to the 80s, 90s and 00s? There has been a steady decline and the numbers would be significant.

Very few. But then there are very few UK car manufacturers and virtually no phone or computer makers but the market for those products are all booming as far as I can see? I suspect even if you go to france there will have been consolidation and there are fewer yacht brands there too - its just they have some very big ones?

As a one time yacht importer we did look closely at boat show attendance figures of from the time of earl's court to the closure of the excel show. That showed a linear decline.

I remain convinced that show attendance is a very poor indicator of a market's health. Across all industries the world has moved on from going to shows to see new products: Youtube etc mean a video review can take me round any new boat without leaving my sofa, low cost flights mean I can go to a demonstration day/weekend for the same cost as getting to the show, etc.

 

[dunedin]

It is of course a completely personal opinion based on my observations.

However, i think it would be fairly easy to do an assesment of the uk sailing industry that i believe would back up my subjective feeling.
How many uk based yacht manufacturers exist now compared to the 80s, 90s and 00s? There has been a steady decline and the numbers would be significant.

As a one time yacht importer we did look closely at boat show attendance figures of from the time of earl's court to the closure of the excel show. That showed a linear decline.

The bubble in covid was exactly that, a bubble. Ask any uk dealer how they see the market.

You are now introducing things not in your original comment - and bundling things that are very different.
UK Boat building has certainly and regrettably collapsed (other than a few niche areas such as RS dinghies, Oyster, Princess etc)
But boat building is very differnt from the boat usage you referred to in your original comments. Not least as most new yachts have been imported from the EU for decades, plus boats last a long time.
And whilst Covid was, as I said, an unsustainable bubble, it was a huge peak in demand that makes any suggestion of a 25 year trend meaningless.

 

[benjenbav]

But it also has departments in the Pacific and Caribbean, which add significantly to its sailing regions.

Hmm… I see your French Departements and raise you the British Commonwealth…

 

[lustyd]

Huge areas of the UK coastline are very attractive for sailing - fortunately most are a fair way away from London

I’d argue the best sailing is the opposite end of the island. Now I’ve been up there the Solent looks like a little practice area

 

[newtothis]

Hmm… I see your French Departements and raise you the British Commonwealth…

Departments are considered part of mainland France. Coming from a British Commonwealth country, I can confidently say that they don't even think about being part of the UK.

 

[dunedin]

Departments are considered part of mainland France. Coming from a British Commonwealth country, I can confidently say that they don't even think about being part of the UK.

You have now diverted further with a rather odd view of “mainland” - that can ignore thousands of miles of intervening water!

 

[newtothis]

You have now diverted further with a rather odd view of “mainland” - that can ignore thousands of miles of intervening water!

Take it up with the French; I don't make the rules.